dog etiquette on Peckham Rye

[Huggers]

Oh God, I knew someone reactionary would suggest this. Exactly what we want to avoid.

Why? Why would there no longer be a problem having them in the banned areas? People who don't read the signs arent going to read yours either.

Also, please think this through....the density of dogs in these so-called allocated areas.

As we have all said, Peckham Rye is a peacable place-why would the answer to keeping the garden/picnic on-lead be keeping the whole park on lead?

Between october and April we are just about the only people out there anyway. Your people areas will be completely empty...except for the truants and the vandals.

We are not the states. We don't declaw our cats over here either.

[first mate]

Huggers agreed. I say again, the solution is Wardens empowered to issue on the spot fines etc.. to miscreants. Those of us who are regular dog walker know darn well that certain powers that be would love to institute dog control orders across all Southwark Parks, so let's not give them the ammunition. The law abiding dog owner, just like the law abiding car owner, takes care and is sensitive to others, let's concentrate our efforts on the criminal/irresponsible minority rather than holding the decent majority to ransom.

I would add to this that Parks are not the only area that problem dog owners are to be found. There are offlead dogs, often with dodgy owners, that are allowed to roam the streets. Our dogs, our pets and little people are just as at risk from these as in the park. Whilst I do not believe there is direct legislation covering this, it is my understanding that people are not allowed to cross the road with a dog off lead, so again, wardens and police could issue fines if they see this.

[Huggers]

edited because I am even boring myself now.

[Mscrawthew]

Hi Huggers

As I said before, There will always be ignorant people who disregard other people space, The Rye is more than big enough to have a large area just for dogs who, like you say mostly plod along and have no problems with others. Goose Green is a far smaller area and is used by quite a few dog lovers without major problems apart from again the ignorant who think they are to good to pick up after their animals. I am not saying this would mean all dogs would have to be on lead all of the time and totally argee that although the area`s for people are empty through the colder months, The Childrens play area and the picnic section and other sections should be kept dog free and if there was a large dedicated area for dogs to free run then they would be more unlikely to use the dog free area`s.

It would also ensure that in the summer months when everyone uses the space that the amount of dog feces that is left behind (By all class of resident) would be in a concentrated area rather than spread all over which isn`t nice for anyone. Of coure there will always be a small percentage who will disregard any thought for other`s. As for De-clawing cats, No we are not the states but unfortunately also not the animal loving nation that we like to think we are.

[Mscrawthew]

daizie Wrote:

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> Hit scum where it hurts , the pocket :)

Sadly daizie, The type of person who will turn a dog into a weapon will just about put their hand in their pocket to feed them let alone buy a dog licience. Dogs are not neutered, innoculated, socialised, chipped or even have a collar. Yet again the law is an ass as owners of dogs off lead in the street and without an identification tag attached to their collar should be fined but when does it ever happen. The only way to stop the sale of puppies at ?10 a piece is to enforce manditory neutering, which again will never happen because of lack of funds and other worthwile causes needing funding. Hundreds of dogs a day are pts because of overbreeding. It`s all about a quick buck, Ban the owner not the dog.

[The Nappy Lady]

Mscrawthew, on the dog poo issue, I'm afraid the dogs would still have to be walked to the 'off lead' area, and those who don't 'pick up' will still not do so even if their dog is on a lead - unless others see and confront them I imagine, so may not solve the problem entirely.

I think the off lead area would have to be huge to avoid problems, and that is my main concern. Maybe if it was the entire sloping side of the park, where they have let the wild grass area grow etc. from the big house to the Oval, along the edge of the pathway....but I can't see it happening.

In the summer when hot and I know the park is going to be full of people having picnics etc. I tend to avoid it, because I know for my dog it is too much temptation not to go up to people, and whilst she is friendly I don't think it is fair on people, so tend to go to Nunhead Cem instead (where it is cooler for her anyway).

Given that certain dogs tend to attack other dogs when on a lead (as per the other thread about Woody), I also think in some ways those of us who are responsible will be putting our pets in more danger, because the irresponsible owners may well still let their dogs run free. If a loose dog bombs up to a dog on a lead the restrained dog often feels vulnerable and will defend themselves, so it could cause more problems in some ways.

