Overcrowding on peak-time buses in SE22

[Nigello]

I've contacted (according to TfL) the right person to highlight the problem of overcrowding of the 176/185 from Dulwich Library (and therefore further down LL) in the morning. I got an encouragingly engaged reply, which asked me for further details, so I'll keep you posted.

[edanna]

I think they do listen - I used to contact them regularly to complain about how busy the buses were several years back and it did get better. Of course there may not have been a direct causal relationship there but the more contact they get about particular routes the more likely they are to assess them. It's best to supply the most specific evidence you can - dates, times, numbers etc.

[MrBen]

Try leaving before rush hour? Buses before 7.30 offer a much nicer ride in...I skip the 7.30 - 9am slot altogether now and I reckon it's extended my life expectancy.

[Applespider]

I did type a lovely reply to you with lots of details which subsequently failed to post so here's a shortened version. I'm assuming it's because of the link I posted so you might now need to google for the report.

The London Assembly Transport Committee published a report in Oct 2013 (if you search for most overcrowded bus routes in London, it will pop up). It lists the 185/176 as two of the ten most cited as overcrowded in their survey. IT also explains the process that TFL uses and calls for them to publish their plans on bus strategies etc by March 2014. I know I haven't seen any.

Perhaps their engagement is a good start though. In the past, I've generally ended up with an email that says that TFL determine bus frequencies through regular passenger counts and that the 176/185 aren't due another for x years.

I now cycle to work ;-p

[StraferJack]

What me Ben said

I'm a big bus fan. But adding more in rush hour will just increase congestion and slow everything down

[Nigello]

I rarely have to take the bus in the rush hour at morning, given the shift work that I do, but when I do have to do a "normal" shift I wouldn't want to add an extra hour to my ten-hour shifts (and another on the way back) and neither would anyone else. I don't believe that regulating the buses more effectively in rush hours would mean a slowing down of the service: limited-stop buses could really help a sizeable portion of passengers. I'm a great believer in finding a way around things in a practical way (such as altering one's time of travel, walking to earlier stops) but it's not right that bus users should have to put up with excessive overcrowding.

[StraferJack]

But what's so special about bus users?

It's rush hour

That means car users, train users, tube users, cyclists...all of them suffer overcrowding. Because it's rush hour

[GinaG3]

We take the bus every morning for school 176/185. We leave at 8.15am but have still had many occasions where the buses are so busy they just drive past 4 at a time. Few times we've managed to arrive at school 1 1/2 hours after leaving to catch a bus. Tuesdays and Thursdays seem to be worst.

[Miacis]

Nice one nigello. Lots of people have no option but to travel at peak times so more buses would help. Limited stop ones could be an option too

[StraferJack]

So how many more buses would be optimum? And what do you think the impact would be on overall traffic? And what about costings and logistics of so many extra buses in peak hours only?

[charlesfare]

How do you fix a problem like this though? Put more busses on the road and you'd just end up with them all getting bottle necked on that busy stretch of road from Denmark Hill up to Elephant and castle.

[Nigello]

I don't think you'd need to have more buses, just use the ones we have differently, namely by designating a few of them as express. Perhaps for every five normal 176s, there could be an X176 which is express only to and from certain points. I'm not wedded to anything that makes it worse for the commuter, be it cyclist, pedestrian, driver or bus passenger, but I do think people with clipboards and logarithms might be able to help.

[Nigello]

This is what TfL wrote: We are already looking at some issues on this corridor and would like to add your experiences to our evidence. We would then get back to you in due course with our thoughts and proposals.

[sandyman]

I've already suggested this on EDF. An X176 that picked up at, say Goose Green, and then only stopped to drop at, say, Elephant, Waterloo and Aldwych would be an instant hit. In fact it would probably be instantly overcrowded and then we'd be back to square one!

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I don't think you'd need to have more buses, just

> use the ones we have differently, namely by

> designating a few of them as express. Perhaps for

> every five normal 176s, there could be an X176

> which is express only to and from certain points.

> I'm not wedded to anything that makes it worse for

> the commuter, be it cyclist, pedestrian, driver or

> bus passenger, but I do think people with

> clipboards and logarithms might be able to help.

[Reg Smeeton]

The worst congestion seems to be between Dulwich Library and Denmark Hill station - often about one third of the bus empties at Denmark Hill - at which point other bus options appear, especially the 68. A suggestion a few years back on the forum was to have a shuttle bus between 8am and 9am (say) between those two points. If a small shuttle bus stopped only at Dulwich Library, Goose Green, ED station and Denmark Hill that might alleviate a huge part of the problem. I can imagine lots of reasons why this might be nice in theory but difficult to implement in practice, but it is frustrating that the Goose Green/Denmark Hill section is such a bottleneck.

[lane lover]

The buses are crowded through this section because there are a number of lazy people who get the bus for only a few stops to either ED station or DH station; when they could possibly walk.

Also, leaving for work a little early some days wouldn't kill you.

[Bic Basher]

The best bet of getting a seat in the morning peak is to use Route 40 if going towards Denmark Hill or Route 12 towards Peckham which both start from Dulwich Library.