Racist/Offensive Chanting

[Loz]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24746019

OK, complete scum... but a jail term? For this? Really?

[????]

mmmmm. I am not sure you'd get a jail term for singing songs praising Bin Laden as an example.

Utter scumbags though.

[El Pibe]

Wow 18 months.

That chap on motorway cops who caused a serious accident, driving with no licence, having previously killed people in a car, got less than that.

Football fans in ignorant, racist song shocker!

Still, twonks, my sympathies for their plight are zilch!!

[DaveR]

The offence that they were convicted of requires threatening behaviour

"with intent to cause that person to believe that immediate unlawful violence will be used against him or another by any person

or: whereby that person is likely to believe that such violence will be used"

so it has to be more than just causing offence. Sometimes putting people in fear of violence, particularly by a group of people and, as here, where it's not easy to get away, can be just as serious as actually using violence.

That having been said, the lesser public order offences are IMHO those most open to abuse by police and prosecutors. It's often a fine judgment whether someone has caused fear of violence or "harassment, alarm or distress"; the maximum penalty for the latter is a fine. The comments by the prosecutor that people were 'shocked and disgusted' perhaps suggests that this was a case close to the line, but obviously we haven't heard the evidence actually given.

[????]

Anyway, my prejudice on this is that there will be many over on the Grauniad website, who are normally in the "prison doesn't work' camp who will without any self awareness whatsoever be saying 'throw away the key; lock up the scum' type stuff

..you know, white, working class, don't really count

[El Pibe]

To be fair every single news providers' comments read like Private Eye's "From The Messageboards"

[????]

'tis true

[uncleglen]

Yep, ???? is right about the white working class male who has been systematically ignored. (For example, in the year when Liverpool got the European City of Culture the lowest entry was a Liverpudlian Boys School where only 2% of the pupils achieved 5 GCSE A to C grades!)

[LondonMix]

How intimidating and frightening would a group of men need to be before you actually rang the police in fear... Without know all the facts, turning this into a discussion on the victimisation of white working class men is odd. I'm with DaveR on this.

[david_carnell]

LondonMix Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> How intimidating and frightening would a group of

> men need to be before you actually rang the police

> in fear... Without know all the facts, turning

> this into a discussion on the victimisation of

> white working class men is odd. I'm with DaveR on

> this.

Quite. A bizarre turn of events. I wasn't aware being rich enough to attend a football match made you part of some white underclass either.

[sheemy]

???? Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> mmmmm. I am not sure you'd get a jail term for

> singing songs praising Bin Laden as an example.

>

> Utter scumbags though.

Yes I think you would possibly get a jail term for praising Bin Laden, possibly a control order or be detained indeterminately without charge. You can receive up to 7 years in prison for glorifying terrorism.

These 'white working class' "glorified and idolised" the murder of Stephen Lawrence. There are also a number of Asian working class who have glorified terrorism and been dealt far harsher punishments.

1

[????]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-12664346

[david_carnell]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-12576973

Sean Larkin QC, prosecuting, told the trial: "These were glorifying terrorism."

In context, 18 months seems about right.

I don't get it ???? - why are you looking to defend these chaps and turn this into poor-old-downtrodden-whitey vs no-one-can-say-anything-against-them-muslims? You've previously argued that strong prison sentences deterred football hooliganism in the past. Is this not similar?

And as I've shown, it's pretty easy to find strong jail terms for people that are only associated with "terrorism" in the most loose fashion. And I can play the Guantanamo card too where hundreds were held without charge or evidence for years.

[Loz]

... and both are poor sentences.

?50 is an insult. He would have got worse if he'd been illegally parked while he did it.

But five years? In fact, any jail sentence for that kind of thing? Madness.

[Otta]

Lets not forget how big the Stephen Lawrence case is, and how embarrassing it's been for the police and other authorities over the years. That aspect alone probably sealed their fates.

Personally I think they deserve it, cunts.

And I'm saddened to see that it was Charlton supporters. Generally a nice family club with not a lot of this type of scum.