dog attacks on cats

[xelena]

Last week my neighbours' cat, Billie, was attacked and killed by a dog. The dog's owner, a woman, opened the gate to my neighbours' front garden and purposely set the dog onto the cat. This is the fourth known fatal attack within a year in just the two streets around where I live. Billie's injuries were so horrific (his spine was completely severed) that the emergency vet who put him to sleep is compiling a report to the RSPCA.

I work in animal rescue at the Celia Hammond Animal Trust in Lewisham. We are seeing a phenomenal rise in the number of dog attacks upon cats. The Trust is increasingly wary of homing any of its cats anywhere where there is easy access to a street or communal area, not only because of traffic but even more so because of the possibility of dog attacks.

In order to try to curtail this brutal sport, a number of us are campaigning to increase the number of designated areas within the borough where dog control orders apply - dogs in the street and on communal areas within estates to be kept on the lead at all times and on the spot fines to be imposed on those walking dogs off lead.

Please write to your local councillors about this issue if you care about keeping your area safe for your pets.

Please note: some of the recent feedback I have received regarding this post has made me realise I wrote slightly ambiguously about our local campaign to increase the number of areas where dog control orders apply, and failed to distinguish it sufficiently from my paragraph about the Celia Hammond Trust. I would like to make it clear that the campaign has nothing to do with the Trust itself and apologise for any confusion caused.

[Mark]

Where was this?

[annaj]

xelena, that sounds awful, but surely the issue here is this particular dog owner, not all dog owners or all dogs.

You said that the woman opened the garden gate and deliberately set the dog on the cat, if you're sure of that, I mean if it was witnessed, then shouldn't it be reported to the police? I'm not that familiar with the dangerous dog laws or animal cruelty laws, but I would've thought deliberately setting a dog on a cat was an offence. And if all the similar attacks have happened in a small area, isn't it likely that a limited number of people are involved?

Having a cat killed in such a violent way would be awful for any pet owner, but your campaign seems to rather miss the point that the majority of dog owners are responsible. Imposing tighter controls would affect all the responsible dog owners, but is unlikely to change the behaviour of someone who thinks such a cruel, violent and antisocial act is acceptable.

[PeckhamRose]

And also PLEASE remember that irresponsible dog owners do not read signs that tell them to do this or that, and don't care about orders. And if no-one witnesses their actions or is willing to write a statement, what can you do. To have an entire area as a bad area because of one owner (who may then move), is not a good idea. And if they do move, how long before bureacracy allows the area to be allowed to be called a good area again. This is daft. I am terribly sorry about what happens, but don't target areas - target people. So I will not write to my councillor about control orders for designated areas. I WILL ask the snt team to look into being more aware of those dog owners to fine them.

Again we are looking to punish ALL dog owners because of the actions of a few. Most dogs I see are well trained loved dogs, and their owners are responsible. And seeing those dogs walk off lead up the road is not a problem. A few are clearly not responsible and need to be targetted but please don't punish them all. (See? Everyone's being turned into a criminal!)

[xelena]

The police know about this particular incident. There is nothing they can do because it was an animal that was injured, not a child. It took place in Gordon Road, but there are plenty of other incidents elsewhere in the borough as we know from working in animal rescue. I knew I would get a backlash from those few dog owners who object to keeping their dogs on leads, but I know of far greater numbers of responsible dog owners who are perfectly happy to walk their dogs on lead even if their dog would never attack. They would not dream of not doing so. So, what exactly is the problem? There are plenty of places where dogs can be let off the lead to run about. Why not keep our streets as safe places where leads are obligatory? As dog attacks go on increasing, sooner or later something will have to be done, the sooner the better in my opinion.

[first mate]

Xlena,

My commiserations to your friend and all the others who have had pets harmed in this way. I should add that other dogs have also been on the receiving end of such attacks.

I do understand your anger and your desire to come up with a solution but must echo the views of others here in suggesting that your route will simply penalise the vast majority of responsible dog owners; those who behave irresponsibly will continue to do so. We know this is true because it is already illegal to walk a dog offlead on the street- it is a certain type that struts around with a dog offlead and they will not change by extending dog control orders- they are already breaking the law.

