What the hell is going on on Barry Road? (shooting)

[louisiana]

candyfloss Wrote:

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> I came across this website by accident, and can't

> believe some of the comments I'm reading. I don't

> live in ED I've only ever passed through on the

> train, (and I didn't spot any red carpets or

> gilted benches)but hello don't know if any of you

> realised but you actually live in one of London's

> most dangerous boroughs. Did some of you think

> that just because you paid ???? for an over priced

> shoebox that it came with some sort of forcefield

> to protect you "the aspiring middle class" from

> your scummy neighbours in SE15 (and no I don't

> live there I live in Kent)? The facts are crime

> affects everyone rich or poor, black or white. You

> could be living next to a wife beater who next

> week hits his wife a little too hard and kills her

> - would that be less shocking or more acceptable

> as he was from ED?

>

So you live in Kent

> One of Stephan Lawrence's alleged murderers lived

> in Chislehurst Kent, in a house worth over

> 2.5million, which was allegedly paid for with

> drugs money, so criminals can afford to live

> anywhere including next door to you.

And you have scummy criminal neighbours

And you're telling *us* where to live?

[KalamityKel]

Barry Road still closed both ways this morning (according to the radio)...

[Mark]

candyfloss Wrote:

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> .. to protect you "the aspiring middle class" from your scummy neighbours in SE15.

That's your own quote candyfloss, you imply that someone else had said it but they didn't, you did. Shall we make this a discussion about the shooting and not a postcode/region slanging match because people thought that the suggestion of "checkpoints and resident vetting" was actually serious. And Mikecg stirring things up with his generalisations.

My condolences to the family of the guy involved.

[subtzy]

I knew nothing of this until this morning. I had to sign up to this just to let the good people of ED that mabe they should turn it into an American style gated development where the whites live and all the staff get bussed in in the morning and out at night. that is what i think some of you whant when i read some of your posts.i live by the Gowlet pub, yes it is SE15 and i love living here. now when someone says they want to buldoze me to extend HIS park it makes me so angry and sad that people can think like that about other people. All i have to say to that person is i hope all the people that know you in SE15 threat you with the same respect you treat them.

[RosieH]

subtzy, please don't get angry and sad. Instead please instead read Mark's post directly above your own - no one was being serious.

It's a humorous take on the SE15 / SE22 divide - you might argue that this thread isn't the place for it, but for all you people taking it seriously I would ask, "seriously..???"

[SteveT]

The silver lining is, Barry Rd is so quiet, now the bendy buses aren't rattling the house from front to back every 10 minutes.

[andy&kez]

The shooting happened right outside my flat. I have to admit I am really worried as I have a young family and it really brings it all home. I was looking to buy in this area but I think those plans have now changed, probably move out to the sticks when our lease expires, its a shame as I love the area but I cant afford to take the risk when I dont have to.

Referring to the post above about treating people. Quite clearly certain people dont give a stuff about anything except themselves, it kind of crosses the line when certain people are murdering their enemies!

[Asset]

why, are you a gangland target? honestly the chances of being shot randomly are pretty slim, it is highly likely this was a targeted attack.

I really don't understand this attitude that it couldn't happen here. We live in SE London FFS.

Bad news obviously and condolences to the family and friends.

[lorenika]

This is really scary... I hope police find out whether this guy was killed deliberately... And if he was, imagine the killer makes a mistake and when I leave my house they shoot me instead.. I live just 3 or 4 houses away from where the shooting happened, and I left my house 15min before that, so I can't help feeling worried... I don't feel safe anymore. I know many of you would say 'this is London, what do you expect?', but I guess I used to feel safe here (at least safer than in other areas), and I don't anymore... Really sad..

[ratty]

It's gallows humour - nothing more nothing less. Some people react to terrible incidents like this by saying they are going to move out of London, others by taking the p1ss. It's just a different reaction, neither right nor wrong.

It's fooking awful, but not the first time someone has been topped round here and it won't be the last.

