Goosed by Goose Green

[Mellors]

So essentially, its all YOUR fault if he turns into a paedo rapist bum slapping perv in years to come. Ok?

[Brendan]

Or, he's just a cheeky kid trying it on and will probably get the wind taken out of his sails at some point and against all odds not grow up to be a rapist and a serial killer.

[PeckhamRose]

Define social taboo.

However, your post, Huguenot, is appropriate and I agree.

Long as we know what social taboo is.

I am equally as interested in what the real reaction was.

Did jollybaby - who admits to initial shock - shout at the boy?

Or did he run off immediately after so he might not hear her?

No problem in admitting getting a kick from being spanked by a stranger in the out of doors, but this was not planned!

I agree, the kid needs to be caught, and spanked...! Course, he'll probably enjoy it. So then what.

[LuvPeckham]

Thank the lord he didn't also wolf-whistle at poor old JollyBaby too...after all publicy admiring a beautiful woman is now a sin that was cast out of society many years ago.....

Playing Devils Avocado here....(something I expect to be thrown back at me)

It always makes me wonder if good looking women were the ones who didn't like the building site workers wolf-whistling at them ... or was it the not so good looking ones who didn't like the building site workers NOT wolf-whistling at them...

[jctg]

I'm really surprised at people's laissez-faire reactions to this here. I find it difficult to see how the kid was merely being 'cheeky'. Huguenot summed up my feelings better than I could have expressed them. And the fact that this was done by a schoolkid apparently when on his own and not amongst his peers makes this behaviour all the more alarming.

[SeanMacGabhann]

Taken on it's own I can agree with you and Huguenot, jcgt

I guess I'm being more laid back about it because the slapee seems fine with it - I trust them to have asessed the situation for what it was. Ditto when some girls did the same to me a few months back I maybe SHOULD have been worried - if nothing else because I might have been set-up. And nor am I saying his behavious doesn't need correction

But given all that, it might have been less dramatic than a worst-case-scenario. I recall being wildly innappropriate when I was a similar age on a few very rare occassions and I don't think I have turned to more threatening crimes over several decades. I'm inclined to believe Brendan's scenario

[jollybaby]

Can I confirm that 1) I am a woman and 2) no I didn't confront the boy. It was all over so quickly and by the time I really grasped what had happened I was a good few metres away from him down the road. I thought about turning round to say something but is seemed so innocent and unthreatening at the time. I have been in far more uncomfortable situations around ED in the past.

When I say I felt chuffed - I didn't want to imply that I got some form of sexual gratification from the event or have any interest in teenage boys. It just seemed like a bit of a compliment - and I have been working hard to lose a few pounds!

I agree it's not usual behaviour to slap stangers' bottoms in the street and perhaps I should have reacted more strongly to the event. That was in part why I posted on this forum as I was interested in other people's thoughts.

[Huguenot]

It's a weird thing this kind of encounter. I tried to do some counselling once but as those who know me would know, I can be a bit abrupt when faced with rational dislocations.... "It's terrible but primally satisfying".

We're an incredibly liberal forum, but we need to accept at some point that not all things are relative. We draw lines in the sand to establish an equality of identity, for example freedom and responsibility are equal partners.

We reserve the freedom to behave like aimless gibbons (bum slapping neanderthals), but are aware that without demonstrating our responsiblity to mutual empowerment we'd still be punching the ground around waterholes with bison bones. So we don't goose arses.

We can't indulge the bum slappers without recognising that in doing so we sacrifice the concept of society at every level: mutual respect and reasoned group solutions.

I can't imagine that most readers think that responding with a smile means one is generating criminality (what??? short skirts and sexual assault????), but we should probably recommend that the visceral response should be suspended if we're not going to egg on a generation of inappropriate copy cats?

[Huguenot]

BTW that comes across just like the public school debater mockney often accuses me of being ;-)

[Jeremy]

I don't think it's fair to imply that jollybaby is in some way guilty for not having a go at the kid. She was clearly taken aback by the whole thing, and didn't get a chance to react. That's not the same thing as encouraging the kid.

And it's OK for jollybaby to feel flattered, but she's not saying that it makes it all OK. I think most of us would agree that the kid was out of order (by how much is a matter of opinion). It's pointless comparing the situation to a girl smacking a guy's bum - apply some common sense and you'll realise that it's not the same thing!

[BJL]

If the sexes had been reversed and a 14/15 year old schoolgirl had been given a "firm slap" by a 30 year old man, would all the "lighten-up-luv/it's-political-correctness-gone-mad" brigade feel the same way? Some teenage girls doubtless would feel "chuffed" to receive that kind of attention.

Can men just walk around saying "nice bum" and slapping anyone they take a shine to? If not, why not? Where are your boundaries?

[Moos]

LuvPeckham Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Thank the lord he didn't also wolf-whistle at poor

> old JollyBaby too...after all publicy admiring a

> beautiful woman is now a sin that was cast out of

> society many years ago.....

>

> Playing Devils Avocado here....(something I expect

> to be thrown back at me)

>

> It always makes me wonder if good looking women

> were the ones who didn't like the building site

> workers wolf-whistling at them ... or was it the

> not so good looking ones who didn't like the

> building site workers NOT wolf-whistling at

> them...

OK, so you only said this to get a rise, LuvPeckham, but I can't let it go unremarked.

