Southwark consultation on Peckham gyratory

[Marguerita98]

Is anyone aware of the potential impact of the plans (to close off one road on the triangle to cyclists and restrict traffic on the other side) on East Dulwich Road and Goose Green?  

It seems to me that there will be a large volume of traffic displacement (including lorries) through East Dulwich and Lordship Lane particularly at busy times, as a result.  Link to consultation and the survey here:

 https://engage.southwark.gov.uk/en-GB/projects/peckham-rye-gyratory-bus-improvements

[malumbu]

You will have to explain this one to me, it looks to be improving bus and bike journeys, which is a good thing.  Traffic is always backed up the Rye during rush hour/term times, having used this route to commute for two decades by bike.  I'd welcome safer bike journeys.

I'll have a longer look later.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Just re-read the document. So they're making the east side of Peckham rye buses only? Is that likely to impact lordship lane?

I'm in favour of the extended pavements, safer crossings and segregated bike lanes. I imagine that making the east side of the rye a fast bus route will improve journey times too.

Edited yesterday at 09:28 by Earl Aelfheah

[Spartacus]

The biggest impact will be the current lack of ability to turn right from Peckham Rye to Nunhead Lane.

The current run od traffic from Forest Hill road direction is either enter the gyratory, and either go along Peckham Rye East side to turm left into Nunhead lane or go into Copeland Road. 

Putting a timed bus gate in the section before Nigel Road and the buses only on the East side will then necessitate either allowing right turns at the corner of Peckham Rye into Nunhead Lane or as the OP pointed out, traffic will divert down via goose green roundabout to either go up to Nunhead or via Dog Kennel Hill to get to North of Peckham. 

The unintended impact could be more congestion and pollution in Rast Dulwich as a result. 

 

[alice]

Surely there’s computer programs or model what will happen if various avenues are blocked?

[ontheRye]

58 minutes ago, Spartacus said:

The biggest impact will be the current lack of ability to turn right from Peckham Rye to Nunhead Lane.

The current run od traffic from Forest Hill road direction is either enter the gyratory, and either go along Peckham Rye East side to turm left into Nunhead lane or go into Copeland Road. 

Putting a timed bus gate in the section before Nigel Road and the buses only on the East side will then necessitate either allowing right turns at the corner of Peckham Rye into Nunhead Lane or as the OP pointed out, traffic will divert down via goose green roundabout to either go up to Nunhead or via Dog Kennel Hill to get to North of Peckham. 

The unintended impact could be more congestion and pollution in Rast Dulwich as a result. 

 

It’s a peak hour bus lane in the section before Nigel Road, west side, not a bus gate, so shouldn’t impact normal traffic heading north from FH Road 

Edited yesterday at 12:24 by ontheRye

[CPR Dave]

Those ominous words that always mean an expensive carbuncle:

"pubic realm improvements"

...

[malumbu]

It looks great and I wish it had been put in place many years ago.  A few car parking spaces lost, but there is a fair amount of parking in Peckham but why would you want to drive there?  I'll be responding positively. I doubt whether there are rat runs, as most will have long since been blocked off.    Colyton Road is a horrid road to drive down, unless you really have to.  There is probably some anecdote about lazy dog walkers driving there to go round the Rye, rather than walking but no evidence.  As so many seem to hate dogs in the Rye and park may be a good thing to introduce a CPZ on Colyton.

[jazzer]

4 hours ago, Spartacus said:

The biggest impact will be the current lack of ability to turn right from Peckham Rye to Nunhead Lane.

The current run od traffic from Forest Hill road direction is either enter the gyratory, and either go along Peckham Rye East side to turm left into Nunhead lane or go into Copeland Road. 

Putting a timed bus gate in the section before Nigel Road and the buses only on the East side will then necessitate either allowing right turns at the corner of Peckham Rye into Nunhead Lane or as the OP pointed out, traffic will divert down via goose green roundabout to either go up to Nunhead or via Dog Kennel Hill to get to North of Peckham. 

The unintended impact could be more congestion and pollution in Rast Dulwich as a result. 

 

Think you may mean Left and not Right, unless you are meaning the otherside of Peckham Rye coming from the direction of Colyton Road

[wolis]

Planners always seem to forget that people who have to drive for work etc. will find a way round these obstacles.  I drove in and around Central London from the early 70s until a few years ago.  I was a specialist carpenter needing a van. I knew all the rat runs and when slowly they got cut off in the early 2000's I found alternatives.  The idea that blocking off one way would make me give up driving  or working was ridiculous.Traffic is like water - it will find a way .

[malumbu]

Yes, you needed to drive for work.  That is not true for many journeys where you can use public transport, walk, cycle and for many now on office jobs, and even some on site, you don't need to travel at all and can meet remotely.  This week I have cycled for work to Vauxhall and it is lovely as the private schools are off.  No morning congestion around the Harvester.  Even quieter next week when the state schools are off.  Which always begs the question how many children really have to be driven to school 

That said I don't see any issues with displacement for this scheme.  Do enlighten me why people will need to change their route.

[Spartacus]

1 hour ago, jazzer said:

Think you may mean Left and not Right, unless you are meaning the otherside of Peckham Rye coming from the direction of Colyton Road

Yes, the barry Road side of Peckham Rye, where if you want to go to Nunhead there is no right turn towards Nunhead Lane 

[FredCasa]

Any views on how this would affect bus journeys, particularly for 63/12/19 197? 

