Issuing of tickets in East Dulwich

[LibraCarr]

Hi,

Both my wifes car and mine had tickets placed on the windscreens by PCSO's today, (tax expired 31/08/09) this was despite confirmation emails from the DVLA that Tax, MOTC and Insurance were current and placed in the windscreens. One ticket was dated 1/9/08 the other 09/9/08 (issuing tickets in advance?). I went to the Police station to question the matter and ask to see a superior officer and was told that he was not available as they did not know where he was, I was not given a complaint leaflet, nor a 'CAD' number. Further, I was told that everyone makes mistakes when writing things down and should ignore it. I explained that in magistrates, county, crown and bench divisions mistakes are inexscusable, why should officers of the Met be allowed to make a mistake.

Having taken further advice i again went back into the station and again was refused a 'CAD' (incident/complaint number) I wrote down the time and date of my attendance and told the station officer that I do expect a call.

My moan is that when you go to complain should somebody not see you and investigate the matter, to make matters worse the civilian employee stated that the email from the DVLA may be forged. I explained that I did not think you could send a email with a false address as the senders true identity shows, he just laughed.

On Saturday I paid 460 pounds to our government and then extra tax on fuel and insurance. Is it not time we stood up to the powers that be?

Your advice and answers please.

Regards,

Libra Carr.

[kford]

Have you a bank statement with a transaction to DVLA for payments?

[LibraCarr]

Hi,

Not yet.

My bank only did the transaction on Saturday. This is the english banking system. That said, either the PCSO's have access or their superior's to the DVLA computer and would be able to check (if they can be bothered) whether a tax disc was being sent out.

It is my opinion that they (the PCSO's) only want to make numbers up to look good. If they were to face a serious incident they would poo themselves.

Any comment from a PCSO's would be welcome.

Also, why do the community wardens always look unkempt and unsmart, if I was the council I would sack ..... the lot. (edited)

Kind regards,

Libra Carr.

[EDOldie]

Libra, keep at it, don't give up. Write, complain, and appeal.

[will dex]

LC,

This is so wierd, cos i had nearly the same thing... Bought car tax online, it didnt turn up in time, showed police email confirmation from DVLA - not interested.

i didnt get a fine - as the DVLA had proof i had paid, but the Police notice i recieved was maddening, as was their response when i called in to see them on LL.

Had i not been there they had called the DVLA to tow my car(they then crush them, yes really), even though i bought my tax from the DVLA!!! grrrrr.

[LibraCarr]

Hi,

In my anger I forgot to mention that I saw at least 27 cars with tickets on them, from East Dulwich Grove to the Nick via the back roads.

If they concentrated their efforts on crime support they might be more acceptable in this age, for instance if they saved the shoplifter from being beaten by the Somerfield staff, they may get brownie points.

Regards,

Libra Carr.

[ruffers]

LibraCarr Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi,

>

> Not yet.

>

> My bank only did the transaction on Saturday. This

> is the english banking system. That said, either

> the PCSO's have access or their superior's to the

> DVLA computer and would be able to check (if they

> can be bothered) whether a tax disc was being sent

> out.

>

>

To the very best of my knowledge the offence is Failing To Display A Valid Tax Disc, whether you actually have one or not isn't the point. Were you displaying one? If not then you are committing the offence. You may be able to get off on appeal but no guarantees.

This knowledge based on not displaying one on my motorbike for years as they get nicked and carrying it around in my wallet to show the nice policeman when he pulled me over.

[cathg]

You have my total sympathy but i have to agree with Ruffers above. When I renewed my road tax by automated voicemail a few months ago the disc didn't arrive by the first of the month. Even though the process verbally confirmed by saying something like "you have now renewed your road tax" and the money left my account, when I rang back and spoke to a human I was told that if my car was parked on the road without displaying a disc I would still be committing an offence. I was advised to go to a post office, buy another disc over the counter and claim a refund when the original one arrived.

Best of luck with your appeal though - this is a ridiculously harsh rule and deserves to be challenged.

