Haberdashers' East Dulwich - 751 families supporting

[Stateeducation]

Mr Barber

I find you quite politically/morally bankrupt. Politicians who send their children to private school should have NO say in state education policy. Why should you judge the system you did not deem good enough for your own children?

What's important for a local councillor to make a difference? They should live and breathe the services that you expect the community to use. You do not and neither do others on your steering group. How can you know the feelings of normal state attending children and their families from the ivory towers at Alleyns?

State schools are there for other peoples families but not your own.

Stop playing with politics with our local schools, we deserve better

[Administrator]

Stateeducation pack it in. You've joined the forum today to purely have a go at a councillor. I do not want the forum used as a platform for anonymous individuals with an axe to grind against others.

[dadsarmy]

What a ridiculous claim by a charter governor about admissions.

You've had years of cherry picking highbrow families that can afford to live in your catchment area.

You've had plenty of time to make more places available but you've failed the local community on this.

Now some brave parents have got their heads together you are trying to steal AND discredit what they are trying to do.

It's poor form.

I welcome a free school where parents have a real say and have some influence over how things are run.

>>>>>

Mrs.Lotte

The Governors of the Charter School would welcome community views on the right approach to the admissions policy. The application process encourages innovative models for free schools. But whatever policy is chosen, there will be winners and losers.

Derek

<<<<<<<<

[FatherJack]

I have concerns about the involvement of Lord Nash given his track record, perhaps he'll appoint an unqualified Head or get his wife on board.

Well done to Mr Barber and the Steering group for getting this off the ground.

State education...why don't you get involved?

[Shuggy]

With Charter joining the fray yesterday there was an increase in interest and legitimate debate around the school application, and so it was not surprising that new people joined the forum and added their voices to the thread. But the most vociferous of those: Stateeducation, Arthur Facksake, charlotteswebcam and girlgardener?coincidentally?all joined the forum for the first time yesterday and all did the same thing: posted attacks against the new East Dulwich school steering committee and local councillor. I don't think that all those demands for "transparency" coming from new, separate accounts is actually the most "transparent" way to conduct the debate.

[Otta]

Indeed! Particularly when there is not a useful and constructive suggestion amongst them, just personal attacks and a load of negativity.

[bornagain]

dadsarmy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> What a ridiculous claim by a charter governor

> about admissions.

>

> You've had years of cherry picking highbrow

> families that can afford to live in your catchment

> area.

> You've had plenty of time to make more places

> available but you've failed the local community on

> this.

Hi dadsarmy, that is quite an allegation you make about a school.

If you study the geography around Charter school, most of the northern quadrant is made up of several large council estates so the children from there attend the school in large numbers. I am not sure what you mean about 'making more places available' perhaps you could clarify?

The fact of the matter is, The Charter School is not actually in East Dulwich so that is why most ED families are not in the catchment area. For more info click on the link.

http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=136298

Attached is also a map showing the catchment area - Charter is in blue.

[Stateeducation]

I'm happy to get involved in the steering group and I do support the need for another school BUT I reject HA as the chosen provider and in arguments I will not rehash I believe it has not been a fair process

In addition moderators or site admin you were quick on jump on me yesterday but happy for dad's army to make outrageous unfounded personal attacks on Charter.

One rule for one.....

[bawdy-nan]

stateeducation I know you are new to the forum but the recent forcing of charter to admit children from a nearby council estate (ie forcing it to admit wanley road as a "safe route") has been discussed on the edf in some depth. I wonder if that's where the spirit of those comments comes from? You could catch up with a search on the forum.

[ackroyd]

Bornagain thank you for the link to the data about The Charter. After various comments that have been posted here it was helpful to look at some data about the schools performance and the pupil population of the school. There have been comments and concerns raised about the diversity of the school and the links that you posted along with the map would seem to indicate that the pupil intake is diverse and reflective of the local community, which is reassuring.

[bawdy-nan]

Hello ackroyd.

