Petition to Save Fairlawn Nursery

[yas]

sorry i apologise for that. i just assumed those who were attacking our petition were non-parents! it wasn't a generalisation on non-parents!

it would be understandable why some of the non-parents would not want public money being spent on early years education etc.. but not to the point of insulting those who do! so really we are not the bad guys here at all :)

[Penguin68]

I think you mistake criticism of your methods with criticism of your ends. I don't think anyone (happy to stand corrected on this) has suggested that they would wish to see the nursery closed (other things being equal) - merely that the way you have chosen to go about it (outwith anything you have done before posting notification of this petition) doesn't make a lot of sense. It was as if you had declared a wish to drive from London to Glasgow, but insisted that a route via Brighton, Cardiff, Nantes and Skye would be your optimal choice. Others have suggested otherwise, but that doesn't mean they don't think you shouldn't end up in Glasgow, they just feel the chosen route won't necessarily get you there.

To assume because we disagree with your methods that we are uncaring, childless trolls (pretty much your response on this) is perhaps an assumption too far. By inferring (I would guess wholly wrongly, certainly on my part) that we don't want money spent on early years education, for instance, is in no way relevant or consequent on our arguments that you have petitioned the wrong people, too late and/or have asked a Council to act outwith its legal powers.

Nor on an argument that by spending more on one nursery, given agreed budget heads, the Council would thus have to deprive another nursery. Once councils have agreed budgets these are no longer discretionary spends.

[yas]

Penguin68 you know as well as i do that the future of school nurseries may or may not be secure given the cuts!

As for Fairlawn Nursery, it benefits schools considerably less better off than my son's school. Case in point, Adamsrill, Holy Trinity. So given these facts, you still argue that to hell with it which I find it to be really odd.

As for the petition it may or may not be to late as the nursery due to close in August!

So please don't use this on me.

[Growlybear]

Well I'm a parent, who also has a long association with Fairlawn. I was very sorry that the decision was made to close the nursery, but the governors carried out a proper consultation process and then took the final decision to close the nursery once the responses to the consultation had been received and considered by the governors. There is no right of appeal against the decision - it was for the governors of the school to make and no other body has any power to make the governors change or reconsider their decision.

The school offered places at Haseltine to parents on the waiting list, and there are other excellent nurseries in the area - I find it hard to believe that Eliot Bank can be too far away for anyone who wanted a place at Fairlawn. Many of the parents on the waiting list will have found other places by now anyway.

Whatever you may want to think, the final decision has been made and will not be changed.

[Growlybear]

And I don't think to true to say that anyone has attacked the OP's petition - people have just pointed out that it is completely pointless to start a petition after a decision has been made and to direct it to the wrong body!

[yas]

Growlybear, if you are a parent at Fairlawn then you must understand why Fairlawn had to make that decision! i was present in the first consultation and had long chats with both heads about this issue since. But there are legalities as to what schools can or can't do. Fundraising was explored but frankly you can't run a nursery year in year out relying on fundraising.

no Eliot Bank is absolutely undoable for me so is Hazeltine. I won't send my child to St Francesca (a catholic school), no offence if you did. In any case, I had since sorted a place for my daughter anyhow.

Though stating that this petition is a useless exercise is dishonest! Even if doesn't achieve its ultimate goal, it has provided moral support for the staff at the nursery!

[Growlybear]

Of course I understand why the governors had to make the decision to close the nursery. I also understand the process for making such a decision, and am very much aware of the legalities of what schools can and can't do, as well as what the local authority can and can't do. It is not at all dishonest to say that the petition is useless because it will not serve it's original purpose, which was to 'save Fairlawn Nursery'. I also don't think the one or two staff who may or may not be affected by the closure really need moral support from an online petition!

[yas]

This is not just a petition, it is a campaign. It has even made it to South London Press as well as backed by Forest Hill Society. A lot of the parents in Fairlawn School and Horniman School support this campaign!

I am therefore puzzled at your ignorance, Growlybear?

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

So the point of the campaign/petition was not to save the nursery, but to make the staff feel better?

[dbboy]

So it's moved from petition to campaign, can I ask what the objective of the campaign now is?

[Growlybear]

And I'm rather puzzled as to why you think I am ignorant? Surely refusing to accept that your petition is too late and aimed at the wrong body demonstrates quite a degree of ignorance?

Perhaps some of these parents at Fairlawn and Horniman Schools who supposedly support what has now become a 'campaign' rather than a petition should have voiced their views more strongly at the consultation meetings in January and put forward viable suggestions for keeping the nursery open. Or was it the case that the other parents understood and accepted the reasons for closing the nursery and the process that was followed?

yas Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> This is not just a petition, it is a campaign. It

> has even made it to South London Press as well as

> backed by Forest Hill Society. A lot of the

> parents in Fairlawn School and Horniman School

> support this campaign!