I still believe we should all be able to rub along together OK, with a bit of common sense, sensitivity and consideration. There will always be exceptions to the rules, but a fenced in off lead area will not sort these people out. I hate losing most of the park to footballers on the weekend, but have to grin and bear it, so I guess we all have to make allowances!! ;-)

Molly

[Mscrawthew]

Hi Molly

I also avoid the park at peak times as my dog is also very friendly and as responsible people we know that not everyone enjoys having a dog sharing their space. The one thing that drives me mad are the people who have their dogs off lead and at the sight of them running towards my dog who is always on lead in the park, Will wave and say "Oh, He/She is fine" How would she like a total stranger bombing towards her whilst being tethered to something and not having any way of escaping. Problem is a lot of people have no idea about dogs body languange and warning signs given out by even their own dogs that they cause problems for other people. Sadly again, if more people were confronted/fined for not picking up life would be a lot easier for all the dog ownwers who do take others into consideration. No point in having laws if they are not enforced and no backing for anyone who would be willing to confront someone either. This debate could go on for another 20 pages but until the law is enforced, Things won`t change.

[Huggers]

This is a Recall issue- everyone should be able to call their dogs back from picnics, joggers, other dogs as a first principal. All dogs (ok most) can be taught recall. You just have to be more interesting to your dog than anything else in the park- I find stilton cheese is irresistable...or rather, doggy does.

[Mscrawthew]

Totally agree Huggers but even Dulwich park packed to the rafters on a sunny afternoon in the summer is not suitable for even the best behaved dogs, Far to little space for a dog to have a good run without being knocked over by a jogger or a cyclist :))

[Huggers]

But Mscrathew, have you not discovered the dog circuit walk in Dulwich park? the muddy track round the edge? its pretty quiet-and then the big field...though the big field can get a bit intense.

I still prefer Peckham Rye for dogs any day, or early morning Nunhead cemetery.

[first mate]

I do wonder what will happen when the Harris Boy's School is opened? I really don't believe that all of the section of the Park fronting the school won't start getting used for sports and other activities at some point, rather like the Girl's school uses the other section. So the park is likely to be more packed, not just at weekends but perhaps on a daily basis too.

[ruffers]

Ditz Wrote:

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> I live in 'the wrong side' of Peckham (ie not the

> bit that insists on calling itself Bellenden

> Village) and all parks and open spaces around here

> have notices saying that all dogs must be kept on

> a lead.....

> As a responsible dog owner I completely ignore the

> signs not least because I have a cross-bred Border

> collie who definitely needs more than just

> walking, and who is obdient and well-trained.

>

(Edited by me.)

Is this serious?

I don't have a dog, and am a bit wary of them, but appreciate this thread in general has a constructive posts re dogs behaviour including one person posting they understand it can worry others if a dog runs toward them, and the original posting saying dog owners need to take responsibility. Then someone comes along and says "I ignore the rules".

[puzzled]

I have been walking our two jack russells every morning in peckham rye park for more than three years and have never seen dog-owners deliberately abusing the picnic area in the way you allege. there is a large group of dog walking regulars and if we see anyone behaving badly we tell them about it.

[Huggers]

the day I wrote the post there was one, and as a regular dog walker i did 'tell her' . She was exercising her dog deliberately in the picnic area because she thought it would keep her dog safe. She kept saying she had been told it was alright to do so. Hence in my original post on this thread a reference to it.

Maybe in real terms it doesnt actually have any impact on potential picnickers in the winter- but what it does have an impact on is the anti-dog lobby who go 'look, I told you so.'

[ruffers]

Huggers Wrote:

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>

> Maybe in real terms it doesnt actually have any

> impact on potential picnickers in the winter- but

> what it does have an impact on is the anti-dog

> lobby who go 'look, I told you so.'

Which is where I was going a couple of posts up..

[LegalEagle-ish]

My dog is a total pig, and no amount of shouting can stop him trying to snatch a sneaky drumstick when the picnickers are out, so I try to remember to take him out early if the weather is good! I've had to start keeping him on the lead anyway recently because he really wants to be a fox hound and the foxes seem to be very active aat the moment.

Any dog classes nearby?

[first mate]

LE,

If your dog is a total pig then the way to try to train a reliable recall is to use high value food. So, put him/her on a long line (just attach a good legth of nylon line, at all DIY stores, to the lead). Go to the park armed with a bag of chicken pieces (each bit the size of a child's nail) wait until something really gets his interest away from you. Call him to you once "Rover" come and then gently pull him to you using the line until he's at your feet, praise "good dog" and reward. Keep doing this and sooner or later (dogs learn at different speeds) he'll begin to associate coming to you (recall) with reward. You'll know because he'll start to come to you readily licking his lips. Eventually you start to thin out the reward so he gets chicken every three times on recall and finally its random. But for months I would reward very regularly, if not every time.

