Primary School Admissions Sept 2015 NEWS

[buggie]

Hey Otta - Unsure they would for so few & don't know how likely it is that they'd end up at same school/try to get into another villages school.

... Anyhoo, back to local schools!

[Otta]

Number shouldn't matter.

Share this link with them

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/home-to-school-travel-and-transport-guidance

No doubt the authority won't be quick to offer, but if they know their stuff and then demand it (with threats of solicitors) they'll probably get somewhere. Children under 8 living more than 2 miles from school should be eligible.

[Helga]

I have put 5 schools down. Was very realistic with all my choices (all non catholic) and based myself on distance and/or journey.

The fact that I was offered a school 1.5 miles away that I didn't choose or visited beforehand (Harris Primary Academy) is not so much the issue. The problem is that I don't have a car and I'm dreading the everyday journey on multiple buses or very long walks with a 4 year old. I live by Grove Tavern. Any ideas?

[henryb]

Unfortunately you (like us) live in one of the local black holes - well very limited choice areas. When we applied in 2013 we put the 5 closest community schools and got it in none.

Here is a map for the 2014 catchment areas. The green pins are under-subscribed schools, blue pins are over subscribed community, the red pins are over subscribed non-community schools.

http://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/East_Dulwich_Schools_2014/Hn3Q46F0LW

What is also worrying is the admissions went up 4% on last year. I think that is a lot more than Southwark were

predicting.

[Helga]

Thank you Henry. Like you said, it is a no man's land and these are the families that are being let down by the current system.

[Otta]

That's a horrid situation to find yourselves in at no fault of your own.

Hope you find a solution!

[etta166]

Helga Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Thank you Henry. Like you said, it is a no man's

> land and these are the families that are being let

> down by the current system.

What always suprises me is that the current system can work like this. Why can't the catchement areas be drawn to stop certain people (me included) from having a genuine choice of 3+ schools and you having none? It would be better to skew the intake of certain schools to make sure that all areas are covered by at least one close school, even if that means reducing choice for others. I hope you can sort out a school that you are happy with, or find an alternative that suits your family.

[kamath]

Helga, 2 years ago I like you put 5 schools down and was very realistic with all my choices but got given a school I hadn't heard of which was far away. You are right families are let down by the current system. I just wanted to message you to say hang on in there and see how much you change on the waiting lists for the school you actually applied for. I also contacted Southwark daily - I think they got so fed up with me they gave me a school in the end ! Good Luck.

[Helga]

Thank you for your posts.

I'm not sure if James Barber is still reading this thread but after some feedback and private messages, I get the impression that families living in certain areas of Dulwich/Peckham are not getting any of their chosen comunity schools.

I will send him an email just to make him aware of these situation, if not yet to his knowledge.

[Renata Hamvas]

Hi Helga,

the Belham school had separate admissions this year which means that all the people who have been offered places there also hold a place at another Southwark primary. Over the next couple of weeks parents will be asked if they want their Belham place or the place at the other school this will release 60 places into the system. Even though no immediately near you, this will have a knock-on effect on the waiting lists of local schools. There is usually some movement in waiting lists from now until; September, so it's work checking your waiting list positions for the schools you applied for. Did you apply to your closest schools? You could asked to be added to the waiting list of additional schools.

If you pm me I'd me happy to try and help you.

Renata

[kd13]

More info :

http://adf.ly/UqlO2

[James Barber]

Hi Helga,

Yes I am following thread. Keen to receive your email.

[dhjs]

Good evening Renata

Just to be factually clear about the way we are handling the Belham admissions: we have been very busy seeing parents and carers since National Offer Day on the 16th, and at this point 42 out of our 60 offers have completed all the necessary paperwork by coming along to Dulwich Hamlet.

If they also applied through the CAF, and were offered places in other schools, we told parents to immediately get in touch with both the school and Southwark Admissions to release those places to others. All our parents were appreciative of the need to do this.

This means we are just waiting to hear from 18 more parents, whom we have offered and they are yet to confirm. We have a really long waiting list and will be offering from the waiting list if those 18 decline or we haven't heard from them by the 30th April (next Thursday), so that will then release further places.

I hope this is helpful at this "slightly stressful", but exciting time.

Sonia Case

[landsberger]

-------------------------------------------------------

> Unfortunately you (like us) live in one of the

> local black holes - well very limited choice

> areas. When we applied in 2013 we put the 5

> closest community schools and got it in none.

>

> Here is a map for the 2014 catchment areas. The

> green pins are under-subscribed schools, blue pins

> are over subscribed community, the red pins are

> over subscribed non-community schools.

>

> http://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/East_Dulwich

> _Schools_2014/Hn3Q46F0LW

>

> What is also worrying is the admissions went up 4%

> on last year. I think that is a lot more than

> Southwark were predicting.

No, they went up by the amount the Council predicted and it was a 6% increase in application this year from last. The Council don't know how many kids will turn up in September yet, as there will be late applicants and appeals, but probably about 4-5% higher than last year (which is what has been predicted).

