Are you a local rail user?

[Eileen]

There are lots of changes being planned to the rail services that run through our local stations - Peckham Rye, East Dulwich, North Dulwich, Nunhead, Queens Rd Peckham, Denmark Hill. If you have an interest in improving services at any of these stations, you might like to register your email address with the Southwark Rail Users Group (SRUG). SRUG has emerged from the controversy last year over the South London Loop Line. It has been doing some work to try become well informed on the main issues so we can be better equipped to comment in future, and influence what is decided early in the planning. Waiting till they decide to consult is far too late to influence most decisions. The current issues include:

* East London Line Extension phase 2;

* effect on local services of rebuilding London Bridge station;

* planned cut in South London Loop Line,

* planned cut in Peckham to East Croydon service;

* service changes to Victoria, Blackfriars, London Bridge;

* station improvements; travel improvements.

The Southwark Rail Users Group is having its first public meeting on Monday 17th November 6.30pm-830pm in central Peckham to throw some light on all this. We have senior speakers from key rail industry bodies. It should be an informative and interesting meeting, and also provide a real opportunity to get views across to some of the people who can have some influence on what happens.

To reserve a place, get details of the venue, join the mailing list, get more information: email [email protected]

[KalamityKel]

What happens after the meeting? I mean how/what information is shared and to whom?

[Jah Lush]

Will the meeting be delayed?, late or cancelled? I say this because I can't remember the last time I got on a train and it was on time.

[Eileen]

KalamityKel Wrote:

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> What happens after the meeting? I mean how/what

> information is shared and to whom?

We will write up an account of the meeting and send it out by email to the SRUG mailing list which is now nearly 200. Any actions for SRUG or local rail users, which emerge at the meeting, will be noted. If anyone wants to be on this list, please email Southwark Rail Users' Group [email protected], saying which station(s) they tend to use.

We hope that there will be a good number of local rail users present to help get the issues, at each of our local stations and their train services, aired in front of the people who can do something about them. There have been from time to time discussions on this forum about problems at East Dulwich station so this is the time and place to come and say something about them. Other stations involved are Peckham Rye, Queens Rd Peckham, South Bermondsey, Nunhead, Denmark Hill, North Dulwich.

[OutOfFocus]

I am busy at the time of this meeting but would be interested to know what happens. Is anyone from the forum able to go and report back what was said?

[tropica]

Eileen Wrote:

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> ..... We have senior speakers from

> key rail industry bodies. It should be an

> informative and interesting meeting,

This sounds interesting but please would you tell us the names of the speakers and which key rail industry bodies they represent.

[Eileen]

Eileen Wrote: > > ..... We have senior speakers from key rail industry bodies. It should be an informative and interesting meeting,

tropica Wrote: > This sounds interesting but please would you tell us the names of the speakers and which key rail industry bodies they represent.

Eileen: The meeting is in two parts:

1. providing some basic factual information about the way the rail system is structured to aid understanding and discussion about current and any future proposals and decisions on cutting, reducing, changing or improving particular services and routes (e.g. highly relevant to the controversial issue of the ending of the South London Loop Line);

2. explaining the support structures and services for users, and providing an opportunity for users to voice their needs and views.

Part 1: Railway infrastructure:

* Speaker: Andrew Munden, Kent Route Director for Network Rail . Topic: The SE overground railway system, including restructuring of London Bridge station, and effects on services at Southwark stations.

* Speaker: senior TfL person from East London Line Project. Topic: East London Line Extension Phase 2: description, explanation & update on plans, funding and construction.

Questions and answers

Part 2: Services and User Needs

* Speaker: Sharon Hedges, Passenger Link Manager at Passenger Focus. www.passengerfocus.org.uk

* Speaker: Tim Bellenger. Director, Research and Development. London Travel Watch. www.londontravelwatch.org.uk

* Speaker: Barry Jones, Area Manager Southern Rail (Manager for all mid Southwark Stations except Nunhead.)

Questions, answers, comments, discussion

Also present for the second part will be representatives of the four train operating companies (TOCs) that are bidding for the new South Central Franchise operating all services to London Bridge through our local stations, including the Victoria-London Bridge Loop line. The Bid Specification can be seen at www.dft.gov.uk/consultations/closed/southcentralfranchise/stakeholderbriefing/

The four bidding TOCs are:

Govia/Southern Rail (current franchise holders).

National Express

Ned Railways

Stagecoach Rail

This meeting is a rare opportunity for users to say what is right and wrong with current services and facilities and what changes they want. Not everything is within the power to change of the rail industry representatives present, but it is key information for them from the users and could especially influence the bids the TOCs make for the new SC franchise.

[Eileen]

This is a reminder of the meeting tomorrow Monday 17 November about our local rail services. Meeting 6.30pm-8.30pm, exhibition & refreshments 6pm. The meeting venue is the Bussey building, 133 Rye Lane, SE15, opposite Blenheim Grove, directions

A key issue which is going to come up is the train service from London Bridge to East Croydon. Southern Rail are cutting the service in December. This will have two bad effects:

* we won't be able to get to East Croydon (and the link to Gatwick) from Peckham Rye, East Dulwich or North Dulwich.

* there will be a reduction of two trains per hour from those stations to London Bridge.

So if those services are important to you, do come and support the emerging campaign to get the decision reversed.

[Jeremy]

You're saying that the service from North Dulwich/East Dulwich/Peckham Rye to London Bridge is being reduced to 2 trains per hour?

