Petition re Dulwich Hospital site

[StraferJack]

Councillor Charlie - do we know more about him? (apart from his pathetic response here)

first mates question:

" "Can you disclose if Harris make any

> financial contributions to you or your party?""

James Barber's reply:

"I can categorically state I and the lib Dems have not and I doubt will ever receive any support of any kind from Harris in any aw shape or form. "

looks like a simple yes/no is beyond our Charlie

[Jeremy]

Also a new primary school is planned for Dewar St, SE15... very reachable on foot for many parts of ED, Nunhead, and Peckham. (although I understand there is local opposition).

[Robert Poste's Child]

EastDulwichLabour Wrote:

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> As an East Dulwich Labour Councillor I will

> continue to campaign for a secondary school on the

> Hospital site along with a new medical centre. We

> will have plenty of primary provision in the near

> future so I am not sure what James Barber's Tory

> friends are up to trying to impose a primary as

> well as a secondary school on the site. They

> should be listening and talking to local parents.

> I would urge as many people as possible to sign

> the petition. I find it very alarming that Mr

> Barber will not answer First Mate's question. Come

> on Jim boy, a simple yes or no will do.

Did anyone establish if this user was actually a troll? I can't remember.

[EastDulwichLabour]

Well done Jim. I did not spot your denial. Glad we have clarified that.

[James Barber]

In lieu of a proper response to Londonmix.

1. Yes. I've never used the language of Harris nunhead and was annoyed when a second East Dulwich Harris primary was so labelled. It doesn't accurately reflect the black holes of admissions to the east and south of East Dulwich ward.

2. No, Harris applied using that name but with supporters across East Dulwich but clustered around Homestall and Ivydale Roads and around the junction of Lordship Lane with the south Circular.

3. Yes, when the application was made and approved by the DfE and EFA Belham hadn't been suggested and Ivydale had been mentioned but no progress or plans were in place. The fact both these later developements have since been made suggests the administration, DfE and EFA all believe extra provision beyond a second Harris primary school is needed for our area.

Blimey Charlie (aka EastdulwichLabour),

Your party leader suggested the new secondary school could go upwards and be tall to enable lots of housing on the Dulwch Hospital site. So I will not be lectured by you on this. I'm agog that your party is refusing to change the site zone to explicitly state only health and education use will be present on the hospital site. Without this change the land for a secondary school would cost ?64M and be the most expensive UK state of all time.

This single factor will lead to pokey sized secondary school on only a small part of the site.

If you genuinely want a secodnary school tell people what YOU will do to reverse this - and sending letters and petitions to David Laws doesn't resolve this as it need Sotuhwark Council / Labour action.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

There is a Councillor Charlie Smith

http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/mgUserInfo.aspx?UID=625

[StraferJack]

cheers DB&B

[Otta]

Despite anything I have previously said on ths thread about James and this issue. EastDulwichLabour has probably done a wonderful job of costing his party seom votes by coming across as an unprofessional moron. Bravo.

[StraferJack]

IF he is an actual Labour representative - I'd say it's 50/50. If he is, I'd agree with you Otta. Absolute tool behaviour (and if he is teh one in DB&B's link, he's old enough to know better!)

[LondonMix]

Can someone show me how to upload a letter to the forum?

I have a letter from Harris that was originally posted by James Barber in the Family Room stating stating:

?For context, and as you know, the Department for Education has accepted our application to open a new school for Nunhead families?

James, do you still contend that the application made to the Department for Education was not explicitly for Nunhead? Do you still contend that you don't understand why Harris called the school Harris Nunhead?

[LondonMix]

Also you did not answer the 3rd question. Yes or no: do you deny that the current official projections prepared by Southwark council for the Dulwich area show a surplus of primary school places?

Please again remember that the documents on this are in the public domain but to save me having to repost them and people have to trawl through them, it would be helpful if you could simply clarify your previous statements by answering yes or no.

[James Barber]

Then Londonmix,

I apologise unreservably for not remembering the letter you describe. Do you know where in the family room I uploaded this? I've not been able to find it.

I'm keen to see it to try and recall the context.

But yes, I can confirm that the supporters came from east and south of East Dulwich ward. I would never have described it as a school for Nunhead. AS I've stated previously I was not and have never been happy with it being described as Nunhead. It's the wrong label for is a second Harris primary school to serve the wider East Dulwich area.

If anyone can turn post codes into a geo map I could share where supporters for the primary schools came from. I'd find this useful to visualise and suspect others would.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

It seems by your email above it's just the name Harris Nunhead that you have an issue with so if it was called Harris Habs or Harris Dulwich two , that would be ok ?

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

Also it wasn't clear by the Harris petition that parents were signing up to have TWO Harris primary schools in the East Dulwich area .

I assumed it was just one school and that has been solved with the Police Station secured as a Harris primary .

[mikeb]

this post

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,1229772,1346955#msg-1346955

[edhistory]

EastDulwichLabour Wrote:

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> Well done Jim. I did not spot your denial. Glad we

> have clarified that.

Is this really a post on behalf of the Labour Party?

If so, by whom?

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

His first post said Charlie Smith if you look at User History.

[samstopit]

The text of the letter from the Harris Federation to the Parent Steering Group is attached. You can see it with the full header and footer on our Facebook page - New Secondary School East Dulwich. We posted it on Facebook along with our reply on 25th June.

The letter which Mike B posted is the steering group's reply to Harris.