I don't understand, I didn't read anything that suggested a doubt about the success of the Charter. The things I have read (mentioned here once or twice, and in other places and in the national press:

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2012/feb/01/academy-school-catchment-council-estates , were historic concerns about the Charter fighting being forced to apply its own admissions policy. The discounting of Wanley Road as a safe route meant that a large swathe of social housing did not have access to the school.

The only other thing I've discovered, whilst looking at the Charter website and the minutes of the governors meetings (available online) is that there has been a determined effort to reduce the number of parent governors because "parents tend to be too interested in the operational" aspects rather than the strategic.

The Charter's been a really brilliant success story locally and has been pointed out over and over again it is very over subscribed (which means lots of people want to go there). I don't think anyone would have fought a new school being set up by them if they had gone ahead and done it.

[mariababe]

I would like get back to the point of why we are creating a new school -

My daughter went from a lovely and confident child to an absolute mess when we found out she didn't get any of her choices for secondary, nightmares began, tears at school etc. She really believed it was because she was not good enough for the schools to choose her and no matter how many times I explained it was a silly process and nothing to do with her it didn't reassure. We were given a school my daughter absolutely refused to go to.

I see the same thing every year, parents with fear and stress written all over them, kids in bits....is this what we want as concerned parents/citizens?

We are told to put on our applications 6 schools of our choice, but is it? How lovely if in a few years we really could choose between a single sex or mixed school.

So please lets stop all the name calling, accusations and nastiness that I am reading about and focus on the kids

PS. I bloody hate sherry

[Otta]

Well said!

[ackroyd]

My post related to a number of posts in this thread that commented on and raised concerns about ensuring that any new school had a pupil intake that was diverse and representative of the local community. Some comments seemed to indicate that to get into The Charter you had to be able to "buy into the area" which I found worrying as I wouldn't want a provider that didn't support an inclusive approach. So I was reassured by the data on The Charter intake and then also by the the data in the Guardian article posted:

'The inclusive culture and ethos of the school extend beyond its gates and result in outstanding promotion of community cohesion.'

A fifth of pupils at the school are on free school meals - the national average is 15.9%. Ofsted has noted that the school has a diverse intake.

More than half the pupils at the school are from ethnic minorities, compared with a national average of 22.4%.

Like other posts on here, I think its really important that the new school (whoever ends up running it) be an inclusive diverse school for all of our local young people.

[kristymac1]

Well done to the Steering Group for bringing this issue so far - we are now so much closer to getting a secondary school people want. I posted very early in this thread asking for the Steering Group's ToRs and info on their constitution, not least so they could justify their decisions. There are always going to be objectors, particularly the 'losers' in what seems to have been a 2-horse race, that's life I'm afraid. However, I'm pretty disturbed by the personal attacks on James Barber and members of the Steering Group. We all make choices for our children based on personal circumstances and we have no idea, nor the right to know what those circumstances are.

As it currently lies, we have potentially 2 established education providers vying to open a new secondary in ED - Brilliant! But who-ever eventually provides the new school wouldn't have done so without the hard work and commitment of the Steering Group and James Barber - thank you to them all.

[Stateeducation]

I would like to draw your attention to the following article,

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/09/07/lord-adonis-private-school-_n_1864138.html

I fully agree with Lord Adonis, hence my scepticism of the steering group

[Stateeducation]

In addition I was asked by James Barber for my views/vision for the area.

Something like thus,

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/mehdi-hasan/warren-buffett-is-right-ban-private-schools_b_1857287.html?utm_hp_ref=uk-politics

[Otta]

"More than half the pupils at the school are from ethnic minorities, compared with a national average of 22.4%."

You can't really compare a London school to a national average when it comes to ethnic minorities. National average includes places where there are no ethnic minorities.

[bornagain]

Re: Charter's inclusivity, compare it's statistics to that of Dulwich Hamlet (one of its main feeder schools)

Charter - percentage of pupils who were on free school meals any time in the last 6 years is 30.8%.

http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=136298

Dulwich Hamlet - equivalent figure is 9.5%

http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=136665

As I said earlier, a substantial chunk of Charter's catchment come from the council estates to the north of it, both this side and the other side of Wanley Way. Whereas Dulwich Hamlet has a very tight catchment centering on the Village.