Much is written about this, and using the catchment distances is one way of doing things, but by no means accurate. If the numbers of siblings or late applications stayed the same each year, you could with some assurance say that x school admits up to y distance. The trouble is that the Councils hands are tied very tightly. If there is a shortage of spaces, one of the following scenarios plays out

i) the Council wants to open a new school; STOP ! Councils cannot open new schools, this is specifically forbidden in existing legislation - they must procure a free school or academy for the site

ii) the Council wants to enable a new academy - first - find a piece of land. Then, hold a competition for an academy, or invite free schools to bid. The Council has no say in who is appointed as a sponsor, they are consulted, but that's it. So you want a 2FE community school for the area - you end up with a 3FE Church school who don't actually admit local (heathen) kids. Oh, and adding the search for a sponsor and competition/application adds at least 18 months to 2 years to the process

iii) the Council wants to expand a popular school: STOP ! Do you know how bad the parking is round here ? I can't park here as it is. And the extension will overlook my garden. If we expand a school to 3FE we will have to start admitting children from LAMBETH (the horror of it). We like small schools, if we expand to 4FE, little Cristella will be swamped by other children. All arguments that have played out in the past.

iv) the Council wants to admit a bulge class: some of the above, PLUS a complaint that the bulge class will mean that there will be more siblings in the next few years, and less distance based kids.

v) the Council orders an academy or free school to expand: They can't. That's it.

I may be exaggerating for effect, but not by much...

[Renata Hamvas]

Hello Sonia,

thank you for updating me about the situation with Belham. It's great that your new school has been so popular. Many of the parents who are coming to you would have had held places with other local schools so there will be the resultant movement in waiting lists locally,hopefully very soon.

Hi Landsberger, there is indeed a lot of truth in your analysis of the situation! Helga, I am just about to respond to your email.

Renata

[Sarah9999]

Does anybody know yet when the distance information for this year will be available?

thanks Sarah

[landsberger]

Sarah9999 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Does anybody know yet when the distance

> information for this year will be available?

>

>

> thanks Sarah

You can get the distance information for the community schools already from the admissions team, IIRC, but bear in mind

a) this does NOT include the VA schools or academies as they control their own admissions (this point seems to be missed by many)

b) the distances are provisional, as admissions are still admitting lates/appeals etc

c) the distances can vary massively depending on how many siblings there are in the school. So 250m or less from the school gate may pass muster one year but only 100m the following year.

[etta166]

As a word of caution, the year my eldest started school, I was given on "furthest distance" by the school office of one school, another on the day of the tourof that school and a third one when I asked for clarification. It does not seem to be an exact science... They differed by several hundred metres from the smallest to the biggest answer that I got.

Also, it is hard to predict from year to year. Based on the experience on my road, the furthest distance offered on the first round for DVIS seems to be about 200-250m bigger than the last distance after the waiting list and appeals last year. That seems like a huge variation in one year.

andsberger Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Sarah9999 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Does anybody know yet when the distance

> > information for this year will be available?

> >

> >

> > thanks Sarah

>

> You can get the distance information for the

> community schools already from the admissions

> team, IIRC, but bear in mind

>

> a) this does NOT include the VA schools or

> academies as they control their own admissions

> (this point seems to be missed by many)

> b) the distances are provisional, as admissions

> are still admitting lates/appeals etc

> c) the distances can vary massively depending on

> how many siblings there are in the school. So 250m

> or less from the school gate may pass muster one

> year but only 100m the following year.

[landsberger]

-------------------------------------------------------

> As a word of caution, the year my eldest started

> school, I was given on "furthest distance" by the

> school office of one school, another on the day of

> the tour of that school and a third one when I

> asked for clarification. It does not seem to be

> an exact science... They differed by several

> hundred metres from the smallest to the biggest

> answer that I got.

Well, there is an exact distance but it's not the same every year, and not everyone keeps their knowledge current, unfortunately.

> Also, it is hard to predict from year to year.

Definitely, it depends on a number of factors, siblings, medicals, children of governors or staff (at academies), socials, Looked After Children, all take precedence before distance based kids.

> Based on the experience on my road, the furthest

> distance offered on the first round for DVIS seems

> to be about 200-250m bigger than the last distance

> after the waiting list and appeals last year.

> That seems like a huge variation in one year.

Bear in mind when appeals come, the only chance of success is to prove there is something they didn't take into consideration at admission time, or a mistake has been made. It's insufficient just to say "I didn't get a place". They know that. They also know why you didn't get a place (usually you live too far away from it). They?ll check that the school?s admission arrangements comply with the Schools Admissions Code (which, as Southwark goes through these with a thin tooth comb, is almost always the case),

There is a legal limit of 30 children per teacher in an reception class and this limits the powers of an appeal panel hearing your appeal. They can only consider:

a) If the school's admission arrangements comply with the law

b) Whether a mistake has been made with your application

c) If admitting further children would breach the infant class limit of 30 pupils per teacher

d) if the decision to refuse your child a place at the school was "unreasonable". "Unreasonable" in relation to an appeal, is used in the legal sense and means that the decision to refuse your child a place at the school was perverse or illogical.

[etta166]

landsberger Wrote:

>

> There is a legal limit of 30 children per teacher

> in an reception class and this limits the powers

> of an appeal panel hearing your appeal. They can

> only consider:

>

My son's reception class went up to 31 after a late admission mid-way through the autumn term, and the school explained to us that they can go up to 34 in exceptional circumstances (e.g. multiple birth group, SEN or social need for a child arriving mid-year, etc.) I don't think it happens often, but infnat classes can and do go over 30.

[landsberger]

etta166 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> landsberger Wrote:

> >

> > There is a legal limit of 30 children per

> teacher

> > in an reception class and this limits the

> powers

> > of an appeal panel hearing your appeal. They

> can

> > only consider:

> >

>

> My son's reception class went up to 31 after a

> late admission mid-way through the autumn term,

> and the school explained to us that they can go up

> to 34 in exceptional circumstances (e.g. multiple

> birth group, SEN or social need for a child

> arriving mid-year, etc.) I don't think it happens

> often, but infnat classes can and do go over 30.

You're right, but unless your appeal was based on twins and/or SEN, it is bound to fail.