The parent steering group is independent of James Barber - we have no political affiliation.

[LondonMix]

But James, the official literature and process for Harris ED never suggested people were supporting the creation of two schools in ED. You encouraged people to lend as much support as possible but that support cannot be interpreted as a mandate to develop two schools any more than the ovwhelming support of the secondary school can be interpreted as a mandate to create two secondary schools.

Anyhow, based on Harris's own words the DfE did not grant them permission to develop two ED primaries but one for Nunhead families and the one on the police site. You and Harris cannot simply ignore that and do what you and they want despite the legal process and the expressed wishes of the community against such a proposition.

James Barber Wrote:

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> Then Londonmix,

> I apologise unreservably for not remembering the

> letter you describe. Do you know where in the

> family room I uploaded this? I've not been able to

> find it.

> I'm keen to see it to try and recall the context.

>

>

> But yes, I can confirm that the supporters came

> from east and south of East Dulwich ward. I would

> never have described it as a school for Nunhead.

> AS I've stated previously I was not and have never

> been happy with it being described as Nunhead.

> It's the wrong label for is a second Harris

> primary school to serve the wider East Dulwich

> area.

>

> If anyone can turn post codes into a geo map I

> could share where supporters for the primary

> schools came from. I'd find this useful to

> visualise and suspect others would.

[samstopit]

Mikeb - my apologies, just realised that the letter from Harris was attached in the post that you referenced.

[LondonMix]

Thanks Samsopit for posting the letter?I am at work!

James the letter makes clear that:

1. Harris intended this school from the outset to serve Nunhead

2. The Department for Education approved it for Nunhead (and presumably based on the shortfall that then existed for Nunhead)

It is time for everyone to grow up and whatever political battles are going on between labor and the lib-dems within the council need to be put aside for common sense to reign.

Please, do not build a school the community has not asked for and expressly opposes?the petition after only a few days stands a 323 signatures (a large proportion of the total support for secondary school). Do not squander the opportunity to create a fully equipped secondary school. Please do not waste taxpayers money building a school that is not needed that will undermine our local schools by creating an even larger surplus of spaces within the primary school system in this part of the borough making them more difficult to run and operate efficiently.

James please listen to your constituents and talk some sense into Harris to give up this battle in which only we the community and taxpayers are the losers.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

Ditto everything LondonMix said.

[LondonMix]

Also, James since you appear unwilling to answer question 3 I will post the information for those interested in seeing the facts themselves regarding projected pupil numbers and oncoming supply.

Please see page 3 of the report for full breakdown.

http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s45063/Report%20School%20Places%20Strategy%20Update.pdf

By 2016, the Dulwich area will have a surplus of at least two full forms (that?s an entire school worth of extra places) based on the most recent analysis. There was a need of 1.5 to 2 extra forms and 4 extra forms are being provided. If Harris Nunhead were located in East Dulwich on top of this, that would create a 4 to 4.5 form surplus ? that is equivalent to TWO entirely empty schools! I hope that puts this madness into perspective for anyone sitting on the fence.

The analysis for Nunhead's needs is more nuanced but with the expansion of Ivydale, the need for a new primary in Nunhead is not as evident. Including the expansion of Ivydale and the Harris Nunhead, 6 new forms will be created vs a projected need of 4.5 to 5.5 (a 1.5 to 0.5 surplus of places). However, the new Belham school in Bellenden is not included in those numbers as it technically counts as Camberwell Ward (despite being very close to both Dulwich and the Peckham Rye / Nunhead ward). The Camberwell Ward area has a projected surplus of one to two forms including Belham so its quite fair to assume the shortfall in Nunhead can also be met by the nearby Belham school (this school will be run as a sister school to Dulwich Hamlet).

If Camberwell?s nearby surplus is added to Nunhead?s analysis, you will have 7-8 new forms to meet a projected need of 4.5 to 5.5 forms (up to a 3.5 form surplus). Therefore, if the new two-form Harris Nunhead did not open at all, its unlikely children in Nunhead would need to travel much further than Bellenden to cope even with the upper range of the pupil forecast projections. That's much more reasonable than travelling to the hospital site and Belham has a site!

[hpsaucey]

Penguin68 Wrote:

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> the NHS Property people are reported to have a

> quote to remove asbestos from thos central

> buildings alone of ?1M.

>

> There is no need, or even requirement, to remove

> asbestos. Asbestos must be marked and a proper

> record kept, (and any staff exposure to asbestos

> dust properly recorded and the records kept for a

> long time) but it is entirely safe if undisturbed

> (and there are treatments to stabilise surfaces).

> It is only when a building with asbestos is being

> torn down (or significantly altered) that asbestos

> is an issue - then of course it must be worked

> with (or removed) with great care.

>

> When already in place (and not being disturbed/

> drilled etc.) then asbestos is a very effective

> substance - a good fire retardant and insulator.

Depends on the type of asbestos and how friable it is. If encapsulated and then left undisturbed then yes fine to monitor it. If its already friable and deteriorating then not so simple...

HP

[edhistory]

LondonMix Wrote:

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> Please see page 3 of the report for full

> breakdown.

> http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s45063

> /Report%20School%20Places%20Strategy%20Update.pdf

These figures do not seem to have any quoted source and the methodology is obscure.

Why do you think they are reliable?

I hope they are not just using 2011 census data.

Does anyone know where "South (Dulwich)" is?