Lively dogs and little kids - Peckham Rye Park

[Coco22]

For the 2nd time in a few months someones dog has bounded over to my 4 year old whilst we are walking home from school, which has scared him (the first one was twice his size and jumped all around him, the second one was ?vigorously investigating? his school bag). This has made him panic and run ? only for the dog to ?playfully? chase him and therefore terrified him.

In both cases I ran to pick up my son and intervene, only for the owner to then amble up from quite far away and essentially say the dog was "only playing?

Now I?m unsure of dog etiquette as I don?t currently own one, but I make no apologies for being pretty exasperated when this happens given its terrifying for the kid (he was crying and very scared), and how on earth does a stranger know if it wont attack (we?ve all heard the stories )

I did used to own a dog and I accept they are only playing/investigating most of the time, but at 3.30 when the kids are walking home in the park shouldn?t dog owners at least be a bit more mindful and put dogs with this kind of personality on a lead ? We?ve had 2 separate incidents now and Ive also seen it with other kids in the park before

In both our cases the attitude of the dog owners was essentially that we should have somehow automatically known he was playing / and they were defensive towards the dog! We have spoken to our son to try and get him to understand that most of the dogs just want to play so he inadvertently avoids making matters worse by panicking/running..but to be fair he?s 4 and I can imagine why he panics?I assure you both cases were more than a friendly meet and sniff, which hes been fine with!

I hope any 'lively dog' owners understand this side of the story too and put them on a lead, especially at school times

Thanks

[Curmudgeon]

Yes the dog should have good recall to be off a lead and it's not unusual for a small child to be petrified of dogs, after all at that height they are at tooth level. He may well grow out of it naturally. If at all possible try to encourage him to stand still without eye contact.

That said, as a dog owner, I think you're right, but wonder if you can avoid walking through the park as you won't change everyone so the chances are it will happen again.

No you shouldn't have to but it is easier to control your own actions

[first mate]

The owners should have their dogs under better control and not allow them so much freedom if they cannot control them. As a dog lover I hate to say this but technically a 'friendly' dog that 'playfully' jumped up and in the process accidentally injured a child, might be deemed in breach of the Dangerous Dogs Act.

I think dog owners really need to be a bit more aware on this score. The issue of whether a parent would press charges if they deemed their child injured by virtue of trauma is moot, but it may only be a matter of time.

it would be a shame if your child were to become frightened of dogs. I find collaring the owner and then asking if your child can tell the dog to sit on command ,or similar,can help the child get over a bit of their fright.

[j9duff]

Twice this weekend my toddler (age 2) has had similar upsetting experiences with lively dogs. On both occasions she was walking holding her teddy (not waving it about, just calmly holding it) and two different dogs have walked up, taken the teddy (without being offered it) and ran off. The first time the owner was able to control the dog with voice commands and the matter was resolved quickly and apologetically. The second time the dog ran off paying absolutely no attention to the owner's commands (but finally the toy was returned).

Both times my child was petrified and upset.

I've worked really hard with her since she was tiny so she won't be afraid of dogs - I encourage her to interact with dogs in the park (always after asking the owners if their dogs would be happy for her to give them a stroke) but incidents like these set her back.

I love nothing more than seeing dogs running free and playing in the park but owners of a small minority of dogs need to take some responsibility and accept that if they cannot control them with voice commands in a public place then they should be kept on a lead - the same goes for parents of unruly kids ;)

I hope this thread does not become a children v dogs slanging match - that was never my intention - there's enough park for responsible parents and responsible dog owners.

[first mate]

J9duff,

What part of the park were you in when thus happened?

I agree with everything you say and would observe that dogs are allowed to run free on the open, field areas and should, in my view, be kept on lead on the path areas and in ornamental gardens. I think a problem might arise when you have toddlers and dogs in the field areas. My view is that young, untrained dogs should be exercised on a long line. I'd imagine that parents are close to their toddler at all times. If they see a dog running towards their child they could, if the dog is on a line, get it under control. This would likely calm the child as well as the dog.

I can quite understand that the incident is scary for the child and I too wish dog owners were a little more aware. Use of park space means we all have to exercise give and take much more and we cannot expect to enjoy the same freedoms that larger spaces might afford. All I can say is that a sense if humour may help the child to understand that the dog is trying to play, though in an inappropriate way...i say this only to try to avoid any child viewing all dogs as terrifying and I do think parent reaction and attitude plays a part there, though this in no way excuses the actions under discussion.

Actually I've just re-read your post and if, as you say, the dogs marched up to your toddler and snatched the toy from her hand I would be very annoyed. Dogs that snatch objects or food from human hands need to be kept under close control until they have learned their manners. One good reason is that it is not inconceivable that a snatchy dog could accidently hurt a child by, grazing the skin.

[Dulwichdarling]

So you walk through a park and you don't expect to encounter dogs? How utterly ridiculous

I think you are making it worse for the kid to be honest, in my opinion it is the adult who has the fear and then this gets taken on by the kid

Dogs are aloud to run about in most parts of Peckham park, I think people need to remember that dogs are unpredictable just as much as little kids are.

Seriously I think you are making things worse for your kid

[Rook]

"So you walk through a park and you don't expect to encounter dogs? How utterly ridiculous " - the OP didnt say that??

"I think you are making it worse for the kid to be honest, in my opinion it is the adult who has the fear and then this gets taken on by the kid" - They dont sound scared of dogs to me. clear references to having owned one and beign ok with friendly approaches. Sounds like they were just comforting their frightened child

"Dogs are aloud to run about in most parts of Peckham park, I think people need to remember that dogs are unpredictable just as much as little kids are" - isnt that their point??

