Peckham Rye - how dodgy is it?

[pk]

macroban Wrote:

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> It's Camberwell. No doubt about it.

>

> Some people confuse postal districts with other

> boundaries.

what is that map showing?

looking at the bottom map talfourd looks to me to be on the peckham side of the line, but i don't know what the line represents

[taper]

It shows that in the 1890s, there is no doubt Talfourd Road was in the Camberwell diocese (probably still is). The line in the bottom map shows the current postcode boundary, which also defines the electoral ward, which sits within the Peckham and Nunhead community council area. I have never heard anyone who lives in this bit of Peckham claim or even want to claim that they live in Dulwich. They are proud to live in Peckham because it means they are cool and gifted.

[pk]

and as for the rest of the thread - guess it only goes to show that one person's 'dodgy' is another person's 'vibrant' and another's 'home'

i guess that it no surprise that those that have chosen to live in se15 (self included) like it - but it seems like that it's not for all

in my experience (10 years or so) using trains out of peckham stations often at night/in a suit/worse for wear, i've never had any bother

[Asset]

Hey, you know what? I live in SE22 but haven't got a problem with visiting SE15, or SE21 for that matter. I sometimes even visit north of the river and occasionally go to Scotland eek.

This thread has gone totally barmy.

[lozzyloz]

I just don't understand people on this forum that venture beyond the SE22 boundary much less outside of Southwark. Why?

Lounge?

[Keef]

There be beasties there!

[talfourdite]

"What's in a name? that which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet".

Either whichway, it's nice to see that as per usual this thread is turning into a turf war.

It's interesting that despite Lozzyloz's comments, Dulwichites spend so much time discussing adjoining areas. I think some of you might secretly hang around in SE15 for some excitement - Chantelle, were any of the dealers wearing SE22 forum badges?

[snoozequeen1]

Asset Wrote:

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> This thread has gone totally barmy.

in reflection of place which has gone totally barmy, as per

SE22 - in a shop devoted to uselessness, you can buy an African cooking pot, next to the Rajasthan throws and the bamboo whatsits, for ?15

or 500 yards away in SE15 you can buy the same African cooking pot, in a shop devoted to selling African food, shopped in by actual living African people, who you could actually talk to, and enhance your retail experience, for ?1.

But on no, yeuch, oh, screamy scream, we can't go to SE15, it smells, there are too many black people, who obviously all want to rob me, yuk yuk.

It's not the thread that's barmy, it's the place which is totally de-ranged.

[*Bob*]

snoozequeen1 Wrote:

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> SE22 - in a shop devoted to uselessness, you can

> buy an African cooking pot, next to the Rajasthan

> throws and the bamboo whatsits, for ?15

>

> or 500 yards away in SE15 you can buy the same

> African cooking pot, in a shop devoted to selling

> African food, shopped in by actual living African

> people, who you could actually talk to, and

> enhance your retail experience, for ?1.

Best bet:

Live in SE22

Travel to Peckham to buy said pot for ?1 (whilst conversing with actual living African people etc etc)

Stand a better chance of not being burgled (four times) whilst you're out buying it.

[Asset]

Can I just remind people that this is the East Dulwich Forum and that, shock horror, most of the people who post may just live in SE22. That is not to say most of us have an issue with going to SE15 (obviously there is a minority that have a problem with everything) but to be derisive because we don't live in SE15 is a wee bit rich.

[*Bob*]

I agree.

SE15 interlopers should take their opinions elsewhere.

This is no place to discuss the price of African pots. Please limit your observations strictly to SE22-relevant subject matter: Estate agents, organic produce, yak's hair cushions and Keef's band.

[Keef]

But on no, yeuch, oh, screamy scream, we can't go to SE15, it smells, there are too many black people, who obviously all want to rob me, yuk yuk.

Er, you've basically just said that everyone in East Dulwich is racist.

Out of interest, are you black, or are you white, and just far more open minded than anyone in East Dulwich (including of course the actual living African people)? I'm just wondering.

[Brendan]

Snoozequeen1, that is the second time on this thread that you have made sweeping allegations of racism. I know I shouldn?t but I find that annoying.

Personally I couldn?t give two hoots about any SE15/SE22 divide although I do find the term ?Posh Peckham? dripping in pretence.

[Keef]

For the record, Brendan is an actual living African person.

[SeanMacGabhann]

with odd hair

[snoozequeen1]

Brendan Wrote:

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> Snoozequeen1, that is the second time on this

> thread that you have made sweeping allegations of

> racism. I know I shouldn?t but I find that

> annoying.

Not sweeping, specific, re: those comments of the "Rye Lane is smelly and dangerous and everything "other" and I wouldn't even ride a bus down there without an armed escort" variety.

I think the very first post I ever read when I came across the EDF was one which said something like "smelly Rye Lane, with all their funny food, LOL". Which is just repetition of the anti-Asian racism that was voiced commonly in the 1970s, until someone realised that we all needed to try a bit harder and we did manage to rise above racism, in this country, to quite an extent.

Rye Lane is just the next street along.

It should be really strange that we have allowed this to division to happen, over the course of 20 years, so that there is now a geographical black/white divide that you can draw on the map.

