Trying to buy a house in this area is near impossible

[simonethebeaver]

Not true that this didn't happen a few years ago. I bought in 2006 and people were making offers without even viewing back then. After losing out repeatedly, I finally got my flat by being the first to view, being lucky to be shown round by the owner and form a bit of rapport, and then sitting on the phone next morning to make an offer first thing. It took months to get anything.

[Blackcurrant]

simonethebeaver Wrote:

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> Not true that this didn't happen a few years ago.

> I bought in 2006 and people were making offers

> without even viewing back then. After losing out

> repeatedly, I finally got my flat by being the

> first to view, being lucky to be shown round by

> the owner and form a bit of rapport, and then

> sitting on the phone next morning to make an offer

> first thing. It took months to get anything.

I was viewing around that time too and remember it being busy, but not so bad that every property went to sealed bids. Mind you, I was looking through 2007, by which time it might have started cooling.

Anyway, it didn't end well that time either - prices fell about 20% in 2008. Maybe this time it's different?

[Jeremy]

Blackcurrant Wrote:

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> Anyway, it didn't end well that time either -

> prices fell about 20% in 2008.

In London? Not as I recall... more like a small blip for a year or so.

[Jeremy]

Jeremy Wrote:

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> In London? Not as I recall... more like a small

> blip for a year or so.

Seems I recall wrong... prices did fall almost bang on 20% in London (although they soon climbed back up again).

[DaveR]

"Like the current frenzy, that was caused by the government meddling clumsily with the market"

I don't think this is accurate, either. Help to Buy is a minimal factor in the current London property market. It's much more straightforward supply/demand.

[Blackcurrant]

DaveR Wrote:

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> "Like the current frenzy, that was caused by the

> government meddling clumsily with the market"

>

> I don't think this is accurate, either. Help to

> Buy is a minimal factor in the current London

> property market. It's much more straightforward

> supply/demand.

Yes, but the government can stimulate demand by cutting the bank rate. The main reason prices turned in 2009 was the cut to 0.5%. This not only makes mortgages dirt cheap for people with equity - it drives investors out of cash and into shares or property. QE also pushed down the value of sterling by about 20%, which stimulated foreign demand.

I agree that help to buy will have a minimal impact long term, but in the short term it's had a huge impact in sentiment. It's Nudge-inspired behavioural economics and is working.

Supply is obviously too tight in London, but when house prices become misaligned with rental yields there are other factors at work. If those factors change, prices can fall even with supply remaining tight.

[????]

Blackcurrant Wrote:

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> aileking Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > My experience: you look at Zoopla every day. As

> > soon as something of interest comes up you

> phone

> > and get an appointment. They do a block viewing

> a

> > few days later on the Saturday where at least

> 30

> > other people are looking at the property

> > (apparently at the latest one 60.....). Offers

> in

> > on Monday where there is often 10-14 offers on

> the

> > table (you are out of the game if you would

> want

> > to think about it or have a second viewing).

> I've

> > done this at least six times without success.

> I've

> > got no chain, 20% deposit and usually have

> ended

> > up bidding over the asking price, but still

> > haven't succeeded. And this isn't even East

> > Dulwich, it's the surrounding areas. Sometimes

> I

> > could have afforded to bid higher, but you

> start

> > feeling uneasy about paying such ridiculous

> > prices. On Zoopla it often says what the

> property

> > last sold for and in some cases the seller

> bought

> > that property for half the price about 5 years

> > ago. Most have gone up at least ?100,000 in the

> > last 3 years. But what do you do? Pay ?15,000 a

> > year in rent towards your landlords mortgage or

> > pay your own mortgage at an over inflated

> price?

>

> Amazing. It was never this bad during the boom

> that led up to the financial crisis. The last time

> people were panic buying london property was

> during the MIRAS fiasco back in 88. Like the

> current frenzy, that was caused by the government

> meddling clumsily with the market. After MIRAS was

> withdrawn and the panic to buy ended abruptly,

> prices in London fell 30% on average but a lot

> more for cheaper properties in less salubrious

> areas, such as ED and Peckham - neither were

> remotely trendy back then.

>

> There currently seems to be a conviction that

> London property is a one-way bet and that buyers

> have to get on ladder before it's too late. The

> faster prices rise, the greater the pressure to

> buy. I've heard tales of prices rising 50% a year

> in SE London. Clearly unsustainable, and likely to

> end messily.

Er, strange logic - Miras itself was actually the govt meddling with the market and giving middle-class homeowners a tax break. Whilst its withdrawal did indeed cause a massive buying frenzy and horrible crash...that withdrawal was actually moving to a purer market than a meddled in one (ie by removing tax relief on mortgages).

[Mick Mac]

People bought prior to the expiration of MIRAS (a mortgage interest related tax deduction) yes, but the end of that relief was just one factor in the crash, mainly it was very high interest rates in the early 1990s.

"This week (in 2012) heralds the third anniversary of the base rate reduction to an historic low of 0.5%, and the 22nd anniversary of mortgage interest rates peaking at 15.4%. HSBC rings in the changes over the past 22 years."

