Bookshop out Card shop in!

[Richard Weekes II]

Hi again ED kids, does anybody really know why the Never Ending Story Bookshop closed down? OK, so stuff happens to a small business owner; not the first, won't be the last. Question is, is the bookshop missed? Not a children's bookshop in sight, not unless you want to walk or bus it to the Village or Herne Hill!

Well I for one miss it. No question about it though, those creative window displays were great. A different topic or theme every time; interesting, colourful and most times educational for the children.

They gave me lots of enjoyment; couldn't even guess what the next display would be.

Sad loss.

[RosieH]

You can buy children's books from Review

[melbourne groover]

The bookshop owner closed down to focus on her other business (as far as I recall this is what was on a notice in the window). Agree the window displays were always good though :)

There is a great selection of kids books at Cherner Books.

[alba]

The stock of the Never Ending Story Bookshop missed the mark for the East Dulwich market. I lost count of the number of times I went in to the shop ready to spend, only to come away empty handed. It didn't stock things like Beatrix Potter, the Julia Donaldson books or even books that you could give as a present - eg fairy tale books or nursery rhyme books. I'm afraid to say it didn't have the staples that would have had the parents in this area beating a path to its door.

I did gently ask the owner about gettng more of these kind of books in and she said she was trying to offer something different and also was trying to broaden the type of children and people who would come into her shop.

The owner had been a social worker and I believe this influenced her choice of books - many of which were very worthy, very dull and I doubt ever sold. She also ran workshops for troubled families above the shop and often approached customers in her shop to see if they would be interested in attending. She must have talked to me about the workshops on at least 4 or 5 visits and it really put me off visiting her shop. I wondered if she was asking everyone or just me.

[Richard Weekes II]

Hi there RosieH

Nice to know I guess but I think ED needed its own dedicated children's bookshop. And anyway RosieH we all know that most new businesses take at least three years to establish themselves let alone break even in that time. Maybe more patronage and regularly by more ED folk may have given it a chance for a prolonged presence in ED.

All hail the small Bookshop; Power to the book!

[Marmora Man]

Agree - all hail small bookshops - but restricting the target readership to children reduces the potential purchasers. Segmenting the ED book buying market seems illogical. Upgrading and creating more space in Cheners to widen the selection and include more childrens books might make for one decent bookshop that would take the market.

[Richard Weekes II]

Are you serious Marmora Man?

Cheners has been in ED forever and ever. Did they not have more than enough opportunity to widen; broaden; increase - or whatever term you want to use - and to have; upgrade and create more space for children's books.

Listen Marmora Man; you can moan about or support whatever business you like in ED. Do you really believe that the target readership needs this much nuturing and persuasion to read more? The Never Ending Bookshop and Cheners should and could have been better supported and then we would have had complementary bookshops both operating in ED to service and supply all EDers - young and old - with books. I don't even see many in the local libraries. Talk to me about that and we can have a real discussion! No doubt about that.

Like I said before; All hail small bookshops!

Power to the Book!

[Pickle]

From what I gathered from speaking to the Never Ending Story owner near to when they closed, the closure had nothing to do with lack of patronage, rather it was a decision to close to concentrate on other ventures. The selection of childrens books in Chener is pretty good, and there are other local options as other posters have already pointed out.

Great that you're so passionate about this, but I'm not sure I really understand your motives for your posts (and your increasingly aggressive responses)?

[SimonM]

I would suggest that Cheners has been there "forever and ever" (actually since around 1976 IIRC) because the owner knows the business and his market, and has remained attuned to the demands of the ever-changing ED demographic. In particular he will know which children's books to stock that will sell rather than remain on the shelves forever and ever, and what proportion of his shelves to devote to them.

All hail small bookshops that know how to stay in business!:))

[languagelounger]

Speaking of books, according to the South London Press, Southwark is going to close 4 of its small libraries.

First they junked the foreign language stock, then they junked the books for "intellectual-type people, stuff like that"*, then they junked any book that didn't have nice big shiny pictures in, and now they are junking the libraries.

Southwark's libraries are all very well used. If they offer any space to sit and read they are packed.

As per the Livesey Museum, which the Council tried to sell without having the right to do so, does anyone know if any of the buildings have any protection from trust deeds etc?

If it has really got this desperate re funds, and I can guess that a Labour government might well starve a Lib Dem council it is could (comment made in total ignorance of how local govt funding works), can't we have a vote that they sell off the huge social club for council staff in Dulwich, and anything else that's lurking on the books that isn't actually for the benefit of the despised pubic?

* Dulwich library counter person, 1995. I was trying to borrow a popular English history book.

[Richard Weekes II]

Thanks for joining the debate Pickle but I don't know you and you don't know me. Your opinion of me may or may not matter but do you really need to understand my motives? We post, we don't post! We reply, we don't reply! My personality or style may not be agreeable to you but this is a well oiled machine. Taking rough and smooth; bumps and knocks should be part of the journey through this ED Forum jungle. Toughen up a little bit Pickle and hang loose why don't you.

More people with more passion may be a topic for a new thread Pickle but in this case however I think Marmora Man can look after himself.

I mentioned a 'dedicated children's bookshop' in ED. Some wishful thinking maybe but nothing wrong with that! Demographics, target market/audiences and stats and figures all mean nothing if people don't purchase something SimonM. Here's hoping you have a great year in 2009 and sell lots of children's books.

Checking out the scene is ok; having a few conversations is useful. Regular attendance at the gig is much better though. Buying a book or two; that's fantastic. It's kinda like keeping your finger on the pulse and being in the know alba.

Increasingly aggressive responses; not me Pickle, you've got the wrong Fire Monkey there!