Given the above and that it is already illegal to walk a dog offlead on the public highways etc.. I am not quite sure what extending dog control orders will achieve. I should add that it is already a civil offence under the Dog Act of 1871 if a dog is dangerous to people or to animals and is deemed out of proper control, that is off lead, wherever the offence happens. The dog can be subject to a destruction order and the owner may have to pay costs. Perhaps your organisation should look at taking legal action against the person in question. Though a civil matter the police were informed and you have the vet's report as evidence. The profile derived from a successful case plus a hefty financial penalty to said owner would, in my view, be appropriate justice and much more of a deterrent.

[ayresc]

As a dog and cat owner, I agree with Xelena.

Dogs should be on leads on the street full stop, why wouldnt you? If the dog chased a cat across a road and got run over who would be complaining then?

A blanket rule may be unhelpful but it's common sense anyway and it means that police or community support have something to back thenm up when dealing with scrotes (which is who we're dealing with here, yet again).

[PeckhamRose]

I do not own a dog. I own a cat.

Admittedly a cat who hates going out.

I am glad the SNT will look at what is happening.

I shall raise it at the next SNT meeting. As I am sure you all will when you also come along.

[bonniebird]

Dogs should always be on a lead in the street, always, but not in parks. Dogs need the freedom to run and play and socialise etc. I totally agree with annaj, peckhamrose, and firstmate, these absolute B******S who do this to animals will do it anyway, regardless:X They are sick individuals and the law should be changed, just because its a dog on cat attack or a dog on dog attack, it is not even looked at by the police. This is wrong.

Last year a man in a park near Brockwell (I think, don't quote me on that) set his dog onto a Westie and told the dog to get it, whilst he filmed the killing on his mobile phone:X The owner and her other dog witnessed this and were and probably still are, very distraught and disturbed by the incident. She was pleading with the hooded man to please stop, she called the police, he ran off. The police arrived and all they did was offer her a carrier bag to take her beloved dogs body home in.

As the others have said, most of us are good people with very well behaved, well socialised dogs, one of mine ran away from a frog in our garden the other day! So why the hell should all dogs be punished because of these B******S and their dogs?

If a man rapes or murders someone, does that then mean that all men should be put in prison too? No, it doesn't. What you need to work on, is getting all dogs licensed, microchipped, compulsory dog taining classes, more dog wardens, we don't seem to have anymore?? These thugs, we all know the type, with their macho dogs (you very rarely see them with an old dog) need to be educated about dogs and like I already said licensed etc.

Poor Billy and all the other animals and owners that this has happened too, I really feel for them, please pass on my regards, but your way, I'm afraid Xelena is not the right way to go, and I for one will not be writing to my councellers either, especially as a few years ago I was involved in many meetings, and collecting signatures for a petition against dogs on leads in our local parks.

[first mate]

ayresc,

I'm sorry but with respect you seem to be slightly missing the point. Dogs offlead on the street are already illegal, therefore the "scrotes" to whom you refer are already in breach of the law- but they continue to break it do they not? Why not use existing leglisation to prosecute or fine offenders, thus pursuing the miscreants and leaving the law abiding majority alone?

[ayresc]

first mate... super news.

Let's do the f&ckers then, I'm always under the impression they 'get away' with it.

[first mate]

ayresc,

Quite.

Perhaps these community wardens or toy police-people, or whatever they are, can be given the power to issue on the spot fines to those with dogs offlead on the streets, to those who don't pick up poo and, while we are at it, fine the litter louts who throw broken glass, gum and food detritus around etc..etc... A much better use of taxpayer money than funding those assorted wardens and clampers who prowl the streets looking to fine car owners for minor, or even imaginary infringements,of money-making parking laws.

[Mark]

Top tip for the day: If you want the assistance from a group of people who have the power to help you, you're better off not insulting them first. I don't believe the community police (who read this forum) will think "ah yes, first mate called us toy police-people, we must now make this a top priority".

[first mate]

Mark,

Point taken but I'd hope that the community police would put the needs of the community ahead of a personal reaction to a throwaway (though rather silly) line from a forumite.

I think the priorities discussed here stand despite my rather low remark.

[annaj]

Xelena, I have two cats and really quite dislike dogs, so I wouldn't describe my response as a "backlash from dog owners". I was just trying to make the point that, since the majority of dog owners are responsible and the minority are irresponsible, it's more constructive and logical to target the minority that punish the majority.