[Moos]

J, I think she's saying that it will be reduced BY 2 trains an hour from an (alleged) 6trains an hour to 4.

Plus the cutting of the link means you won't be able to get from Denmark Hill to London Bridge at all any more.

[Pandora]

Came across this in my work travels the other day - GLA overcrowding survey

Email [email protected] to let the GLA Transport Committee know about overcrowded train services.

[Timster]

If this is happening next month, is it not a bit late to do anything about it? Sorry to be negative, but I wonder what the intention is to achieve if Southern have already made the decision to cut trains to London Bridge (presumably a decision that took no account of what their passengers thought about it).

Having said that, I would have come along if I was able to finish work earlier.

[shaun]

So, this cut in services (from East Croydon) will affect peaktime trains? If so this is outrageous and another example of Southern's utter contempt for its 'customers'

[Jeremy]

This is the first I've heard of it, which is surprising (although I already knew about the Denmark Hill thing).

If the East Croydon route is closing, it looks like it will mean the end of the 7:29 and 8:35 trains in the morning from ED to London Bridge, and then two trains an hour during the daytime (at 16 and 46 minutes past). It doesn't look like it will impact evening commuter services.

[JimSmith]

Yes its happening the new timetable is up on the Southern website, the daytime service is being reduced to 4 trains an hour adn we're losing our connections to Gatwick Airport. Seriouly annoying as they seem to have really sneaked this through. I've already fired off an e-mail to Tessa Jowell and I would suggest everyone else does the same.

[Jeremy]

The rush hour service is already too infrequent. I expect that if this goes through, the commute will become unworkable for many people... the choice may even boil down to bicycle, motorbike, or move somewhere else.

Unfortuantely I doubt that Tessa Jowell will be able to do anything about it.

[danrees]

I am not sure about this

http://southernrailway.go-cms.co.uk/content/doc/pdf/timetable_a_321.pdf

Says that there will be a 7.51, 8.05, 8.14, 8.35 and 8.41.

What's the difference (other than one minute at 8.14)?

[JimSmith]

It's the daytime offpeak and the Saturday service that is chnaging not the peak service.

[Jeremy]

I must have mis-interpreted it then! I assumed from the above that all East Croydon trains through ED were being axed.

[Lewis]

I have to say I am extremely concerned about the cuts to the East Croydon service and consequently Gatwick. This has sneaked through and cuts out a service to a huge number of Dulwich residents, and I feel that just because it is being presented as a "done deal" is no reason for elected representatives to sit back and accept it. We may not be able to do anything about it as Jeremy said - but we still at least need to try and hold them to account for their actions.

Lewis

[TJMP]

From the office of Tessa Jowell MP:

Tessa Jowell has already made representations on the loss of the off-peak service via East Croydon - including to the Department for Transport and Southern Rail.

The meeting on Monday was attended by this office and by Val Shawcross. Both Tessa and Val will continue to press for a change of heart on this issue.

One new and surprising development that came out of Monday's meeting was from a representative of London Travelwatch who revealed that his independent organisation that is meant to represent passengers apparently supported the reduction in the off-peak service to London Bridge from Smitham (the one that goes through North and East Dulwich via East Croydon). They supported an increase to another service from 2 trains per hour to 4 tph in preference.

Tessa is trying to establish the reason for this ridiculous decision and whether it was based on any proper evidence. Whilst it is implied that the change was made because the service via East Dulwich was underused, many constituents believe this is not the case for the East Croydon link. Tessa will therefore be asking for details of passenger survey information and will press for a re-instatement of the service via East Croydon as soon as possible should it be cut.

It would be helpful to get an indication of responses that individuals and other local elected representatives may have received so that we can work together and make the best possible case. You can do this via Private Message or to [email protected] but please can you indicate whether you reside in Tessa Jowell's constituency.

[peckhamboy]

At the risk of striking a rational and balanced note amongst the fury, what is the real impact?

- Off-peak trains from ED to London bridge will run every 15 mins instead of every 10. I appreciate that might be annoying for some, but it doesn't strike me as a huge issue.

- No connection from ED to East croydon for the Gatwick train. As far as I could tell, this train was only every half hour anyway - it was almost quicker to go to LB and get the direct train from there. There is an alternative train from Forest Hill which isn't that far away (may even be closer for a lot of people).

And nobody seems to have pointed out that we seem to be getting an additional train in the evening at 2003, which I personally am delighted about. 1949 always seemed far too early to switch from 6 trains an hour to 2 (as evidenced by the fact that the 2019 is invariably standing room only). It will still go down to 2 an hour after 2019, but it's a start.

Personally, I'll be using the new 2003 much more than I ever used the E Croydon train, so maybe I'm biased, but overall I don't think there's too much to get stoked up about. And given the number of people who said they'd like to attend the meeting but wouldn't be home in time, I'm guessing that might be the position of quite a large number of ED residents if they were given all the details rather than just the ones the OP wanted to get people worked up about.

[Moos]

Will there still be a connection from Denmark Hill to London Bridge?

[peckhamboy]

As far as I know, the change to Denmark Hill services is that there will be no London Bridge to Victoria train. There will still be a twice-hourly service between LB and Denmark Hill though - it just doesn't go on to Victoria. I always use ED for LB trains so don't know if that is a reduction from the current service. The DH-Victoria service will only be run by Southeastern, not sure if there's any change to that service, but guess there may be a reduction of 2 trains per hour due to the Southern service being taken away?

[Moos]

thanks pb