Jump to content

Recommended Posts

There is an idea going round that all the newspapers should get together, on the same day, and publish a picture of Mohammed in order to demonstrate solidarity against the Paris killings and somehow 'show' how we feel about freedom of speech.

This rubs salt into the wound, why insult muslims further?


So this is an idea.


For the media to publish boldly, on the same day, something that is truly offensive to their own deeply help beliefs or icons but not of an islamic nature. For example, Tatler magazine putting a cartoon of the Queen Mother giving Hitler a blowy...you get my gist.


This would demonstrate the ability to take offence where as the other way simply enrages people already maddened by insult.

That image has just put me off my dinner, but it's a satire that you would have seen in the political cartoons of the 19th century. The British press was full of such, with no holds barred.


I think it's hard to know what to do, without giving power to the fundamentalist cause. But Reggie is right in that we don't see cartoons in the press ridiculing Jesus. And we take issues of anti-semitism seriously, so we should also think carefully about genuine offence to muslims too.

LadyDeliah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Lol, the Queen sucking off Hitler, yes I'd like to see that


Then it doesn't count, surely? It doesn't sound like you find it offensive at all. Surely the game is to describe something you personally would find offensive.

Loz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> LadyDeliah Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Lol, the Queen sucking off Hitler, yes I'd like

> to see that

>

> Then it doesn't count, surely? It doesn't sound

> like you find it offensive at all. Surely the game

> is to describe something you personally would find

> offensive.



Not much offends me, but I'd like to see the reaction of other people, especially when burning flags (and poppies) had some calling for the perps to be killed.

After the last week I really hope that a liberal press or mind would choose its words very carefully. 'Teach' would be the language of the right wing, surely. To many people it would imply a hierarchy of power, even of ownership of 'the truth', that Muslims are 'wrong' if they are offended (presumably you did mean only those who are offended, not all Muslims - there are liberals in all faiths).


Goodness knows what the answer is. Personally I would like to see a lot more leaders of all religions actively preaching the similarities between faiths as most have similar ideas about how to live a good life.

But this isn't about leading a good life or finding links between faiths. It is about how to react to outrage.

The Times newspaper front page showing a cartoon of a 'satirical' dildo shoved up the Queen's arse would begin to progress the issue.

It's a very complex one though isn't it, because muslims kill each other all the time, and I think, what is actually about regional and tribal power, becomes confused as being the Islamic world vs the West. Iraq is a perfect example of two different muslim tribes hating each other. Osama Bin Laden's real enemy was the Saudi Royal Family, again his idea of a muslim state differed from theirs. Any alliance or dealings with the West becomes the excuse for what is really just internal groups trying to overthrow their governments and impose dictatorship. IS is Al Qaeda and Al Qaeda was the Mujahideen. They are just different names for a conflict that has been raging for decades, and some would argue, since the end of the first world war.

Robert Poste's Child Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> After the last week I really hope that a liberal press or mind would choose its words very

> carefully. 'Teach' would be the language of the right wing, surely.


Liberal is not the same as 'left'. I find both left and right equally complicit in wanting to 'teach' all and sundry the delights of their viewpoint of the world.


Liberal, on the other hand, I could see would avoid it.

Might be helpful to distinguish here between "Muslims" and "terrorists". Much like I expect Christians would like you to distinguish between them and the Klu Klux Klan.


Plenty of Muslims will be offended by cartoons about their faith (as plenty of Christians were about theirs in exactly the same publication).


A tiny, extreme, terrorist minority consider it worthy of a gun fight on the streets of Paris.


I'm not sure anyone needs teaching anything.

Well put, leagalbeagle.


Twelve years ago, in the aftermath of 9/11, I had an American colleague who kept going on about religious fundamentalists. Eventually I asked if that included the one in the White House at the time.

It's a good point that you make Robert.


I also often wonder about the nature of offence. I've been incredibly offended by comments made in the media from time to time, on subjects that are close to me, for a variety of reasons. So, I am offended. But....nothing HAPPENS.


Are we moving into a world in which we somehow believe that it is our right NOT to be offended? We are diverse in beliefs and views. Some of them exist in total opposition to others. We have to learn to put up with that, don't we? Be offended, if we are, and then move on? Not demand that the offence is somehow made up for?


I think that's where some of the hints of hypocrisy come from when we talk about teaching others how to respond. We defend freedoms until WE are upset......


(Within the bounds of law, obviously. Being offended by criminal activity, such as an incitement to racial hatred, by way of example, is not something you should just "get over".)