[dadsarmy]

Derek

511 parents think differently to you regarding serving the community. They are voicing an opinion that the current educational offerings are lacking. Charter doesn't serve middle class, hard working families. Families such as this can't afford to live in your catchment area. This is about people power. They are fed up with the casino admissions process. I don't want to gamble on my childs future. I don't want to have to buy into an expensive catchment area. I want fair and quality education for all.

Local schools and local authorities have been caught napping.

bornagain Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> dadsarmy Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > What a ridiculous claim by a charter governor

> > about admissions.

> >

> > You've had years of cherry picking highbrow

> > families that can afford to live in your

> catchment

> > area.

> > You've had plenty of time to make more places

> > available but you've failed the local community

> on

> > this.

>

> Hi dadsarmy, that is quite an allegation you make

> about a school.

>

> If you study the geography around Charter school,

> most of the northern quadrant is made up of

> several large council estates so the children from

> there attend the school in large numbers. I am not

> sure what you mean about 'making more places

> available' perhaps you could clarify?

>

> The fact of the matter is, The Charter School is

> not actually in East Dulwich so that is why most

> ED families are not in the catchment area. For

> more info click on the link.

>

> http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/perfor

> mance/school.pl?urn=136298

>

> Attached is also a map showing the catchment area

> - Charter is in blue.

[LondonMix]

Charter is diverse though it's not fair to be concerned it appeared they were manipulating their own admissions policy to reduce the number of council estate children attending (even if that number is already relatively high). With that said, the Charter is a terrific school.

Personal attacks on the James Barber and the volunteers of the Steering Committee should be condemned in the strongest possible terms. Getting involved to help your local community should not open anyone up to libellous claims and personal attacks.

With that said, learning more about the scoring process the led to the decision would be helpful so individual parents who might weigh up certain criteria differently can make an informed choice about which school to support in light of the competing applications.

I personally want to thank James and the committee for all they have done and I believe they have acted in good faith and in what they believe are the best interests of the community.

I hope that the competing applications don't result in splitting parents so much that neither school musters the support needed for a successful application? That of course would be the worst possible outcome if parents already committed to the steering group process withdrew support in favour of Charter. Can parents support two schools? Does the DfE then recognise that while there isn't necessarily demand for two separate schools, parents would support either school if they were selected?

[intexasatthe moment]

LondonMix ,I asked about the criteria used to decide which school to go with and this was the reply

Belle April 03, 03:23PM

Re your question intexas at the moment - we analysed the schools on our shortlist, assessing them on areas such as proven track record in education; experience in establishing new schools; understanding of the Free School bid process; inclusion strategies and, crucially, the capacity and resources to open the school by September 2016. The outcome of our assessment showed Haberdashers' Askes to be the strongest contender & we are delighted that they have come on board given their track record and experience as a multi-school federation.

[LondonMix]

Thanks- I can see based on those criteria why they selected HA as they have delivered schools via this process before and have more experience in developing and managing new schools. It also does not have any issues regarding inclusion whereas questions could be raised about that for Charter. Academically both schools are very strong but the above combined with having a diversity of providers instead of multiple providers in the same area would make HA a logical first choice from the steering committee.

[Stateeducation]

London mix that is your opinion but not mine.

You should also stop the unfounded attacks on charter. You have no evidence to back up your claims

[Otta]

Stateeducation Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> In addition I was asked by James Barber for my

> views/vision for the area.

>

> Something like thus,

>

> http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/mehdi-hasan/warren

> -buffett-is-right-ban-private-schools_b_1857287.ht

> ml?utm_hp_ref=uk-politics

I agree with you on private schools, but being as we are where we are, this is not really the place to have the debate.

And I disgree that someone that sends their child to a private school has no right to have a say on state schools, especially when we have no idea why they made their decision (for PERSONAL reasons which have no place on this forum).