Carpet stain on rented property - advice sought!

[PokerTime]

Thank you for the correction tfwsoll. They have 30 days from the date you hand over a deposit to give you the TDS information, not 14.

[binary_star]

Amydown if your tenancy has ended and you were never given the prescribed information about the deposit protection then the landlord could be in a very sticky spot here:

"Most notable of the "initial requirements" is that to give the tenant that prescribed information required by the scheme within 30 days of receipt of the deposit...in the event of default, a landlord can be ordered to repay the deposit and a penalty of up to 3 times the value of the deposit"

http://www.buckles-law.co.uk/site/library/managing_agents_news/whats_new_with_tenancy_deposit_protection

I imagine your landlord would rather return your original deposit without having to fork out up to three times that amount on top for the sake of negligence.

E.g "Ayannuga vs Swindells": http://blog.tds.gb.com/blog/failing-to-provide-prescribed-information-avoiding-a-costly-penalty/

[amydown]

This is so helpful. We are still going through the negotiation at the moment but would be grateful for your thoughts on the following:

The angents (under instruction from the Landlord) have asked a local carpet shop for a quote to replace the entire carpet of the bedroom despite our contention that we could not be liabile for the cost of replcing the whole carpet when the area affected is a very small area (would guess less than 2% roughly). I have asked for a quote to repair the affected area only but they are not proceeding on this basis. I also note that no other points have been raised in the check-out report regarding the remaining part of the carpet. We are therefore going to go through Dispute Resolution process for this point.

Meanwhile, with regards to the protection of the deposit, the standard tenancy agreement that we signed had all the standard information regarding deposit protection, including which scheme WILL be used once deposit is used. We signed the tenancy agreement, but never received a copy back with the sigature of the landlord or the agent. Also, although the agreement had said that the deposit WILL be protected, we didn't get the confirmation that this had been carried out until last week when I requested it. The deposit had indeed been lodged with the scheme within 30 days of tenancy but the agents didn't confirm this to us until the tenancy ended.

I therefore think that the fact that we never received a copy of the signed tenancy agreement from the landlord/ agent and confirmation of deposit protection within the timeframe specified, there is enough evidence to suggest that the regulation had not been followed.

Therefore, my question now is, whether we can continue the arbitration process regarding the carpet, but at the same time, can we submit for a penalty order on the grounds of the Deposit Protection law being not followed? The Landlord has released the "undisputed" part of the deposit already although it hasn't reached our bank account yet...

It's getting quite hairy!

[Otta]

Whilst I appreciate the points Jeremy made above about the landlord's carpet, it sounds very much like they have broken the LAW and are bullying you, and I wouldn't even be reasonable. I'd demand the details that by law should have been given to you within a month of your deposit. When they can't produce them (which I'm willing to bet they won't be able to) I'd tell them I want my full deposit back or I will start legal proceedings.

Yes the landlord may then feel hard done by and have to replace the carpet from his own pocket, but I have zero sympathy because he's chosen to ignore the law.

https://www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection/if-your-landlord-doesnt-protect-your-deposit

It may well be that the agents have messed up, but that's for him to argue with them.

[PokerTime]

I agree with Otta. They can't do anything about charging you for any aspect of damage until you have completed arbitration. AND the law has been broken. There is a proper form (that is not the tenancy agreement) that landlords must use for giving you the TDS detsils within 30 days. The check in report should have been agreed with you BEFORE you moved in. You should also have received a copy of the tenancy agreement with the landlord's orginal signature on it too.

You can pursue both things at the same time. I too agree that you should now seek reimbursement of the full deposit in light of the broken law and the time it took into the tenancy to receive a check in report. My advice would be the same as Otta's. Inform the letting agency that you are going to make a penalty submission and state the legal grounds for doing this.

[Loz]

I could sort of understand a private self-managing landlord slipping up on the legislation, but this is an AGENT? What the hell are they doing for their 10% or so? I hope the LL stings the agent for the costs, since they really messed up here.

[PokerTime]

It's definitely a letting agent mess up. The landlord may well end up suing them too. Between penalty fines for breaking the law and the landlord suing for loss of compensation for damage, Id say Amy has plenty of leverage in taking them on.

[amydown]

The agents really did mess up - they have agreed to refund us the price WE paid for the checkin process as the report was never sent to us until some 4 months down the line.

When I asked about the deposit protection, they referred me to a section in the standard tenancy agreement that says the deposit WILL be protected under the Scheme with all the relevant info, but we never got the confirmation afterwards as to whether the protection had actually been done (I.e. "The deposit has now been submitted to the scheme for protection and here is the reference" communication never happened). To my mind, the standard agreement that it WILL be protected is not substitute for confirming it has actually been done.

I am indeed going to pursue both the dispute resolution on the carpet issue and also submit a penalty claim. I think the case will be agains the landlord and then it's up to the landlord to hold he agents liable for any loss they suffer as a result of the agent not fulfilling their obligation.

Again, I am so grateful for all the advice here!

[tfwsoll]

Referring to the clause in the tenancy agreement is not sufficient. The landlord must provide the tenant with a copy of the prescribed information and a copy of the scheme?s Tenant?s Leaflet. If you go to the website of the scheme your landlord registered your deposit with (either MyDeposits or the Deposit Protection Service) you can find out what the landlord is legally obliged to do. I suggest that you point your agent in the direction of the information as well!

[PokerTime]

Hi Amy. Agree with tfswoll. Under the law the tenancy agreement is NOT substitute. Do not accept that from them . They were supposed to give you the folowing information;

Within 30 days:

the address of the rented property

how much deposit they?ve paid

how the deposit is protected

the name and contact details of the tenancy deposit protection (TDP) scheme and its dispute resolution service

your (or your letting agency?s) name and contact details

the name and contact details of any third party who paid the deposit

why you would keep some or all of the deposit - eg because your tenants damaged the property and you need to fix it

how to apply to get the deposit back at the end of the tenancy

what to do if they can?t get hold of you at the end of the tenancy

what to do if there?s a dispute over the amount of deposit to be returned at the end of the tenancy

I'm pretty sure your tenancy agreement does not cover all of that. If it were ok to put reference into a tenancy agreement, the law would say that.

So they conceeded fault over the check in report. Well then you can argue, how can you possibly know what condition the property was in, as there was no documented check in report for you to check before moving in. There is only the Landlords word and you did not aknowledge any agreement with him on that. It's a liability issue and I would argue that liability now sits with the letting agent. They should return your deposit in full.