The trouble is, not everyone reacts the same way, so almost anyone can honestly quote almost any response to justify whatever they think is right. My take on it is that sometimes a woman can be whistled at and it can make her feel happy and attractive. Another can feel cheapened, threatened, reduced to an object, belittled or even ashamed. Because the latter is rather more impactful than the former, and because basically it's bad manners to call names out to strangers (even if in your view you're paying them compliments) it's generally frowned on these days.

But to suggest that ugly women are jealous of pretty women and therefore 'got it banned' is pretty cheap. Sarah Palin's supporters have been throwing that line out to female media-types "you don't like her because you're just jealous: she's successful and she's pretty". Play nicely now...

[cdonline]

I presumed that there was some kind of general consensus that these kind of things are socially unacceptable, but it doesn't mean that everybody is going to accept these rules. I wondered if the kid was getting a thrill from deliberately doing something that he knew was wrong and breaking through normal social boundaries. I've certainly done things, which in the cold of day would be considered wrong, expecially when I was growing up. I tend to avoid these situations, mainly due to the acute embarassment felt afterwards.

Jollybaby reacted in one way, but it would have been with her rights to castigate the kid or even take it further.

I wouldn't defend what this boy did, but I wonder how many of us would feel rather chuffed when somebody is giving us the eye, shouts sexy at us, whistles, pay us a compliment or even gives us a quick slap on the backside?

Playing devil's advocate, do we worry too much about these things, that we end up living in a bubble and ignore the people who live and work around us.

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

I agree with Huggie- I think it could show a lack of respect and if not challenged could lead to more obnoxious, dangerous or illegal behaviour later on.

I had a 12 year old try feel me up when I was working as a youth worker and when I dragged him by the scruff of his neck and threatened to beat him up, he tried to get me sacked - brought his big misogynist father down to threaten me too.

My daughters have had to put up with little tw@ts in their secodary school trying to get familiar and my son beat up a few guys because of it. I don't think many older people realise how disrespectful to females some young MTV-age guys are nowadys.

Uninvited sexual attention is not funny.

[Loz]

If the sexes had been reversed and a 14/15 year old schoolgirl had been given a "firm slap" by a 30 year old man, would all the "lighten-up-luv/it's-political-correctness-gone-mad" brigade feel the same way?

And if the sexes were reversed again and the 14/15 year old schoolgirl gave a "firm slap" to a 30 year old man, would you still be sitting on your high horse?

[Jeremy]

Loz, it's different. As I said before, a girl slapping a guys arse is not the same thing as the other way round, for obvious reasons.

[Loz]

Oh, go on then Jeremy... enlighten me. What are these 'obvious reasons'?

[BJL]

Loz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> > If the sexes had been reversed and a 14/15 year

> old schoolgirl had been given a "firm slap" by a

> 30 year old man, would all the

> "lighten-up-luv/it's-political-correctness-gone-mad"

> brigade feel the same way?

>

> And if the sexes were reversed again and the 14/15

> year old schoolgirl gave a "firm slap" to a 30

> year old man, would you still be sitting on your

> high horse?

"High horse"? Not at all: I simply believe that it's rude and bad-mannered to slap strangers, regardless of sex or age.

Now I've answered your question, would you answer mine?

[snorky]

IM not being overly PC - but this type of behaviour is repellant.

Looking througfh this thread, I feel as if I have been transported back to an episode of "on the Buses".

[PeckhamRose]

This thread is really interesting. I appreciate people's honesty.

On the subject of wolf whistles from scaffolders: Kathy Burke once said (and I am sure I remember this right because I remember thinking that I feel exactly the same way) when she walked along the road and heard scaffolders wolf whistling, she knew there must be a prettier woman behind her.

An innoncent wolf whistle can make my day (when I check there is no-one else around) but then when I look up to them, they say "Oh God, put yer helmet back ON, love. Yer ruined me day." And thus, so is mine.

[Loz]

I simply believe that it's rude and bad-mannered to slap strangers, regardless of sex or age.

In that case, we're probably on the same wavelength, though using phrases like "lighten-up-luv/it's-political-correctness-gone-mad" doesn't help to explain your position and does tend to seat you on fairly tall animal of the equine variety. I assumed that you had the same thoughts as Jeremy - if [cultural pigeon-hole 1] slaps [cultural pigeon-hole 2] then it's a terribly Bad Thing, but the reverse is somehow OK.

Anyway, I think the original perpetrator is in for a rude shock next time he heads out to Goosing Green. Sounds like there is going to be a hoard of ED ladies waiting for him. More like 'Benny Hill' than 'On The Buses', Snorky.

[BJL]

Loz:

Fair enough - my comment was a reaction to some of the replies ("here comes the offended bus", etc) to my first post.

[Jeremy]

Loz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Oh, go on then Jeremy... enlighten me. What are these 'obvious reasons'?

Quite simply... a woman is more likely to feel physically threatened by a man than vice versa. I don't think I'm being controversial here, am I?

[snorky]

.

[jollybaby]

Now if I could turn back the clock by 3 days would I do anything differently - probably not (well perhaps maybe not write such a light hearted original post) He was clearly after a reaction and ignoring him seemed the better option at the time. And as I said before it didn't seem threatening but more cheeky at the time- far less degrading then when someone 'grinds' against you on the dance floor of a crowded night club (and I WOULD say something then).

Does my lack of reaction mean that he is more or less likely to do it again - who can say. I think you could argue the case either way. Or is my response a sad indicament of the time we live in - when people no longer chastise wrong doing 'youths' for fear of being abused or because of a feeling that it won't make a blind bit of difference.