[xelena]

If it is illegal to walk a dog off lead on the streets why do the community wardens and police tell me that when they see a dog being walked off lead on the street all they can do, if they do anything at all, is to 'advise' the owner that the dog be put on a lead?

[puzzled]

is it a coincidence that this post appears on the day it is revealed that new dog control orders are springing up everywhere? I find it impossible to believe that the police could do nothing about this attack. after all, this was a clearly dangerous dog and a deranged owner. dogs are really coming in for a concerted attack just lately. dogs are supposed to be on leads in the street. but they can and should be free to trot and run around in the parks.southwark tried to keep dogs out of public spaces a year or two ago and were soundly beaten back. this will just encourage the dog hating gestapo to creep out of the shadows again. someone on here declared that they have right not be approached in the park. no they don't. most dogs walk right past. they are very sociable creatures and much given to wagging their tales at strangers. if anyone objects to this then they have a problem and should deal with it and leave the doggies alone.

[first mate]

puzzled,

As I said, strictly speaking an attack by a dog on another animal would be a civil offence, and there is legislation to cover this scenario as a civil offence. However, if in the course of the attack human witnesses felt themselves also to be at risk of attack by the dog then it falls under the Dangerous Dogs Act. The key here is that the dog does not necessarily have to actually bite the person. If they feel sufficiently frightened of the dog and believe they will be attacked and the dog is not under control, that is on a lead or muzzled, then they may have grounds to prosecute under the DDA.

I have to admit that dogs on lead on the streets is a slightly grey area. It is a criminal offence for a dog to be out and about without a collar stating the owner's address. Under section 27 of the Road Traffic Act of 1988 councils can insist that dogs are kept on lead on designated highways. Thus every time an owner crosses a designated road with their dog offlead they are committing an offence. An offlead, unmuzzled dog that behaves in a threatening or aggressive mannner towards any human might be deemed out of control and culpable under the DDA. Again, the dog does not have to bite a threatening display would be enough.

[Huggers]

I think also cats should be given greater legal protection. Maybe that would close this loophole. If you run over a dog in your car you are obliged by law to report it, but not a cat.

As Ive said before on the other dog thread, dogs off leads on the street are a menace, not just to traffic and people, but to dogs on leads who feel very vulnerable when rushed by them. Last night I saw dog (bull terrier) off lead in street, it went into road, owner just started hitting it. Not a very good way to train a dog to walk next to you.

[first mate]

Huggers,

I agree. There is no good reason I can think of that a dog should ever be offlead on a public street, be it major or minor highway (unless its a guide dog). Dogs being dogs are far more likely to get into fisticuffs if they are "trapped" onlead and confronted by another dog offlead in a small space- which a path is. I don't want to stigmatise certain breeds but we have to agree that the most likely dog to be seen careering around the street offlead is the staffie/bull type, often male and often entire. The breed type, the gender and the un-neutered status of the dog all serve to increase the risk of a fight when offlead. It is also a fact that the majority of people who let their dogs offlead in this way are probably totally irresponsible in other aspects of dog ownership.

[xelena]

I too find it impossible to believe that the police are powerless in cases like this. They came very promptly to the scene and took details of the attack but basically told us that since a human wasn't attacked and the dog in question was not a pit bull type, they could take no action!!? I find this very peculiar because if that same person had come into my neighbour's front garden and smashed a window or two, they would certainly be prosecuted. I would really like clarification on this whole issue and will try to find out what exactly the law is. If there is anybody out there who really knows, please inform us.

[Asset]

Surely the owner could be prosecuted? Cruelty to animals is a punishable offence and setting one's dog onto a cat must be seen as that. I don't see how the police can't do anything.

[bonniebird]

Asset Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Surely the owner could be prosecuted? Cruelty to

> animals is a punishable offence and setting one's

> dog onto a cat must be seen as that. I don't see

> how the police can't do anything.

Me either :'(

[siousxiesue]

bonniebird Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Asset Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Surely the owner could be prosecuted? Cruelty

> to

> > animals is a punishable offence and setting

> one's

> > dog onto a cat must be seen as that. I don't

> see

> > how the police can't do anything.

>

> Me either :'(

I dealt with a woman who was knocked to the ground by a dog attacking her own dog which she had in her arms. We know where he lives but the police refused to do anything. Luckily her dog (and her) survived but she still has to live next door to the scumbag...