the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 I'm all for free loaders being done for not paying on trains , but here's a situation I had to deal with.My 18 Year old Country Bumpkin nephew got a train from East Dulwich to London to see the museums. First time he has ever gone on his own. He rang his mum from the train saying 'can you pay on the train like in Shropshire?' I told him no!!!!!!!! He arrived at London Bridge and saw a "passengers with fares to pay window" He was going to pay there. I said he would likely get fined and possibly get a criminal record damaging his employment prospects and the only thing to do was get a train back home, hope he doesn't see and inspector and buy a ticket then return to London. Was the this the best thing to do? . His mum is a solicitor and says she would fight the fine as it wasn't an intent to deprive South Eastern of Revenue. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanW Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 No, you just get a ?10 penalty ticketIt's not in any way a criminal offence Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 It depends on the officer. They WILL fine you and give you a criminal charge if they feel like it. I know someone whose daughter couldn't go into teaching because she had a ticket evasion criminal offence.Travelling without a ticketIf you travel on a train without a ticket, you will be liable to pay the full single fare or full return fare or, if appropriate, a penalty fare for your journey.Examples of when a penalty fare may be charged, if a passenger:travels without a valid ticket;is unable to produce an appropriate railcard on a discounted ticket;travels in first class accommodation with a standard ticket;is aged 16 or over, travelling on a child rate ticket;travels beyond the destination of their ticket. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781134 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnL Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 I've done that - I act all helpless and doolally - like I don't know what happened or how I ended up there.They usually let me off. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781137 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 "Usually". If you are 18 with a career ahead that could be ruined I Think going back and buying a ticket is the best thing to do rather than gambling on a nice officer. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781138 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnL Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 the-e-dealer Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> "Usually". If you are 18 with a career ahead that> could be ruined I Think going back and buying a> ticket is the best thing to do rather than> gambling on a nice officer.It's usually a mistakeWe all forget - or tap in wrongly - or once I thought Oyster worked on trains and it didn't (?20 penalty for that).Now - everytime my Oyster tops up - the first tap tops up butdoesn't pay a ticket - I have to tap twice - that catches you out if it's not a barrier - and makes you crash into the barrier if there is one. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781142 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveR Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 A criminal charge for fare evasion requires proof of an intent to avoid payment so the 'country bumpkin' who assumes he can pay on the train will have a good defence. In my relatively limited experience it's rare for people to be charged unless they are persistent offenders, or have altered a ticket or similar obviously dishonest behaviour. I have never heard of a case of someone being charged after going to the 'fares to pay' window, presumably because it's going to be impossible to prove the intent to avoid payment. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 So maybe he didn't need to return to his departure station, thanks, I don't think he will ever travel without a ticket on London Transport again anyway! Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 -- moved topic -- Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781168 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 My sister in law did much worse: regular fare avoidance and even she got off very lightly. Small fine despite getting rude to the ticket inspector too. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781280 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 So why do we bother to pay with all these crooks out there. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781295 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 sometimes you do the right thing because it's the right thing and not because of the punishment? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781300 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the-e-dealer Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 Blimey Emanuel Kant is in the building :-) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781305 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Medic Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 What stopped him from buying a ticket beford boarding the train? I get a monthly pass and quite often the ticket office isn't open so I travel into LB and renew it there. Technically I don't have a ticket to travel but it's never been a problem. Why would you think he would get fined for wanting to pay for a ticket? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781309 Share on other sites More sharing options...
numbers Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 what about that hedge fund manager who dodged paying fares for about 5 years. he had a good innings.didn't seem to flinch at the 45k bill he was presented with when eventually found out. Things like that annoy me!I know for sure I would get caught out instantly if I paid a penny less just for one journey. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeckhamRose Posted September 15, 2014 Share Posted September 15, 2014 But if he can get on the train without going through a gate where he needed a ticket to get through, he may have thought he can buy one on the train. The train from Bromley South which I sometimes get down to the south east coast has ticket inspectors who will sell you your ticket on the train. No fine for having got on the train without one. There: a precedent? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781881 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seabag Posted September 15, 2014 Share Posted September 15, 2014 I'd not encourage 'country bumpkins' to leave the country, this city's awash with people as it isOne less gormeless straw chewer, won't be missed Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781906 Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pibe Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I've been to the fares to pay window a million times. Once I got a penalty fare, usually they're content to charge the journey. I don't have a criminal record, well except you know, you live a fine upstanding life and you kill *one* person..... Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781990 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I'm not dead yet, AND I know where you live Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781995 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 Since I?ve moved out of London, I will often find myself on quieter branch lines where people hop on for a couple of stops at a time. According to the conductors on those trains, if you board without a ticket the onus is on you to find the conductor and offer to pay. I?ve seen loads of people ?caught? by this and the conducters usually show no mercyThen again, I?ve usually been listening to the same people boasting about not paying for the 5 minutes previously so my sympathy is fairly limited Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-781997 Share on other sites More sharing options...
vgrant Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 . Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-782005 Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncleglen Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I used to work at London bridge and regularly got a train at around 4.30 and had a monthly season ticket. I always sat in the same carriage and there was a young woman who also got the same train as me and was in the same carriage. This was the situation for several months. One day an inspector got on and she had no ticket maintaining that she would have missed the train. She gave him money and he gave her a ticket. I have seen grown adults using child passes on the tube. Once a woman went through the barrier at the tube and then passed her ticket back over to another person- apparently, so I've been told, the barrier staff cannot challenge this sort of thing. Also every time I got on a bendy 12 half the passengers did not touch their oyster cards in. I once got on a London Overground train late at night when the barriers were open and forgot (alcohol induced amnesia)to touch my oyster but got off at Denmark Hill and those barriers were open as well!Hence it does not surprise me when fares go up! Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-782111 Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc97 Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 Surely getting back on the train was the wrong choice: if there was an inspector on that train then he would have got caught anyway.I've been fined several times after forgetting my wallet and not realising until I'm in London, I've so far avoided a criminal record. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-782199 Share on other sites More sharing options...
civilservant Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 numbers Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> what about that hedge fund manager who dodged> paying fares for about 5 years. he had a good> innings.> http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/britains-worst-fare-dodger-revealed-3958165 Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-782274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salsaboy Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 The simple answer to this is avoid public transport. Drive everywhere. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/49001-criminal-charges-for-ticket-evasion/#findComment-782310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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