State secondary schools further afield - any advice?

[redjam]

So, like many of us with Year 6 children I am busy doing the rounds of secondary schools at the moment. But I'm struggling to think how I'm going to fill the list with six 'realistic' schools (seven if you count Charter ED).

There seem to be certain obvious local schools that everyone I know is putting down in whichever order: Charter 1 (we're well out of catchment but hey, I'll stick it down anyway), Charter ED, Kingsdale, Harris Girls/Harris Boys and Sydenham School for girls - for boys the equivalent is Forest Hill although I know that's harder to get into from ED.

But then that leaves us with at least a couple more options to fill. So my question is, which are the realistic schools that we should be considering for those last couple of slots on the list? Or do people just put down schools they don't think they've got a chance of getting into just to fill the list?

I've done a bit of research and these are the other options I've come up with, but if any ED parents out there can give me some advice on this, I'd be grateful. I've only looked at girls' schools but if any boys' parents want to chip in, please do. I also haven't considered any faith schools because I don't know where to start - I'm not averse to sending my daughter to a C of E school but we're not churchgoers so I've assumed we wouldn't stand a chance. Again, if anyone can correct me on this, please do. So here's my list:

Harris Crystal Palace - too far?

Elmgreen - too far?

Deptford Green - too far?

Prendergast Hilly Fields (girls) - but we'd only stand a chance if you get a music place?

Haberdasher Aske's Hatcham - ditto

Dunraven - too far?

Grey Coats (girls) - only if you get a language place

Graveney - only if your child does exceptionally well in the Wandsworth test

Harris Peckham - too far?

Any wise old Year 7/8/9 parents out there who can give me some advice? There was a useful thread on this a while back (http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,1547779,1553418#msg-1553418) but that actually made me think that it was even less likely to get into somewhere like e.g. Elmgreen from East Dulwich. Help!

Edited to change Sydenham High (private) to Sydenham School (state) - my mistake.

[BeccaL]

Depends where in ED you are - we're on Overhill Road. Went to visit Deptford Green last week and it took about 35 minutes door to door, which isn't too bad - bus to Forest Hill, train to New Cross Gate then about 10 minute walk from there. If your child could cycle to Honor Oak or Forest Hill, you have more control over how long the commute will take (obviously depending on reliability of trains and buses, but all trains from FH/HOP go to New Cross Gate, so you have both the Overground and Southern). Was a little apprehensive about the journey, but it was pretty straightforward. Liked the school, so probably worth having a look if you're filling spaces. Elmgreen is also cycle-able in 15 minutes from us, so that may be another option? Am in the same situation - good luck!

[confusedbyitall]

Completely agree that 6 spaces is ridiculous and I refuse to fill it up with schools I wont go to. The system needs to change!

Last year I know kids from ED/Peckham that got places at Elm Green and Deptford so they are realistic choices.

There is a fairly new school "University Academy of Engineering South Bank" - next open day 7th October

http://www.uaesouthbank.org.uk/

Haven't been there yet either!

London Nautical is in Lambeth and I know a few kids from around here that go there.

[nickysydenham]

True about Haberdasher's in New Cross,..... But deadline for music aptitude test has now passed. For Harris Crystal Palace, you would be in band B, outside of 2 mile radius from school, only 10% of places awarded at random, after siblings, and technology aptitude pupils (top 10% in test), and kids within 2 mile radius, etc. So you could get in on performance in technology entrance test, but otherwise chances are slim... Though not zero.

[redjam]

This is all really helpful, thank you. Interesting about Harris Crystal Palace - I hadn't got my head round their admissions criteria. I'd never even heard of the UAE or London Nautical. More research needed - aargh!

[HannahSE23]

confusedbyitall - your name is how I feel throughout this whole school application process! And I thought applying for primary school was bad...

I'm not filling up the form with the whole six places. Everyone says I should but I don't see the point in putting down unrealistic choices or schools that are undersubscribed that I wouldn't let my child set foot in anyway!

[katgod]

Better a school you can get to easily/have visited/know something about but don't like than one you cannot get to easily that you know nothing about/have not heard of AND don't like?

[edanna]

I think Elm Green is worth a look, based on hearsay rather than experience. I believe the P13 goes there - one of the P buses anyway.