>

> I am therefore puzzled at your ignorance,

> Growlybear?

[Loz]

Growlybear Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Perhaps some of these parents at Fairlawn and Horniman Schools who supposedly support what has

> now become a 'campaign' rather than a petition should have voiced their views more strongly at

> the consultation meetings in January and put forward viable suggestions for keeping the nursery

> open. Or was it the case that the other parents understood and accepted the reasons for closing

> the nursery and the process that was followed?

It sounds more like that if more of these people in favour of keeping the nursery open actually enrolled kids there, then it wouldn't be in this mess. After all, it is closing it due to lack of numbers.

[Jessicas429]

Do not understand why people are responding to this thread.

Either the person who has started it is a troll or is so pig headed that they are not going to listen to reason whatever is said.

Don't feed the troll/wally.

[Growlybear]

That's probably the most sensible post in this thread. My head is hurting a bit now from being banged against a brick wall, so I think I'll take your advice, and will just sit back and point and laugh from now on!

[yas]

Growlybear, as a fellow Fairlawn Parent, i feel it is my duty to inform that

3 members of staff are facing redundancies, 2 members of staff may have reduced hours, one will escape reduncancy by virtue of being pregnant.

As for the parents whose children were on the list to go to Fairlawn Nursery, 2 will go to a catholic school (one muslim, one eschewed catholisimn in favour of a different religion).

I was in a consultation meeting i did not hear a growlybear type of person voicing their concerns about this nursery going or expressing remorse (many parents at the very least expressed remorse). So you are not in a position to judge fellow parents.

Above all, this campaign is supported by fellow Fairlawn Parents as well as Horniman School and Forest Hill Society. Because if it is successful both our school and the wider community will benefit from it. So once again, your ignorance of what goes on in our school is puzzling to me.

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

Heh @ "growly bear type of person". Is this like average looking people in cafes in Peckham?

[yas]

This is a kind of person who is attacking a campaign which is not only good for his children's school but for wider community as well!

Yes, i do hang out in cafes in Peckham, does that qualify me any less to undertake a campaign which i believe in?

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

I'm genuinely torn as to whether you are a troll or have a persecution complex. No-one is attacking your campaign.

[nxjen]

Yas - are you actually reading the posts on this thread?

[yas]

ok maybe attacking is a stronger word, i just felt that some of the opionions expressed by growlybear is a little bit insensitive giving the situation!

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

We get that you're upset about this, but I don't think anyone has been insensitive to that fact - unless your definition of insensitive is "saying absolutely anything that contradicts my understanding of the world".

Suggesting that people who disagree with you must be childless and therefore not be entitled to an opinion could equally be construed as insensitive.

[yas]

everybody is entitled to their opinion! but it is not nice being called a liar, arrogant etc... it could be done in a nicer way especially by fellow parents, i felt!

my situation is that i will be forced to pay for my child's nursery fee as 15 hours of child care doesn't translate into private nurseries very well. i may or may not be able to afford it as we are a one income family (my husband is a contractor, i should add). so i may even have to send my child to a catholic school nursery come September along with my other friends who are in the same situation as me.

so if you were in my situation, would you like to highlight your local nursery closing due to cuts is not great thing?

[dbboy]

I get you're upset and angry at the response you have had to your petition which has been clearly demonstrated with the posts you have been making.

As you are saying it is a campaign, can I ask AGAIN what the objective of the campaign now is?

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

If I was in your position, I'd want to do something practical. So far on this thread, you appear to have claimed that the point of the petition/campaign is:

1. to stop the nursery from closing

2. to hightlight your perception that this is as a result of political decisions about cuts

3. to express solidarity with the nursery staff

4. to express that you are upset that this has affected you personally

People on this thread have tried to get you to clarify your objectives, to point out to you that you can't actually achieve 1. with the petition because that isn't legally possible and to get more clarity on what your evidence is for 2 (which you still haven't provided beyond rumour).

No-one actually called you a liar, but asked for evidence for your assertions. When you admitted you were mispresenting rumour as fact, you kinda branded yourself there.

It isn't nice to be called arrogant, but if you refuse to listen to anyone who doesn't just say "well done Yas", it's understandable that people have inferred that - particularly when you have been hostile first.

We understand that you are upset and angry, but how on earth are you helping things by lashing out at everyone like a petulant kid?

[Growlybear]

Just to clarify - I said in an earlier post that I am a parent and that I have a long association with Fairlawn . I did not say that I am a current Fairlawn parent, not even an ordinary looking one.