On the Ball (new Football Focus)

[Atila Reincarnate]

The Lord moves in mysterious ways his wonders to perform. Bendtner scores twice and we win a game. Whatever next? Chelski keeping hold of a manager for more than two minutes?

[SeanMacGabhann]

Mike - sorry I just can't agree with that at all. In an age when clubs discard managers (to no great effect) at the drop of a hat it is to Arsenal's credit they are taking the long view

Now - it may well be that Wenger has peaked and that a decline is inevitable but for now I'm happy to concede that some events of our own making (budget) and some not (extensive injuries) have put us in a bad spot. But people have short memories. Just a few years ago fans were calling for Ferguson's head as Mourinhio was winning. What if Man U had caved in and appointed someone else. Would they be they force they are now?

[matthew123]

If Wenger had done in his first 4 years what he has done in his last 4 years at Arsenal, he'd have been ruthlesslessly sacked like Bruce Rioch. Wenger is running down his credit and I think two more years of this and he will get the axe.

[Atila Reincarnate]

matthew123 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If Wenger had done in his first 4 years what he

> has done in his last 4 years at Arsenal, he'd have

> been ruthlesslessly sacked like Bruce Rioch.

> Wenger is running down his credit and I think two

> more years of this and he will get the axe.

Using that as bench mark, no premiership manager would last more than 2 seasons at best. So where would all the replacements come from? There aren't many high calibre managers out there, which is we we have hung on to Wenger.

[matthew123]

There is no denying that since Wenger has come to England he has been head and shoulders the best manager in the Premiership - the best football, turned good players into great players and has done it without spending too much money.

The point I am making is that it's only because of his track record that his medium term future is secure at Arsenal - they are presuming/hoping he can reproduce the old magic rather than basing it on potential of current team who look light years away from being competitive..

How many more years do you think Arsenal would wish to keep Wenger as Manager if they continue to flirt with 4th spot every season?

[Atila Reincarnate]

All things come to an end, but who will replace Wenger, more importantly is there anyone out there able to take on his mantle. I don't think there is at this time.

[Sandperson]

matthew123 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There is no denying that since Wenger has come to

> England he has been head and shoulders the best

> manager in the Premiership - the best football,

> turned good players into great players and has

> done it without spending too much money.

How do you work that out? I see no European Cups, three league titles and four FA Cups and an unbeaten season but let's face it four seasons with nothing (if you count this season which looks more than likely) and I can't see how he can be head and shoulders above anyone. Even Benitez got lucky and won a European Cup. ;-)

[Jah Lush]

I still wish Spurs had stuck with Martin Jol. In the time that Arsene Wenger has been at Arsenal Spurs have probably gone through at least half a dozen managers and have never finished in the top four and are still light years away from doing so. Wenger (Mad myopic professor or not) is top class.

The Gooners it pains me to admit have been a trifle unlucky with injuries this season. Cecs Fabregas (their best player by far) has been a major loss because everything goes through him. If they can get him back and the likes of Eduardo fully fit and playing regularly the goals and more success will eventually come.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Sandperson Wrote:

England he has been head and shoulders the best > manager in the Premiership - the best football, turned good players into great players and has done it without spending too much money.

Isn't there a bloke in Manchester somewhere who, apparently, has Won a few things lately (lately being the last 10 ears)..is it 24 Trophies??....might just be a contender on the "long" list for "Best Manager"..

[matthew123]

Sandperson Wrote:

England he has been head and shoulders the best

What sport is that!?

[Atila Reincarnate]

I've no problem with saying that Ferguson is a top class manager but I believe to go 49 games unbeaten is a greater achievement that winning the Champs League, which is a knock out cup competition and can throw up all sorts of surprise. Sure I'd like us to win the Champs League. Having said that, to play 49 games and not be beaten is some feat. But that is more about teams rather than managers.

[Sandperson]

Sorry, I don't get your point Matthew.

I think it's a bit much to blame injuries too. We've lost players over the seasons to injuries long and short term and have usually had decent cover. Look at Park, Hargreaves, Giggs with his hamstring etc. etc. Surely it's the manager's job to make sure that if you lose a player like Fabregas or Eduardo there's enough depth in the squad to replace him? Arsenal aren't short of money. Is it a case of lack of success being to blame? If you go to a club like United you know there's a decent chance of success and therefore are prepared to sit out games on the bench to try and get inot the side at some point rather than thinking srew this I'm off to a club where I'll get more games?

This is not a dig at Arsenal, I know they play some wonderful football and I think that Wenger has a real skill for spotting talent and they are a great side.

[Atila Reincarnate]

Not a dig at Man U but Park is hardly at first team ever present is he?

[Mikecg]

Except they arnt very tough at Arsenal, they arnt as agresive as other teams in the Prem but on a good day they are a very good team to watch.

[Atila Reincarnate]

If you mean aggressive as in Bolton, then I' glad we aren't. Bolton under Allardyce were the epitome with everything that is wrong with the English game, and the failure at grass roots to teach skills, technique, and vision. For too many years the ethic instilled in youg kids if graft aand aggression, and looked where we are internationally speaking at the moment. Our premier league is only the envoy of the world because of the influx and influence of foreign players, mangers, coaching methods, diet, and culture.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Sandperson Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Sorry, I don't get your point Matthew.

Sorry, that was my fault as I left out the first word "In" before England and it changed the whole context of what I wrote, which Matthew picked up on.

[red devil]

This 'going unbeaten' thing is a bit misleading. Great if you actually win something during an unbeaten run like L'Arse did. But in theory you could go unbeaten in a season and still get relegated i.e 38 draws = 38 points. Look at 'pool, only one defeat yet potentially 10 points behind Utd who have lost one more game. The best thing the FA have implemented is the 3 points for a win rule, ensuring that mediocrity comes second best, give me a Treble anyday...

[Atila Reincarnate]

red devil Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> This 'going unbeaten' thing is a bit misleading.

> Great if you actually win something during an

> unbeaten run like L'Arse did. But in theory you

> could go unbeaten in a season and still get

> relegated i.e 38 draws = 38 points. Look at 'pool,

> only one defeat yet potentially 10 points behind

> Utd who have lost one more game. The best thing

> the FA have implemented is the 3 points for a win

> rule, ensuring that mediocrity comes second best,

> give me a Treble anyday...

Load of Ballacks, 49 unbeaten was feat and a half, won't be topped by Man U or anbody else for that matter.

[Sandperson]

I think the unbeaten season and the treble are on an par. (I think RD did say if you don't win anything then it means nothing but Arsenal did win something and even I admit it was a great shame they didn't win the European Cup that year as they were such a fantastic advert for the game.)

I also think that you are a bit unfair on Bolton and Allardyce Atila. I don't like the guy, he tries to run teams with computer software but I think a team plays to it's strengths and Bolton's strength under him was aggressive tactics. It phased Wenger and the Arsenal team (and therefore worked) and since then there's been no love lost but I think that they didn't play unfairly.

[Atila Reincarnate]

I didn't say that tactic was wrong, or unfair but it is the embodiment of what is wrong with the way we coach the game in this country, until we get of the mind set that sets great store by physicality and aggression at the expense of everything else, then we are in trouble, and will win FA!!!

[red devil]

1 trophy for 49 league games unbeaten, not a very good return, do you work in banking?..

[Atila Reincarnate]

You obviously don't work as a comedian cos you're about as funny as toothache.

[ratty]

cough unbeaten season cough pires dive ahem cough splutter ;)

[red devil]

Don't be so down in the mouth...boom! boom!

[Atila Reincarnate]

Like I said you ain't a comedian.