"Seriously I think you are making things worse for your kid" - how on earth are they doing that?

[Dulwichdarling]

I think you need to chill mate , seriously learn the art of banter

[Dulwichdarling]

kid needs to man up

[JohnL]

One whistle and they should be at heel - the dog that is :)

[Dulwichdarling]

What if it's a puppy? Wish some kids would heel at a whistle

[katanita]

When I was about 3 or 4 I was knocked over by an over friendly boxer dog who then started licking my face. It was pretty terrifying, I thought I was being attacked. My mother's fairly hysterical reaction (whilst understandable) probably compounded it. Because of this experience I was terrified of big dogs off the lead until well into my teens, when I became best friends with someone who had lots of dogs, and grew to understand their signals and more about how to interact with them. But until that point, it was horrible walking through parks with lots of dogs.

It would be great if people who aren't able to control their dogs took more care about when to let them off the lead. Given that that's unlikely to change, I think the best thing is to make sure your kids spend time around dogs and get to know them, and try not to react with fear yourself when something happens. Sounds like that's what you're trying to do.

I also think that when someone posts a very measured and reasonable post like OPs it's sad that there is still some w**ker like Dulwichdarling trying to stir up trouble and make them feel bad. Would you do that to a stranger in a face to face conversation Dulwichdarling? If so, maybe spend some time thinking about what kind of person you are.

[MissMadMoo]

I'm with Dulwichdarling on this.

If the OP has had dogs in the past then they should have more understanding & tollerance.

Sounds like an over protective mother scaring her child into a fear of dogs.....

[Dulwichdarling]

Yes I would. I would say this all in person. In fact I have done, I am not a 'w**nker' as you put it. I merely think that the post was ridiculous. We are all entitled to our own opinions are we not.

I do not need to spend time thinking about what kind of person I am thanks for the suggestion though but maybe you could take it on board too, calling someone a 'w**nker' is pretty over the top for the likes of East dulwich forum is it not?

[Dulwichdarling]

I am relieved to hear that there is someone who has not lost the plot on this forum MissMadMoo

[katanita]

You basically said that it was almost entirely the parent's fault and misrepresented their argument which you called utterly ridiculous. Two posts down you gave the impression that this was just all banter. If that's the case, that's basic trolling, which, when someone describes a distressing experience, seems like the kind of thing a not very nice person would do. And as I think my post made clear, it can be a very distressing experience with lasting consequences. If you weren't just trolling, I apologise for calling you that, but maybe a little sensitivity wouldn't go amiss? Is it that hard to be constructive about criticism if you disagree with someone?

Even if the parent reacts calmly, it could still be a nasty experience for the child, but I don't know what they can do about that. Some (not all, or even most) dog owners just seem to have little understanding of what it's like from the other side and are unwilling to put dogs on a lead even if they have no control over them.

Dulwichdarling Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Yes I would. I would say this all in person. In

> fact I have done, I am not a 'w**nker' as you put

> it. I merely think that the post was ridiculous.

> We are all entitled to our own opinions are we

> not.

> I do not need to spend time thinking about what

> kind of person I am thanks for the suggestion

> though but maybe you could take it on board too,

> calling someone a 'w**nker' is pretty over the top

> for the likes of East dulwich forum is it not?

[MissMadMoo]

It's sad when some people can only respond with personal insults.

[MissMadMoo]

Katanita, One could equally level your point about irresponsible dog owners at parents of wayward childeren...

[katanita]

I'm no fan of wayward children either, but not sure what that's got to do this thread. Anyway, standing by previous comments, I think I've explained why I said that. Have a nice day everyone.

MissMadMoo Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Katanita, One could equally level your point

> about irresponsible dog owners at parents of

> wayward childeren...

[Dulwichdarling]

Yes katanita that is the impression I get ... Its a park... There are dogs in the park.. If your kid is scared of dogs then stay away if you spot a dog... No kid is born with a fear. I felt from the original post that the parent is keeping the fear alive in the kid

so don't be a hypocrite mate, calling someone a 'w**nker' is not called for. I didn't realise banter was such a terrible word to use.

But you don't know me so don't insult me, insulting my opinions is fine but not me

[dwe]

As I understand it "dogs can run free in the common but will need to be on a lead around the cultivated gardens and play areas of the park. The arboretum is a dog-free zone."

Anything that goes against this would be pretty selfish.

[Louisa]

In other news I think wasps should be controlled in the park. Chasing after people wanting to sting them for no reason. Makes me so ..... (Insert word) and I just hate my life and everyone who does anything around me etc etc.

In other news a general election is just around the corner and it's officially spring.

Louisa.

[dwe]

Louisa, what is the point of that comment?

[Louisa]

Just yawning an this pointless thread. Back in the day I had plenty to get my teeth into (no dog pun intended), nowadays we have the same old stuff reheated in the microwave for another outing on the forum. Seriously, a dog in a park runs upto someone? If the dog hasn't attacked or been vicious why is this even worthy of a thread? You confront said issue there and then and that's it. Right, I'm gonna open up a thread about wasps, why to the hell not? Everytime I go to the park they chase me, I want park wardens or pest controllers to do something about it. Those flowers they plant in time for summer encourage these little demons to chase me. They need to be controlled.

Louisa.

[Dulwichdarling]

I have to admit that's probably the best comment that's come out of this post