[EDmummy]

Firstly, condolences to the family. Nobody deserves to die in this way. To Andy&kez, I can completely understand your apprehension so soon after this terrible incident but sadly "moving out the the sticks" does not make you immune to witnessing such events. Think about Dunblane - small, quiet lovely Scottish village going about its own business. At least in London the chance of something like this happening to you if you are not involved in the seedier side of life is very slim.

[JohnL]

Its a horrible indictment on London

But as soon as 'Operation Trident' is mentioned - then a swathe of the population can sleep easy.

Maybe its time the press stopped mentioning this - as it's becoming a codeword.

[mssgkane1]

Here a more thorough article ...

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23649925-details/Man+shot+dead+in+gangland+execution+on+a+busy+street+in+suburbia/article.do

[East Dulwician]

I live a few doors up from this so horrible. Came back yesterday and couldn't get down to my house. Press everywhere and cameras. Its still cordoned off this morning but you can walk on the other side of the road now. Police were doing door to door last night.

[Wombat]

JohnL Wrote:

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> Its a horrible indictment on London

>

> But as soon as 'Operation Trident' is mentioned -

> then a swathe of the population can sleep easy.

>

> Maybe its time the press stopped mentioning this -

> as it's becoming a codeword.

I agree that it is being used as a codeword - but is it any less valid than stating explicitly that the majority of gun crime in London is black on black? A lot of people are doing all they can to tackle the issue but being in denial of the severity of the problem is going to help nobody.

[andy&kez]

I understand what ED mummy and Asset are saying but when I have a pregnant girlfriend and shootings takening place around you, you do get a bit of a reality check. I am not normally one to be chased out of an area but this was literally on our doorstep.

I'll let the dust settle and see how we go. Like I said I do love the area but with a family on the way your perspective does change.

[bignumber5]

Asset Wrote:

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> why, are you a gangland target? honestly the

> chances of being shot randomly are pretty slim, it

> is highly likely this was a targeted attack.

Very wise words, Asset.

I feel sad that there is violent crime anywhere, and specifically on our doorstep. Sad for the person involved and their family, and the geography forces me to attend to it. But unless I went and got involved in the whole gang issue, I only think it puts me at any increased risk if I happen to chance by and see something that I'm not meant to.

[Huggers]

Andy and Kez, I understand your concern, but random violence can happen anywhere- when I lived in Kensington twenty years ago, right outside my flat was the horrible incident of the police taking out a completely innocent motorist, dragging him from his car and gunning him down, thinking he was an escaped convict. There were armed marksmen, bullets flying all over what was a very main road. The guy nearly died, but luckily didnt. That was Kensington!

Remember horrible things happen anywhere- that family murdered randomly in idyllic Kent woods on the way back from swimming.

At least we live in one of the warmest most supportive child-friendly communities in London- and I mean ED borders too, as a Peckers lady who has never found such a happy place to live before.

[Murneen]

I appreciate that lots of the stuff on this thread about SE15 are said with tongue firmly embedded in cheeck but some of the reactions also indicate that people are worried about living so close to SE15. Perhaps a look at the most significant piece of research on race and the criminal justice system will give some balance to the debate. Published in 2006, it looked at the ethnicity of murder suspects for three consecutive years (and excuse me for saying this but that is what I think SE15 is code for in these discussions) and in Table 3.5 (page 21) of the report you will see that 1667 suspects were white, 282 were Black and 135 were Asian. I'm not saying this from atop my ivory tower, I live just off Barry Road, Barry's Offy is my local shop and I was on Barry Rd about 15 minutes before the shooting.