[Huguenot]

Emails are perfectly easy to forge I'm afraid :(

Since there's a very clear link between 'No Tax', 'No MOT' and 'No Insurance', I'm well with the criminal justice system on this one. My flat mate's wheels were once stolen at 6am although I happened to disturb them halfway through. By the time I got out of the door with a cricket bat they'd apologised (?!) and screeched off down the road in their untaxed, un-MOT'd and uninsured Rover 213 leaving scratches down half a dozen other cars.

It was, of course, every honest person who paid for the damage through increased premiums.

The police explained they were untraceable.

However, if the local government had crushed every car without a Tax disc, this would have been an easier task.

It may seem petty but in auto-crime terms it's tragically true that if you look after the little crimes the big ones look after themselves.

The lesson is to get your tax done early and over the counter.

[LostThePlot]

Yes, sorry Libra, but the law is regarding the displaying of a tax disc. I know, I know, I know, Harsh. But taking an opposing view, they would have to accept every "It's in the post" notice on a windscreen as gospel, and that would just open the floodgates.

Of course the "Handling" of the complaint doesn't really help at all, and i see your frustrations.

On the matter of Tax, the reminders come nice and early, so when it does buy the disc onlince, and get back 20 mins of your life by avoiding the Post Office Queue.

Also, one point that always gets me. If a car is untaxed/insured and so on. Why crush it? Why not seize it, and sell it through the auctions??? Surely a bit more eco friendly! And don;lt get me started on the suggested "10 yr old and off the roads" ruling that someone has suggested for europe....

[Asset]

Yes, agreed. It is the displaying of the disc that is the issue.

I was bloody lucky yesterday. Came out at around lunchtime to put new disc in the car and a DVLA van was clamping a car just metres from mine. I checked the clamped car after and the tax dsic was a month out of date though.

[Cassius]

Just try and sort it out if you are out of the country AND in your vehicle as your tax runs out. You cannot renew it more than a certain number of days in advance so basically you are stuffed. We renewed ours on-line abroad and luckily weren't caught between Dover and ED and the new disc was in the mail when we got back - I can see now just how lucky we were.

[kford]

'Failing to Display a Tax Disc' is seldom used thesedays because a quick check with the DVLA will usually settle things, especially with ANPR technology. Ask any biker - we can go for weeks forgetting to dismantle the holder and pop a new disc in. All I've ever had is a DVLA sticker saying 'We will be checking to see if you have a valid vehicle licence and fining you in the post if you don't' placed on the saddle. This looks like a pair of PCSOs killing some time at the end of their shift. If only they were as vigilant when it comes to litter and graffiti...

[Pierre]

I know last year I renewed my tax disc online and it took ages to arrive. I ended up sticking a print-out of the confirmation page from the DVLA website in my windscreen (with the order code but of course not my full credit card number) with a note of explanation. I got away with it for the 10 days or so it took to reach me, but I'm not sure whether that's just down to luck...

: P

[Al&Em]

LTP - definitely agree with Cassius on this one - you have only a 2 week window to renew, a perfectly reasonable amount of time to be away on holiday and therefore not able to do anything about it. I err on the hard line rule on failing to display, but they need to give people a month to do this - what could be wrong with letting people pay up early?

[nutty]

Actually - I believe you can renew up to 1 month in advance (did mine a couple of months back).

[kford]

Two weeks, last time I tried, so no long holidays when your tax is up, or you'll find your car removed and crushed, or auctioned off at a knock-down price, as my mate once experienced.

[JohnL]

If you park your car privately and get the disk a few days after it expires then the DVLA computer (386 I think) doesn't get you. Go on the road with it out of data and you take a risk I reckon.

Didn't think there was any official period of grace now (there used to be)

[David Mc]

If you park privately, you don't need to tax the car at all - as long as it stays parked!

[Mark]

David Mc Wrote:

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> If you park privately, you don't need to tax the car at all - as long as it stays parked!

and make sure you've declared that it's off the road, the car tax man assumes that all cars are on the road (and should therefore be taxed) unless you tell him.