The attached table tells the story.

http://www.newsroom.hsbc.co.uk/press/release/22_years_since_mortgages_peake

[Mick Mac]

Earlier, the Office for National Statistics said the unemployment rate fell to 7.6 percent in the three months to September from 7.7 percent in the previous three-month period. The Bank of England is watching the rate closely, having said it won't consider raising interest rates before unemployment hits 7 percent.

Carney sought to ease concerns that hitting that unemployment level will trigger an automatic increase in interest rates, calling it a "staging post" for thinking about policy.

The faster than anticipated fall in unemployment, combined with a more buoyant economic growth outlook, to change the Bank's projections. According to the projections, the Bank thinks there is now a greater than 50 percent probability of the 7 percent threshold being achieved by the third quarter of 2015. That's been brought forward from the second quarter of 2016.

However, the Bank has also revised down its forecasts for inflation, which remains its primary policy concern. Inflation is expected to fall to around the 2 percent target over the next year.

[Otta]

I'm having my first experience of Foxtons.

2 more or less identical flats in a big block, one under offer at 195k. The other with Foxtons priced ?20k higher, and not surprisingly not under offer. I suspect offers may have been made, but they're probably urging the vendor to hold out, and the way things are going, someone will be desperate enough to meet the price, thus pushing things up a further 10%

CUNTS!!!!!!

[KrackersMaracas]

I suspect you're exactly right. We bought our first place through Foxtons - NEVER AGAIN! We didn't have anything to compare it to at the time, and it was only afterwards we realised that although purchasing your first place (or any place) is always very stressful, it doesn't have to be THAT stressful!!!!!

[Loz]

Do Foxton's ever advise people to hold out? I would have thought their percentage of the extra was inconsequential to them and they'd rather just have the sale. I suspect the cheaper place has meant an offer is yet to emerge.

[StraferJack]

people will be aware of Foxton's history right?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4826444.stm

[KrackersMaracas]

What an interesting article! I wasn't aware at all.

[ed_pete]

I know nothing of Foxtons but I would point out that the article referred to on the BBC's site is over 7 years old.

[StraferJack]

aka the last housing boom

[StraferJack]

Try more recent then

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/foxtons-estate-agent-that-gives-estate-agents-a-bad-name-8786804.html

http://www.theguardian.com/money/shortcuts/2013/sep/20/foxtons-share-price-stock-flotation

They don't sound much better in 2013 frankly

"In May 2013, BBC Watchdog reported that Foxtons imposes tenancy agreements which demand in the small print that tenants must use utilities supplier Spark Energy Ltd. The BBC stated Foxtons are paid commission by Spark Energy Ltd.[10]"

[lane lover]

BBC's Panorama on Foxtons was a great program. I wouldnt expect much to have changed from 2006.

This is interesting though: http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/nov/06/london-property-market-flat-says-foxtons

It infers current prices are driven purely by lack of supply. Volumes remain relatively flat.

[Mick Mac]

I wouldn't enter into a rental tenancy ageeement with any estate agent and neither should a landlord use an agent either, the contract terms are a complete rip off for tenant and landlord imo. I always found a place privatley.

[Northeastview]

The stamp duty is the final straw for us- we are a family of 4 living in a two bed housing association flat which we own 35% of, but to buy the rest we would have to come up with ?9000 stamp duty. I'm a nurse and my husband is a teacher, if we can't manage it how can any other normal family? It shouldn't be 3% around here when you can't buy anything for under ?250000

[stephen509]

Foxtons were great when I bought my first flat. It was different then in 2009 when there weren't many buyers with good deposits and ready to move swiftly.

When I upscaled this year, I was looking for around 6 months. As others have said strike a rapport with the estate agents. I was first in the door & offered asking price during my first viewing, I knew it would go to sealed bidding & go for over asking price.

[Otta]

When do agents have to stop other people viewing?

We've had an offer accepted at ?5k less than asking, but viewings won't be stopped until survey booked or something.

I've already spent a few hundred on fees and will be kivid if they let someone else gazump us.

[StraferJack]

if you pay asking or above it's often accepted that the vendor will take off market (they say)

but offering less means they will probably hold out given current market

Not your fault and not much you can do about it but it's rough

(you can be gazumped at any point until exchange of contracts - which can be AFTER you pay a lot more money for fees. grim)

[Otta]

No way, I thought that was ileagal after a certain point, can't believe that it can go that far!

On the positive side, we're only having to pay out about ?650 in fees for mortgage set up and conveyance searches. Only have to pay more once it's all said and done. But I still can't really afford to throw ?650 away.

[tomk]

You can insist they take it off the market whatever your offer ie you make it a condition of your offer. Point is, they usually only do this if you're at or near asking price. At 5k off, I'd say you're pretty near. I would tell them they need to take it off the market until you have completed your survey (this is the usual point for pushing forward to completion or further negotiation). If they say no, you would then have to decide whether to pull the offer or not. Personally, I would never start spending on fees etc if the property is still being actively marketed.