[Zedd]

The Norwood School in West Norwood. Train from ED to West Norwood then about a 10 minute walk. I never understand why it doesn't crop up more often (or ever) in these threads as it's a good (with outstanding) school, has exam results comparable to (and sometimes better than) many of the other schools that appear on the EDF, and has some of the best value added scores in the country? what's not to like?? well it's not very middle class (not my concern but might be for others although this is changing rapidly) and had a terrible reputation 8-10 years ago when it was an all girls school. It's a hidden gem, trust me ;-)

[redjam]

Zedd - v useful, thank you. Another one I'd not heard of. And interesting that Elmgreen seems to be getting good word of mouth - it's one that keeps cropping up on the grapevine as being on the up, good new headmaster etc (though I had a look at their published exam results and it seems last year's were pretty poor so perhaps early days?).

Katgod, yes, quite agree, but the trouble is where to draw the line. I've already been to half a dozen open days and at an average hour and a half for each one I can't afford to keep taking time off work to visit many more, particularly if realistically I don't think my daughter would stand a chance of getting in. Which is partly why I started this thread. This so-called 'choice' is ridiculously onerous on the parents.

Anyone know if kids from ED ever get into Dunraven? It's meant to be a great school but I emailed them a couple of weeks ago to ask if they could tell me their furthest distance offered last year (can't find the info on the internet anywhere) and had no reply.

[redjam]

Oh! As if the admissions office at Dunraven is monitoring the East Dulwich Forum minute by minute (perhaps they are?), I've just had the response from them! So in the interest of community spirit, I am sharing it with you:

Thank you for your email enquiry and apologies for the delay in responding to you, but it is an extremely busy time of year for admissions.

As an indication for the September 2015 Year 7 entry the furthest distance measurements in each of the 5 bands on National Offer Day were as follows:

Band 1.1 - 0.687 miles

Band 1.2 - 0.931 miles

Band 2.1 - 0.971 miles

Band 2.2 - 0.919 miles

Band 3 - 0.892 miles

I hope this information will assist you with your decision making.

Haven't got my map out yet but I suspect that puts that one safely out the running for most East Dulwich kids. Ah well, another one crossed off the list.

[Otta]

redjam Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There seem to be certain obvious local schools

> that everyone I know is putting down in whichever

> order: Charter 1 (we're well out of catchment but

> hey, I'll stick it down anyway), Charter ED,

> Kingsdale, Harris Girls/Harris Boys and Sydenham

> High for girls - for boys the equivalent is Forest

> Hill although I know that's harder to get into

> from ED.

Just for clarity, and to avoid any mistakes on forms, Sydenham HIGH for girls is an independent fee paying school.

Sydenham School is the state girls school on Dartmouth Road.

[redjam]

Otta, you're right, thank you - I get this wrong EVERY time. Will amend original post.

[Mrs TP]

Look on the Southwark, Lambeth, Lewisham, Westminster etc websites and they will list all their state schools and hopefully admissions criteria. Also ask you primary head if they have a list of where the last 2yrs yr 6 pupils went.

You are better filling up the last slots on your form with schools you have visited and know. Worse case scenario your child is better off going to a local less preferred school, than one truly miles away, whilst waiting for a place to come up on the schools higher up your list.

There is still movement going on with new year 7s. I have heard specific examples of Kingsdale and Sydenham School (Girls) offering places since the start of term.

[Coach Beth]

St Thomas the Apostle - Nunhead (Hollydale Road) - Catholic School but approx 50% of intake are non-Catholic. Boys School with impressive sports department (they have a swimming pool!) and art and design department - relatively small intake for year 7 (150 students as opposed to 240 which many of the above secondary schools have. Also one of top boys schools in London and was second in Southwarks GCSE results only to their sister school Sacred Heart in Camberwell

[tomskip]

I don't believe for one minute that any child in East Dulwich has a chance of getting in to six reasonably local secondary schools (if they are not going for private or grammar). I'm really curious to know if anyone in the whole country does, actually. It seems to me that if you are made to put down six preferences then that helps when the Government wants to provide statistics showing that nearly 100% of parents get one of their preferred schools. When in reality we all only have two, at best three, schools that our children could get in to or indeed want to get in to.

When I was applying for my first child I actually put this question to Renata and she suggested Deptford Green or, did I have a religion and could I put down a faith school?