[Rockets]

Didn't they try to do this when they were going LTN mad after lockdown? Is this the rehashed version of that (which Phase was it) which I think was dropped when someone worked out it was going to be a displacement disaster

 

<removed>

Edited 9 hours ago by Administrator
Removed off topic discussion to avoid distraction

[Clifton]

The information given in detail here is about the area from East Dulwich Road northwards, and seems reasonably helpful and well thought out. It appears, however, to be the first part of a bigger plan.  

The text “Our plans include restricting access on the east side of Peckham Rye Park by introducing a new ‘bus gate’. This would restrict general traffic except for buses, cycles and service vehicles (e.g. bin lorries)” suggests that all traffic coming from the Cheltenham Road area will have to go elsewhere, presumably increasing dramatically the traffic on Colyton Road and Peckham Rye West.  That would be alarming.  

Am I misunderstanding this?  Have they misunderstood the meaning of Peckham Rye Park, when they are actually referring to the north section of Peckham Rye Common?  (It wouldn’t be the first time, if so.)

[Earl Aelfheah]

57 minutes ago, Clifton said:

The information given in detail here is about the area from East Dulwich Road northwards, and seems reasonably helpful and well thought out. It appears, however, to be the first part of a bigger plan.  

The text “Our plans include restricting access on the east side of Peckham Rye Park by introducing a new ‘bus gate’. This would restrict general traffic except for buses, cycles and service vehicles (e.g. bin lorries)” suggests that all traffic coming from the Cheltenham Road area will have to go elsewhere, presumably increasing dramatically the traffic on Colyton Road and Peckham Rye West.  That would be alarming.  

Am I misunderstanding this?  Have they misunderstood the meaning of Peckham Rye Park, when they are actually referring to the north section of Peckham Rye Common?  (It wouldn’t be the first time, if so.)

The proposed bus gate is on Peckham Rye between Dulwich Road and Nunhead Crescent.

…So referring to the north section I believe.

Edited 12 hours ago by Earl Aelfheah

[first mate]

1 hour ago, Clifton said:

The information given in detail here is about the area from East Dulwich Road northwards, and seems reasonably helpful and well thought out. It appears, however, to be the first part of a bigger plan.  

The text “Our plans include restricting access on the east side of Peckham Rye Park by introducing a new ‘bus gate’. This would restrict general traffic except for buses, cycles and service vehicles (e.g. bin lorries)” suggests that all traffic coming from the Cheltenham Road area will have to go elsewhere, presumably increasing dramatically the traffic on Colyton Road and Peckham Rye West.  That would be alarming.  

Am I misunderstanding this?  Have they misunderstood the meaning of Peckham Rye Park, when they are actually referring to the north section of Peckham Rye Common?  (It wouldn’t be the first time, if so.)

Wondering about impact of Gala on all this too?

[Spartacus]

One question that needs to be understood about both sections that proposals for changes for buses, is "are there currently problems that cause major delays alreay?" 

Granted buses can be slow going north towards Rye Lane however often it is caused by either other buses at the Nigel Riad bus stop or the junction with Heaton Road which causes tail backs. 

The north side of Peckham Rye (proposed bus gate beyween Scylla Road and Nunhead Lane ) never strikes me as a busy section but I don't traverse it often. However it does look like they are rerouting the 342, p12 and 78 northbound along it, removing their stop at the corner of East Dulwich Riad and Peckham Rye (a good spot for changing from a 37, 12, 197, 63 and 363 to the other buses, now forcing the change at the Nigel Road stop) 

I guess the current flow patterns need to be understood o make sense of this prooposal and questions raised over passenger preferences on buses as well. 

[Dogkennelhillbilly]

Seems sensible. Good to see the school street going in too.

That part of town could do with some public realm improvement.

[Rockets]

3 hours ago, Clifton said:

The text “Our plans include restricting access on the east side of Peckham Rye Park by introducing a new ‘bus gate’. This would restrict general traffic except for buses, cycles and service vehicles (e.g. bin lorries)” suggests that all traffic coming from the Cheltenham Road area will have to go elsewhere, presumably increasing dramatically the traffic on Colyton Road and Peckham Rye West.  That would be alarming.  

I am sure this is part of the plan they had for this part of Peckham back when they were going LTN mad and where they prioritised the input from the cycle lobby over the input from the emergency services. Does anyone have the old pdf from then as that will probably show how far these plans will end-up extending? I reckon details will be somewhere on the old LTN thread from back in the day - was it what they referred to as Phase 3?

They are clearly coming back to have a second go after they failed to get it in back in 2020/2021.

[Huggers]

O Lord I love that Scylla Road shortcut!

[Happyme5]

Ohh dear.  Why don't the council spend this money on fixing the giant potholes.  This would make a safer journey for everyone.  What a waste of money.  The road works fine as it is.    

[malumbu]

Why is it a waste of money?  Many of us will find out journeys safer and more pleasant. Well done LBS

[Rockets]

I found the aborted plan from 2020.

APPENDIX 1 PECKHAM RYE.pdf

1 hour ago, malumbu said:

Many of us will find out journeys safer and more pleasant.

But only when private schools are off right Mal? Or not off….

[march46]

This looks great. Southwark seems to be on a roll, especially when it comes to adding new zebra crossings - five proposed in this scheme alone! Improved bus journey times and public realm improvements by the school. A lot to like.