As for Keef asking me if I am black or white, I find it just baffling.

[louisiana]

snoozequeen1 Wrote:

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> Brendan Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Snoozequeen1, that is the second time on this

> > thread that you have made sweeping allegations

> of

> > racism. I know I shouldn?t but I find that

> > annoying.

>

>

> Not sweeping, specific, re: those comments of the

> "Rye Lane is smelly and dangerous and everything

> "other" and I wouldn't even ride a bus down there

> without an armed escort" variety.

>

> I think the very first post I ever read when I

> came across the EDF was one which said something

> like "smelly Rye Lane, with all their funny food,

> LOL". Which is just repetition of the anti-Asian

> racism that was voiced commonly in the 1970s,

> until someone realised that we all needed to try a

> bit harder and we did manage to rise above racism,

> in this country, to quite an extent.

>

> Rye Lane is just the next street along.

>

> It should be really strange that we have allowed

> this to division to happen, over the course of 20

> years, so that there is now a geographical

> black/white divide that you can draw on the map.

>

Fairly sweeping.

There are not many houses in this road, but there are several owned by black African families. Likewise there are roads in East Dulwich with fewer or more black/white people.

The difference is money.

[Spangles30]

LOL Bob "This is no place to discuss the price of African pots.

Please limit your observations strictly to SE22-relevant subject matter: Estate agents, organic produce, yak's hair cushions and Keef's band."

[Keef]

snoozequeen1 Wrote:

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> As for Keef asking me if I am black or white, I find it just baffling.

Why are you baffled? I was asking because I wondered what context your opinions / observations came from, and I thought that was clear. I don't think there is anything wrong with asking someone their skin colour.

I can see the point you are trying to make, but you take it too far. To suggest that there is a geographical divide between black and white people, as a result of a return to 70s type racism is a huge exaggeration at best!

[Rach]

Hi Chantelle

We had exactly the same deliberations - we were living in East Dulwich and we couldn't afford to buy there and at first we totally ruled Peckham Rye out. However, an estate agent persuaded us to have a look (without describing it as a village) and we now love it.

I have to get the train to Blackfriars and in the morning door-door journey is 20 minutes - bliss (7 minute walk & 13 minutes on the train). Holly Grove - which is a great street to walk down to get to the station is lovely and take note of all the wonderful bars and shops mentioned above.

The best thing though is that it doesn't feel as crowded as East Dulwich felt just before we moved out. It's not as 'community' feel as East Dulwich but people are super friendly and I have always felt safe walking around.

Good luck, Rach.

[snoozequeen1]

Keef Wrote:

To suggest that there is a

> geographical divide between black and white

> people, as a result of a return to 70s type racism

> is a huge exaggeration at best!

I'm just wondering how long it is since you have been to Rye Lane? Gradually over the years, the white faces have very nearly disappeared until now you can go into, e.g., a packed bank at lunchtime, and there will not be a single white person. There may be one or two white people on the packed pavements or perhaps one two on a bus going down Rye Lane. Look at the people waiting at the bus stops outside the old Co-op. How many are white?

A racial divide has taken place here, and the reason that I read what some people post on these boards, as racism, is because Rye Lane, a now almost entirely non-white shopping street, is regularly referred to using derogatory language.

You are right of course that it's not as bad as in the 1970s but if people feel they can post these kind of comments on a message board, then it's creeping back. And then there's the news today that the Mayor of London's race advisor has voiced the view that black Londoners can "go home". Doesn't help, really, does it? I was not a huge fan of Ken Livingstone but he at least had the intelligent to understand what racism is and what it does to all of us.

[Asset]

FFS. what a load of bollocks. When was the last time you were in Peckers?

[MadWorld74]

Why does Peckham have so much rubbish flying around it's streets? Chicken bones, take away wrappers, hair, papers.....that is why I don't like to visit the place. I get annoyed by the crap that wraps itself around my ankles as I stand in line and wait for a bloody bus twice a day. Why, can someone tell me why?

[chantelle]

MadWorld - hopefully Boris will tackle the city-wide problem with litter. there seems to be a cultural problem (and i don't mean from immigrants) about throwing away rubbish in the street.

Rach - thanks for sharing your experience. I work near Blackfriars too so my commute would actually be a lot shorter from Peckham Rye than the Oval, where i have to switch Tubes twice. Now we're just in indecision mode, so may wait until autumn to move into what will hopefully be the perfect place, minutes from the station!

[Keef]

Snoozequeen, I was in Rye Lane last week, until last year I was there every day.

Peckham is an area with a lot of black people, it has been for years, but I still don't think it's true to say that the white faces have all but disappeared.

I posted earlier that I find it on the dirty and smelly side (but not dangerous or full of drug dealers). The reason I said that was not because of anyone's skin colour, but simply because that is my observation. Rye Lane is scruffy these days, and could do with some investment or something.

One could argue that a high street in an area such as Brixton is equally, if not more black. However, Brixton High Street is miles nicer than Rye Lane. It has nothing to do with skin colour, the street has just gone down hill.

That's just my opinion, I can't speak for anyone else, but I've not seen anything on here that I would call racism, but of course, I could have missed something.

For the record, I have spoken up for Peckham as a whlole.