david_carnell Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 El Pibe Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Nelson, kicked the french about, rasied awareness> for gay rights!!I was going to make that joke. Even wrote it out. Plus something rude about Di. Then hit back on the browser. Damn. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701949 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisa Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Thank goodness for people like Nelson Mandela and indeed Diana for raising awareness around HIV/AIDS. Still such a misunderstood illness which has a devastating affect on individuals both physically and emotionally, as well as being responsible for killing so many before treatments became available, and indeed to this day is still cruelly taking the lives of treatment deprived communities in parts of Africa and Asia. It's so easy to underestimate the influence someone can have just by confronting taboos head on. Diana seen hugging a dying man may seem trivial to some of you, but for me it was a life changing moment following all the scary imagery and misinformation which was doing the rounds regarding this illness back in the day. Louisa. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701956 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 she was never unaware of where the cameras were tho was she?plus, however much it impacted on you, it didn't exactly put her out much did it? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701958 Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_carnell Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Diana = media whorePlease don't even try and compare her to someone who fought to end apartheid. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701961 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 I'm sorry, but discussing Diana's 'greatness' on a thread about Mandela is just wrong, wrong, wrong. You may as well throw Elton John into the mix on that basis. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701965 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisa Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 StraferJack Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> she was never unaware of where the cameras were> tho was she?And why would she be? The woman was hounded by cameras for years, and unlike some whinging celebrities she took the opportunity to use this publicity to the advantage of various causes. > plus, however much it impacted on you, it didn't> exactly put her out much did it?Maybe it didn't, but even if it only impacted on me, and no one else, it was still a force for the good, at a time when most people would not touch this topic with a barge poll StraferJack. Louisa. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701966 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 mid to late 90s? people wouldnt empathise with aids victims?You were hanging around with the wrong crowd love, never mind about Diana Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701971 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otta Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 StraferJack Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> she was never unaware of where the cameras were> tho was she?But isn't that the point? She used her fame to do a bit of good. Sure she could have done more and I'm not a huge Di fan or anything, but compared to the majority of the royals she was a Saint! Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701974 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 "She used her fame to do a bit of good."yup some good for the causes. even more good for herthey weren't difficult causes eitheryeah it's better than doing nothing but including it in a thread about Mandela/apartheid is just wrong Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701978 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisa Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 StraferJack Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> mid to late 90s? people wouldnt empathise with> aids victims?> > You were hanging around with the wrong crowd love,> never mind about DianaI didn't actually state a year, but I think you'll find she was meeting HIV/AIDS victims back in the 80s when the illness was at its height and no not so many people were empathetic. Read the link below, April 1987. http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1291&dat=19870410&id=PidUAAAAIBAJ&sjid=aY0DAAAAIBAJ&pg=5210,2926222And "hanging out with the wrong crowd love", come on StraferJack please, I don't think this thread is one to be getting personal with people. I am stating why I believed she was great in what she chose to do, and to everyone else, I named a few "great" people from the 20th century, all on different levels for different reasons. Of course I am not directly comparing her charity work to a man who defeated apartheid in South Africa. Why does everything on this forum always lead to personal attacks? People may want to take inspiration from the great man himself who despite all the odds managed to bring peace and reconciliation to his country without the use of confrontation. Louisa. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701980 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 " I don't think this thread is one to be getting personal with people. "you might want to reconsider repeating my name then, given that you don't do it with anyone else"Of course I am not directly comparing her charity work to a man who defeated apartheid in South Africa. Why does everything on this forum always lead to personal attacks? "Apologies - I hadn't realised you had chosen a different thread to make the comparison.as for NM bringing peace without confrontation? I'm as in awe of him as most, but his unbelievable equanimity to enemies upon release is amazing, but he was no saint and wasn't afraid of confrontationPS what personal attacks? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701982 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 StraferJack Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> he was no saint and wasn't afraid of confrontationYep... most of the stuff I've been reading about him today conveniently wipes out a big chunk of his history.(although I'm not suggesting that the ends didn't justify the means) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-701996 Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncleglen Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 No one speaks ill of the dead-but no-one spoke ill of him when he was alive despite his pre-prison life. I know South Africans and murder, violence and sex crimes are too commonplace in the country. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Medic Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 StraferJack Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> "She used her fame to do a bit of good."> > yup some good for the causes. even more good for> her> What do you mean SJ? What 'good' was she pursuing for herself? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702004 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdavid Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 The way a subset of the regulars on this forum communicates with each other, some of which is evident even on this thread, makes it fairly obvious that they have never listened to a single word Mandela has ever said. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702067 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraferJack Posted December 6, 2013 Share Posted December 6, 2013 Scattergun approach bigDCare to elaborate?@ alan medic - media profile. Passive aggressive attrition with equally culpable husband. Etc Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702068 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otta Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 Jeremy Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> StraferJack Wrote:> --------------------------------------------------> -----> > he was no saint and wasn't afraid of> confrontation> > Yep... most of the stuff I've been reading about> him today conveniently wipes out a big chunk of> his history.> > (although I'm not suggesting that the ends didn't> justify the means)Similar with Che Guevara, the nastier /harsher things he did are basically swept under the carpet. Not that I'm calling him a Mandela. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702074 Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Bob* Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 BBC seem to have got their schedules mixed-up last night - and accidentally transmitted a Dimbleby 'doc' aimed at and narrated for children - in the post watershed slot.If anyone knows when the grown-up one is on, let me know? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Mac Posted December 7, 2013 Author Share Posted December 7, 2013 Was in a London hotel bar last night and a group of middle aged white south Africans sitting next to us didn't appear to be big Mandela fans but I guess that was part of the problem he was working to solve. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyNorwood Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 Plenty of middle-aged black south Africans who weren't big NM fans either...Mick Mac Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Was in a London hotel bar last night and a group> of middle aged white south Africans sitting next> to us didn't appear to be big Mandela fans but I> guess that was part of the problem he was working> to solve. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702119 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Mac Posted December 7, 2013 Author Share Posted December 7, 2013 And for what reason? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702121 Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyNorwood Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 .. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702159 Share on other sites More sharing options...
malumbu Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 Oh no. That has spoiled my evening.To be serious and not checked other conversations, Thatcher and the party in the 80s saw him as a terrorist.All credit to Jerry Dammers for how he got this into the national conscious. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 LadyNorwood Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Families, friends, relatives of anyone 'necklaced' perhaps...Wasn't that Winnie, rather than Nelson? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702195 Share on other sites More sharing options...
???? Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 LadyNorwood Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Families, friends, relatives of anyone 'necklaced'> perhaps...You're just showing your ignorance - Nelson Mandela was in jail when that was all happening and when he came out he made the famous speech about throwing guns and knives into the sea. It's fine taking a different line but just being pig ignorant is just that. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/39154-nelson-mandela-has-died/page/3/#findComment-702200 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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