Power to the book!

[????]

Now if we were talking bookmakers and not bookshops.....

[RosieH]

Richard Weekes II - if you don't mind my saying, you seem a bit obsessed with bookshops. What gives? Why does your wishful thinking extend to a children's book shop? How many bookshops do you think an area the size of east dulwich can support?

I don't get it. We have established that there are two bookshops in the area that sell children's books, im amongst other treasures. My recollection of childhood was being taken to bookshops, not children's bookshops. So much more to enjoy, and to aspire to - when I've finished the Beatrix Potter, I can move onto the Enid Blyton, thence to Judy Blume, thence to Jackie Collins. Bet they didn't sell Lace in the Never Ending Story.

[SimonM]

>>Demographics, target market/audiences and stats and figures all mean nothing if people don't purchase something SimonM.>Here's hoping you have a great year in 2009 and sell lots of children's books.<<

Thanks for wishing me a great year: happy to reciprocate. I'll not be sellng lots of books though as I am not in the business:))

[Huguenot]

I think Richard was running chess sessions for kids in the room above the Never Ending Story bookshop. This would put the NES quite high in his priorities, and alternatives like Chener less appealing.

If that was the case, I can see that the NES closure would have been frustrating for him, particularly if (as it appeared) they didn't keep him very well informed.

I can also see that those involved, and of course Richard, may have been seeking scapegoats.

It does seem a bit unfair to blame the ED public though. If the NES didn't have enough customers, then either there weren't enough people in the market in ED, or the NES didn't sell the books they wanted to buy. I think it's rather unhealthy to force people to go to shops and buy stuff they don't want.

Either way Richard, it appears that both the NES didn't sell particularly popular books, and that they didn't close for lack of customers.

I tend to agree with Pickles that your post was agressive in a finger-pointy way, and you shouldn't be surprised if innocents are offended by your attack.

[Jeremy]

I always think it's very strange to blame people for not supporting a shop when it fails (even though we don't think that happened here).

A business should open up to fill a gap in the market and give people what they want. It's up to them to promote the business, and to offer services which differentiate it from online retailers or big chains (i.e. staff which know their stuff, nice environment, good selection of stock for buyers to browse). And they need to give customers what they want, not what the owners think the customers *should* be buying. It is naive to expect people to support a business purely because it is local.

Richard Weekes draws a comparison with the music scene (or at least appears to be doing so). I find this an interesting analogy, as I played in bands in and around London for well over 10 years. You have a poorly attended gig, and bands/promoters blame apathy in the "scene", etc. It's complete nonsense. If people didn't come to your gig it's because they don't know your band, don't like you music, didn't know about the event, clashes with a bigger show, the promoter booked a venue which was too big, etc etc. Don't blame the public, take a look at yourselves.

[Richard Weekes II]

I am a little amazed that a few of you have latched on to the view that my search for some thoughts and comments about anything you might have to say regarding the NES has been aggressive. Of course there are different ways that one can elicit what others think. I can definitely assure you all that there was never any frustration with regard to the closure of NES to me. At my young age (52 now) one tends to accept certain changes and seek out other ventures. (I feel another Maverick moment coming on)

'Seeking scapegoats', a strong claim Huguenot. On the contrary dear chum. There's no need see, me being a Fire Monkey and all that. One fire goes out; start another elsewhere. My opinion (and this is only my opinion) is that you seem to have missed the point somewhat. It was never about blame or fault when I started the thread. (look again at my first post) It could be that I may have been better informed than you think you know! And anyway, what's wrong with analysing a situation and seeking views from others when studying the fallout, to see where lessons could be learned? Don't we all do this?

Surprisingly however,and because there are so many people and so many pseudonyms used on this Forum: could I really be finger-pointing at anyone in particular?

Some of you may have noticed also that there are indeed only a few of us that use our real names. Well I suppose if this is the price I have to pay for being upfront and open about my identity then so be it. I was under the impression nevertheless, that this was a medium for seeking, exchanging and expressing views? Oh well, Maybe even saying this may well be construed as being aggressive by some of you. What's one to do eh? Let it go and just move on I'd say!

So in closing then, I would like to take this opportunity to thank all those who were prepared to comment. Your views are well noted and much appreciated. Many thanks.

No doubt I will see some of you around the way.

Happy New Year to you all. Have fun.

[snorky]

I cant see how it was ever going to make money- no-one I knew was prepared to buy the stuff they had in stock.

go to the library

[PeckhamRose]

What library? They're closing!

[SeanMacGabhann]

Sorry? Dulwich library is closing is it? Knews to me

[candj]

Is the library really closing? That is such a shame.

[SeanMacGabhann]

I dont believe it is candj.

[Siduhe]

I think what PR is referring to is the recent story in one of the local newspapers that Southwark were considering closing a number of libraries in the borough. However, Southwark has since said there are no such plans:

http://www.southwarknews.co.uk/00,news,13574,440,00.htm

[languagelounger]

Thanks for that Siduhe. I hope we can take the Southwark News as the right version and they have ruled out closing any libraries.

It's a bit weird though as I just looked at the SLP website and they still have "Breaking News - libraries to close". Dulwich is not mentioned - surely they wouldn't dare - but Nunhead is and isn't Nunhead is now part of virtual SE22?

There was an earlier story about them chopping some of the many council-subsidised festivals and if the alternative to that would be to lose libraries or any of the remaining services for elderly and sick people then I'm sure they could lose some of the festivals and events without too many tears shed. A lot of the "festivals" are pretty thin affairs and would happen in some form without subsidy. They could also be started up again when the fabled economic recovery happens. I realise this is wandering off topic so I will cease.