You are best to do all of this with a trainer or within a training class. I would recommned Beckenham dog training or Bobs Broadbent in Greenwich. Rob Alleyne is also very good but he's in high demand as he's on the telly. Google all these and you'll get contacts.

[LegalEagle-ish]

Thanks, I hate keeping him the lead in the park because he loves a good run, but he's too naughty at the moment, too many foxes running around in the bushes.

[first mate]

Yes, but do remember that any training that gets a dog to use his brain will tire him out far more than a few miles free running. Thus, if I need to go out and don't have much time to give my dog a long walk I'll do 20 minutes scent work- this exhausts him. If your dog is constantly after foxes and he's greedy then scent work is the thing for him.

Assuming you have a garden, put your dog into a "sit wait" in the kitchen with the door to the garden open (or whichever room leads to the garden)- if you don't have these basic training commands in place then simply tether him by his lead to something that will hold him in place. Let him smell the treat briefly then, with him tethered go and hide it. At first hide it within his sight a few yards away. Then give a release command "find" and unclip the lead and let him go get the treat, as he makes contact "GOOD FIND" and treat again.

Keep doing this but very gradually make the treat further away and harder to find. Eventually you can hide a treat all over the house or in the garden and he'll really work to find it because he is greedy- but all that concentration and focus will wear him out and he'll love this game because it hooks into something he is probably designed to do- what is his breed?

Sorry, meant to say that you can quite quickly phase out the treating as reward for finding the treat you have hidden. The game itself becomes self-rewarding and motivating. If your dog has a favourite toy you can also hide that, perhaps swapping a brief game with the toy, like catching or tuggy as reward for finding the toy- this is how many Spaniels are trained to do scent work- it's simply a game to them and finding the drugs etc.. is rewarded with the toy and an opportunity to play.

[LegalEagle-ish]

That's funny, my 11 year old daughter does that kind of thing with him all the time. She makes him sit for ages before she releases him to find the food! He really enjoys it. I will try carrying nice treats with me when i'm out with him. He's good on the lead, doesn't pull, but I need to stop him chasing foxes. He's a staff mix, I got him when he was about 10 months old and he hadn't been socialised but is a quick learner and great with dogs, cats, people etc. Just has strong chasing instinct I think.

[first mate]

Yes, Staffs can have a very high prey drive- as can many terriers and sighthounds. I think training is the way to go and getting inside your dog's head to try and figure out what motivates him most and then using training and distraction .

The only thing is it is almost impossible to recall a highly aroused dog that is on a mission, like after prey; once in that mode the dog is so focussed on one thing that it will not hear you or pay heed. We have to anticipate and stop behaviours becoming entrenched.

I wouldn't worry about keeping your dog on a lead for exercise. Using the lead and a long line concentrate on using his brain to your advantage and train, train, train. Yes, it is tiring and it does require dedication and committment and time- but that's dog ownership for you (hope I don't sound patronising, I don't mean to).

[daizie]

This thread has made me feel/realise that im a sh1t dog owner. He's never had any real training. I've always let my dog off the lead and he bombs round the Rye. He runs up to every dog he see's and depending on the temperment of that dog will try and shag it ( usually their heads!). We dont have a good recall he just then moves on to the next one. Most owners really dont seem to mind and find him funny. When I see he is particularly irritating I will put him on the lead. I think it is a long lead from now on :-$

[first mate]

Daizie,

At least you recognise there is work to do and that is probably the most important step to good dog ownership. I would heartily recommend that you attend a good training class, for the simple reason that if you are inexperienced and try to train your dog you may, with respect, make mistakes that are difficult to undo. Go with a class that is (APDT recognised). Rob Alleyne is first rate, he operates out of Newcross. He's worth waiting for.

[daizie]

My Terrier is 10 now . I think he has got by on his good looks and personality . However, since the incident before christmas when he was almost killed by a bull breed and reading these dog threads I am much more aware .

[first mate]

Ten, a good age and obviously a local character. Shagging another dog's head could get him into trouble, but from what you say he seems to pick his targets carefully! I just think if we are all as aware as possible and try to anticipate and avoid things can improve. I've said it many times but unless I know the dog and owner really, really well I just avoid bull breeds altogether.