It's an intrinsic part of the freedom of speech which attracted people of many different faiths to this and other Western countries.


When I was a child my grandfather often used to quote to us, 'I disapprove of what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it.' It's that, really.

It's hard to imagine that publishing ANY cartoon is going to make any real difference.


Saying "look at us, we can take a joke and you can't" is hardly going to have much impact on a group of people who already hold beliefs that are twisted and perverted beyond any conceivable logic.


And saying "we'll keep publishing this sort of material no matter what you do" is not going to make the slightest bit of difference either.

Parkdrive Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> It's a very complex one though isn't it, because

> muslims kill each other all the time

>

> And non muslims have been slaughtering each other

> for decades, Northern Ireland for example, stupid

> crass remark.


It's not a stupid remark. My point was that the media likes to portray fundamentalism as a battle between the Islamic world and the West. I was simply pointing out this is not the case, that fundamentalism is as much a nuisance to the Islamic world and other muslims as it is to the west.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Latest Discussions

    • The issue must be everywhere at the moment. I was visiting a friend last week in Bermondsey, think we were walking  down Linton Rd & we dodged 7 dog poos. It was disgusting. 
    • Thanks for your message — I actually took the time to look into what CityHive does before posting my original comment, and I’d encourage anyone with questions to do the same. Yes, the Companies House filings are overdue — but from what I’ve gathered, this seems likely to be an accountant or admin issue, not some sign of ill intent. A lot of small, community-based organisations face challenges keeping up with formalities, especially when they’re focused on immediate needs like food distribution. Let’s not forget CityHive is a not-for-profit, volunteer-powered CIC — not a corporate machine. As for the directors, people stepping down or being replaced is often about capacity or commitment — which is completely normal in the voluntary and community sector. New directors are sometimes appointed when others can no longer give the time. It doesn’t automatically mean bad governance — it just means people’s circumstances change. CityHive’s actual work speaks volumes. They buy most of the food they distribute — fresh produce, essential groceries, and shelf-stable items — and then deliver it to food banks, soup kitchens, and community projects across London. The food doesn’t stay with CityHive — it goes out to local food hubs, and from there, directly to people who need it most. And while yes, there may be a few paid staff handling logistics or admin, there’s a huge volunteer effort behind the scenes that often goes unseen. Regular people giving their time to drive vans, sort donations, load pallets, pack food parcels — that’s what keeps things running. And when people don’t volunteer? Those same tasks still need to be done — which means they have to be paid for. Otherwise, the whole thing grinds to a halt. As the need grows, organisations like CityHive will inevitably need more support — both in people and funding. But the bigger issue here isn’t one small CIC trying to make ends meet. The real issue is the society we live in — and a government that isn’t playing its part in eradicating poverty. If it were, organisations like CityHive, The Felix Project, City Harvest, FareShare, and the Trussell Trust wouldn’t need to exist, let alone be thriving. They thrive because the need is growing. That’s not a reflection on them — it’s a reflection on a broken system that allows people to go hungry in one of the richest cities in the world. If you're in doubt about what they’re doing, go check their Instagram: @cityhivemedia. You’ll see the real organisations and people receiving food, sharing thanks, and showing how far the impact reaches. Even Southwark Foodbank has received food from CityHive — that alone should speak volumes. So again — how does any of this harm you personally? Why spend time trying to discredit a group trying to support those who are falling through the cracks? We need more people lifting others up — not adding weight to those already carrying the load.
    • Well, this is very disappointing. Malabar Feast  has changed its menu again. The delicious fish curry with sea bass no longer exists. There is now a fish dish with raw mango, which doesn't appeal. I had dal and spinach instead, which was bland (which I suppose I could/should have predicted). One of my visitors had a "vegetable Biriani" which contained hardly any vegetables. Along with it came two extremely tiny pieces of poppadom in a large paper bag.   This was embarrassing, as I had been singing Malabar's praises and recommending we ordered from there. The other mains and the parathas were OK, but I doubt we will be ordering from there again. My granddaughters wisely opted for Yard Sale pizzas, which were fine. Has anybody else had a similar recent poor (or indeed good!)  experience at Malabar Feast?
    • Another recommendation for Silvano. I echo everything the above post states. I passed first time this week with 3 minors despite not starting to learn until my mid-30s. Given the costs for lessons I have heard, he's also excellent value.
Home
Events
Sign In

Sign In



Or sign in with one of these services

Search
×
    Search In
×
×
  • Create New...