Help solve an argument...!

[buggie]

Lighthearted Xmas debate time!!

So, I'm busy tomorrow (joy of deadlines 😣) & my husband is talking about taking the kids to the park, I suggested that 2yo son might be happier on his big sisters scooter than his own one as he's out grown the round handle/I've seen him using "proper" scooters well.

Husband is mortified at idea of taking him to the park with a pink scooter & says no Dad would be happy to do this unless appeasing his partner... My eyebrows are hovering about a foot above my head at the mo!

Which of us is being unreasonable?!

[Mutrik]

a pink scooter is fine in my view - it's only us adults who define colours as being for girls or boys etc. Don't think your two year old cares what colour it is and as long as he is happy.... So I would say your husband is unreasonable (sorry husband!)

[mimosa]

Seriously?? Your husband.

[buggie]

tbf this doesn't show him in a great light... He's hugely involved with the kids and I wouldn't have married him let alone had kids with him if he had such fixed gender rules, but he is especially twitchy about pink! (Was daughter's choice of colour when we bought it!).

[Saffron]

Nothing wrong with a pink scooter! xx

[Pickle]

My husband wears pink shirts to work, but I remember him being a bit funny years ago about our son (then around 2) pushing a pink dolls buggy round the park :)

[minder]

Maybe he's just worried about 2 year old using older childs scooter? There is a safety aspect, other than the colour.

[uncleglen]

Get some navy tape and wrap it round in stripes....perfect Dulwich hamlet F.c. colours

[hellosailor]

My son inherited his sister's pink scooter?and her floral pyjamas?and scooted around the rye on his pink scooter dressed as Elsa the other day!

[nunheadmum]

Isn't it trendy ED to be so clearly re-cycling your kids toys, regardless of gender stereotypes? As well as being eminently sensible and helping to over-ride said stereotypes.

[yeknomyeknom]

Dad has been subject to a childhood compounding gender stereotypes. So I understand his view. But it's wrong. He should want more for his kid. A colour is a colour. The minute we start linking colours to types of people and differences in their personalities is the minute we open up possibilities to other colour biases.

[Strawbs]

My 4 year old boy still loves pink and honestly it doesn't bother me at all - we are a mix of pink stuff and dinosaurs in my house and I have two boys! pink is just a colour and nothing more than that to be honest at such a young age, it is adults who put their own stereotypes on children. Just take him and he will see that truly everyone else is so busy doing their own thing they wont even notice him let alone what colour scooter he is on!

Daddy needs to chill out a bit, big kisses x

[midivydale]

Dad in our house is abit like this I afraid. Not at all impressed when he overheard ds asking me if he could have pjetty jed nails too and i said of course!

Different cultures and all that. In country where I am from the fear of gender stereotyping is taking some extreme forms (hence me not batting an eyelid at ds wanting his nails painted)...country where my partner's parents are from, not so much. One of our culture clashes, one of very many I should add 😉

[Convex]

i agree, of course, but you know i do have the odd twinge when my son asks for something super girly and although i am very pro gender neutral etc i guess we are all socially conditioned etc

so although he is of course being unreasonable i do understand where he is coming from! what was the outcome?

as an aside, my son wants some makeup. to be like me (extremely unusual as he is a daddys boy) i am thinking of getting him some facepaint. any ideas? am worried about his skin. other idea is to buy him a makeup brush so he can pretend.

[mimosa]

On the flip side, I used to feel a little bothered when my daughter insisted on pink. When I dressed her I'd put her in all sorts of colours (including pink, but not privileged more than other colours). Now, I'm just happy when I've persuaded her to dress warmly enough for the season!

[Saffron]

Convex Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> i agree, of course, but you know i do have the odd

> twinge when my son asks for something super girly

> and although i am very pro gender neutral etc i

> guess we are all socially conditioned etc

>

> so although he is of course being unreasonable i

> do understand where he is coming from!

>

Snap! Just yesterday we were coat shopping, and my daughter was looking at a very boyish (to my eye) style of coat. I started to say, that's not really for a girl. Then I bit my tongue and rechecked the elastic on my judge-y pants! She didn't choose it in the end, but I felt a pang of sympathy for Mr Buggie.

I think the main thing is that children have the freedom to make their own choices, unfettered by our bias. And sometimes karma comes round to bite you in the bum anyway: When my friend wanted to buy her toddler son a little play kitchen, her husband was opposed (bc kitchens aren't for boys?!?). So, in the end her mother-in-law bought one as a surprise -- a PINK one.