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs06/s95race05.pdf

"In total, 2,653 homicides (including victims in the Shipman case) were recorded by

the police in the three years 2002/3, 2003/4 and 2004/5. Three-quarters (76%) of

victims were White, 11% were Black, 6% were Asian and 3% ?Other? (Table 3.4). In

4% of homicides ethnicity was ?Not Known?. The largest number of victims was

recorded in the Metropolitan Police District with 601, followed by Greater Manchester

with 334 (figure includes victims in the Shipman case), West Midlands with 183 and

Lancashire with 155 (includes Morecambe Bay homicides). In West Midlands the

number of Asian victims was equal to the number of Black people. In contrast the

number of Black victims in Greater London was more than double the number of

Asian victims (186 and 75 respectively).

Table 3.5 shows, for England and Wales, the ethnic appearance of victims and

principal suspect (where it was known). Of those cases with a current principal

suspect, 88% of White victims were killed by suspects from the same ethnic group.

The corresponding proportions, i.e. suspects being from the same ethnic group, were

lower for Asian people (64%) and Black people (74%). However, it should be borne

in mind that in 20% of cases involving Black victims and 13% involving Asian victims

there is no current suspect, compared to 10% for White victims (see Table 3.6). In

2002/3, 2003/4 and 2004/5 the police identified the principal suspects in 87% (2,229

cases) of the 2,565 cases of homicides.

In 47% of cases, the victims had been acquainted with the suspects (Table 3.6).

Family members were the principal suspects in 26% of the cases for Asian victims,

27% for White and 17% for Black victims.

[the-e-dealer]

Good to see the Sun is as accurate and un prejudiced as ever

The victim, who is believed to have been in his 20s, was hit in the head and pronounced dead at the scene.

A shocked resident who asked not to be named said: ?It?s terrifying because I walk through here every day.

?Anyone could have been killed if they were here at the wrong time.?

The killing happened at 1.15pm in Barry Road, East Dulwich, in South London, which is filled with large homes.

[AllforNun]

".....given the event occurred so close to the SE22/SE15 divide" What !

no divide darling SE22 all the way, this one is all yours.

the only divide is a small concentration of rubber shoes, folk revivals and facist/liberal fence builders other than that you lot are well badly schooled in all things food related. Once the liberals executive get hold of this one you will probably get a brand new library and a public funded/private only catch-mented school or two.

[Cassius]

I don't think anyone is naive enough not to realise that shootings can and do happen in different areas, however when it IS right on your doorstep as it were, it does make one think more about it. I often go for a quick drink at the Herne on a Sunday lunchtime, and could have been walking past as it happened. That is not to say that a shooting in North, East or West London or anywhere else is not as dreadful or as tragic for the victim's family but the immediacy of it happening so close is worrying.

[PeckhamRose]

I still love London. I still love East Dulwich. I still love Peckham. (And I still love Kent; I grew up there.)

It's the ignorance of many people that piss me off.

Like implying no crime goes on outside London.

No. Of course it doesn't. Never. nuh uh.

Please shut the door on your way out.

Or

That's it. I have lived in SE15 for 25 years but this crime - less than a mile away - across the other side of the park from me albeit in another post code is a crime too far. I'm moving. East Dulwich is clearly a crime ridden hotspot and you're all welcome to it with your million pound houses and posh snobbery.

(Couldn't decide which to post so posted both.)

[andy&kez]

With all due respect to PeckhamRose I am not that naive to think crime doesnt happen outside of London. I dont recall an execution style murder in Hitchin the last time I was there. I am not so much worried about myself but my pregnant girlfriend and unborn child are my priority.

Some of people seem to have a 'get over it' attitude, well come and see me when you have a dead body virtually on YOUR doorstep! Its not pleasant for anyone trust me!

After all this my condolences go to the family of the lad who was murdered, its a terrible thing, but it represents the world we live in I am afraid.

[Pickle]

andy&kez, I know what you mean. There have been other shootings on Barry Road and in the area in the time I've lived in ED, but they've never really got to me as much as this one, and I think it's because I now have young children. It's definitely made me stop and think, and my condolences are with the young guy's family. No matter whether he had gang connections, whatever, at the end of the day he was a young man, and nobody should die in the way he did.

I had to walk down that way today with my kids and seeing where it all happened really bought the reality of it home for me.