I put down the three schools we had a chance of getting in to (this included Kingsdale - so a very remote chance) and just filled up the bottom three places on this list with schools vaguely in the vicinity. With my second child I did not make the mistake of wasting his time taking him to banding tests at, for example, Habs.

As I understand it, Dunraven is Streatham's equivalent of the Charter School and has a minute catchment area, so no, we are nowhere near close enough.

[Coach Beth]

Actually, I think there is an excellent chance of local children getting into Deptford Green - which I visited last night and I would put it ahead of Haberdashers because of the amazing facilities which are much further ahead of most schools including Habs and energy/values/commitment of the whole teaching team. And I was extremely impressed with St Thomas - although we are not Catholic (we are Quaker) this will be one of our top choices (spoke to the Head and approx. 50% of their intake are non-Catholic) and the fact that my son could get a bus there in 12 minutes or cycle there from East Dulwich is very appealing. Harris Boys is also a very good choice for many - many friends of mine have children in years 7 & 8 who are very happy there. We will put it down but we preferred St Thomas and Deptford Green.

[confusedbyitall]

Completely agree tomskip I find the "6" ridiculous too and refuse to fill it up with nonsense schools I have no intention of sending my kid too. You can still be given a school not of your choice even if you fill the spaces up!!!

Another bug bear is being told to accept what you are given...HELL NO....this is why kids are waiting sometimes all summer and into the school term for a school place of their choice. Do not accept a school unless you would send your child there. Unless we as parents start rebelling to what Renata and co tell us things wont change. I intend to challenge anyone that says accept the place next year as again its nonsense and affects the kids who have a school they don't want.

[simonethebeaver]

We loved Deptford Green, and it has been undersubscribed in the past (don't know about last year) so East Dulwich kids would definitely get in. It had a dreadful Ofsted two or three years ago but that came out of very specific issues since addressed; in the meantime people were put off. We were impressed by the enthusiasm of the kids and also the teaching staff. Our 'school that got away'. The SENCO was impressive and they have a class in year 7 set up specifically for kids who might have a difficult transition to secondary, basically teaching them primary style for a short period of overlap to support them.

[LondonMix]

EXACTLY... I'm always confused what people think the alternative is to putting down 6 choices...

katgod Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Better a school you can get to easily/have

> visited/know something about but don't like than

> one you cannot get to easily that you know nothing

> about/have not heard of AND don't like?

[nunheadmum]

Deptford Green is really increasing in popularity and increasing numbers of Ivydale kids are going there - potentially from other primary schools over this side too. So it may well become as tight to get into as many of the others in the area.

[bornagain]

confusedbyitall Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Another bug bear is being told to accept what you

> are given...HELL NO....this is why kids are

> waiting sometimes all summer and into the school

> term for a school place of their choice. Do not

> accept a school unless you would send your child

> there. Unless we as parents start rebelling to

> what Renata and co tell us things wont change. I

> intend to challenge anyone that says accept the

> place next year as again its nonsense and affects

> the kids who have a school they don't want.

If you don't accept a place, no matter how low the school is in your order, your child will not start secondary school next September. He/she will be at home with an uncertain future while they friends go off to their school.

I think I'm right in saying (correct me if I'm wrong) that all secondary schools in Southwark are either OFSTED good or outstanding. No local school is awful!

[LondonMix]

Agree bornagain... All of Southwark's schools are good and outstanding from memory.

And for those who are stating they should rebel-- exactly what do you want to happen. For good schools to be left empty because certain parents don't like them despite most of them achieving better than average national results for their pupils.

[Otta]

I'm genuinely really pleased to hear about Deptford Green and St Thomas the Apostle doing well and being popular. When I was at school Deptford Green was shit, and St Thomas was where you went if you didn't get in to your first choice. Glad times have changed (this was the days when catchment areas were not an issue).

[hpsaucey]

LondonMix Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Agree bornagain... All of Southwark's schools are

> good and outstanding from memory.

>

> And for those who are stating they should rebel--

> exactly what do you want to happen. For good

> schools to be left empty because certain parents

> don't like them despite most of them achieving

> better than average national results for their

> pupils.

Personal opinion, as I realise that they are the preference of some, but might help if there weren't so many single sex ones around here ...

HP