> as an aside, my son wants some makeup. to be like

> me (extremely unusual as he is a daddys boy) i am

> thinking of getting him some facepaint. any ideas?

> am worried about his skin. other idea is to buy

> him a makeup brush so he can pretend.

We use eyeliners as face paint. Buy them cheap in a rainbow of colours. The ones you don't have to sharpen are best. If you dust the skin with a little translucent powder afterwards, they last all day. xx

[Northeastview]

Use the scooter. My son has loads of pink stuff. Is your husband able to say what he actual concern is? Maybe if he tries to say exactly what his issue is (rather than just insinuating) he might realise how silly this is.

[Otta]

I'm not 100% convinced it's just us adults that have hang ups about gender / colours. I have 2 girls, we have raised them both the same, wityh as little pink as possible in early years. Older one couldn't give a shit, but younger one is full on princess pink.

Just tell Mr Buggie to make sure he's heard calling "careful you don't break your SISTER's scooter" whenever anyone gets within earshot ;-)

[buggie]

Otta Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I'm not 100% convinced it's just us adults that

> have hang ups about gender / colours. I have 2

> girls, we have raised them both the same, wityh as

> little pink as possible in early years. Older one

> couldn't give a shit, but younger one is full on

> princess pink.

>

> Just tell Mr Buggie to make sure he's heard

> calling "careful you don't break your SISTER's

> scooter" whenever anyone gets within earshot ;-)

👍🏻 like it Otta!

V interesting & reassuring to know that neither Mr Buggie is hugely unusual to have

expressed this, and I've not been daft to find it unreasonable, although the scooter hasn't been taken out

(it seems we're moving into the hand-me-down (red) balance bike!! 🙄)

[????]

I think we should all wear grey*....get's us and our kids away from making some terrible un-PC colour faux pas....

*is gray ok, or am I breaking some terrible 'hairist' taboo?

HELP we need a safe room

** sighs **

[womanofdulwich]

I didn't wear anything or have anything pink until I realised 2 teenage sons would not borrow pink trainers , socks ,coats or mp3 players. Now I get to keep everything as they don't borrow them 😀

[buggie]

???? Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I think we should all wear grey*....get's us and

> our kids away from making some terrible un-PC

> colour faux pas....

>

> *is gray ok, or am I breaking some terrible

> 'hairist' taboo?

>

> HELP we need a safe room

>

> ** sighs **

Make up your mind on the spelling & we'll let you know!

[monniemae]

Your husband is being a sexist moron. It blows my mind that there are still people who persist in "boys can't be within touching distance of pink" bullshit. See also "searching for xxx can't be pink because I have a boy / must be pink because I have a girl" posts. It's reductive and embarrassing.

What exactly is he afraid of? That your son will become a girl? That he will become gay? That people might think his dad is too girly or a bit gay? Ugh.

[canela]

I wouldn't advise calling your hubby a sexist moron, but you might want to just flag up to him that his children may grow up to be girlie boys or boyish girls. They may grow up to be gay. They may grow up and want a sex change. His son may want to be a ballet dancer, a nurse, a hairdresser etc....

My daughter is a real tomboy and I am constantly shocked by how often people feel they need to comment on this, rather than just let her enjoy her football/blue clothes/boys shoes or whatever. My hubby found it hard at the beginning to accept and kept buying her princess dresses and trying to convince her to wear them. It didn't work! Now he is very proud of his tomboy and just lets her get on with it.

[Saffron]

Some of the posts are a bit harsh on here, imho. (Maybe they are meant in jest / lost in translation?) None of us are infallible as parents, or indeed as people. I've never met Buggie, though from her long history of posting on this forum, she seems like a thoughtful and educated person. It stands to reason that her husband is a pretty decent guy too.

He may be totally aware that his views are irrational but still feels uncomfortable with suggestions of acting otherwise.

We all dress and speak and act within a certain comfort zone. When taken out of that zone we may feel tremendously uncomfortable, although we know our fears are unjustified. If you think you'd be happy wearing (or having your children wear) any colour, try all dressing in black like Goths for a day... or if you're Goths, try dressing in bright/not black clothes! I'm joking good-naturedly, lest anyone (Goth or otherwise) be offended, of course. But my point is that everyone has boundaries*. Simply having boundaries doesn't automatically make you a bad person, or unenlightened. It's great to push boundaries but probably best if it's done in supportive, inclusive ways. I'm not sure that stigmatizing otherwise seemingly decent individuals for their boundaries doesn't just end up in them retreating further into their comfort zones.

I like Otta's suggested use of humour to resolve the situation! The sublime is often very close to the ridiculous.

*"boundaries" as in the context of the original post.