Diverted 63 bus route - Marmora & Therapia Roads

[OD]

Hello,

I heard/read something briefly about the 63 bus route being diverted onto Marmora and Therapia roads as a result of road works soon to start. Does anyone have any information on this? or is it just a rumour?

Thanks,

OD

[CuppaT]

Yeah you don't need to worry, it's just for the busses to turn around after the last as stop as they'll be unable to do so at the lights. Supposed to start on the 24th August now as the works we're posponed a few weeks ago.

[Zedd]

Yes this is the case. I'm not sure it is nothing to worry about though. I was unaware of this until a flyer was posted through my door over the weekend. Most of the information I'm about to provide is taken from this flyer (apart from the stupid flippant comments - they're all mine ;-).

The 63 is a double decker day and night bus and will be incredibly disruptive to residents of Marmora Road and Therapia Road as well people who use the Colyton/ Scutari/ Marmora route from Nunhead. Imagine the scenario that you are driving down Marmora/ Therapia and a 63 bus approaches you from the opposite direction. Considering the high density of parked vehicles on both roads, and especially the narrowness of Therapia Road, there will be no where to go for either vehicle and this will happen as often as there is a 63 bus - every 10-12 minutes?!

"But where will the buses go?" I hear you cry. "The work needs to be done, and the buses need to run, isn't this just nimbyism...?!?" Well, no.

There are 2 alternatives:

1. The 63 bus service will terminate near the top of Forest Hill Road as it currently does. The 63 bus will then turn along Brenchley Gardens (which is already a bus route) and use the entrance to the cemetery to turn around. This has allegedly already been suggested and declined by the council as it poses too great a risk to pedestrians using the cemetery entrance. I'm not sure where this leaves the safety of the residents of Marmora/ Scutari/ Therapia.

2. The 63 bus service terminates where it usually does but then continues over the hill to Brockley Rise and use the one-way system there to turn around and come back over the hill. This is clearly less likely as it will require alterations to the bus timetable and have an impact on the number of buses circulating Brockley Rise. However, it would offer a not to missed opportunity for permanent changes to the 63 route to extend down to HOP station... wishful thinking? Probably.

If this proposal is something that concerns you, the person to contact is your MP Rt Hon Ms Harriet Harman on [email protected] or via her website www.harrietharman.org/contact_me or by phone on 0207 2194218.

Sorry about the long post.

[Laur]

Some years back (late 80s, early 1990s) the 63 bus route was diverted along Mundania Road. It was weird looking out of your window and seeing a big double decker bus pass :)

[Vik]

It used to be permanent until the mid 80's. The old Routemasters used to use that route to turn before the traffic lights were put in on the FHR/Woodvale junction. How long is it expected to last for?

[Drxyster]

Although I favour the option of the bus turning via Honor Oak Park station, with the hopeful change in the route to eventually include HOP in the route, another alternative may be for the 63 to turn right into Wood Vale, right again into Melford Road and then left on to London Road and left again into Wood Vale, returning to the bus stop by the Cemetery.

Apparently weather permitting the works are expected to take three months.

[Vik]

Of all the options I do like Drxysters best but that said, I don't think 3 months is that bad. The works will include the upper part of FHR at the juction with Brenchley Gardens so perhaps that is why there is a reluctance to divert up the hill.

[Siduhe]

Drxyster Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Although I favour the option of the bus turning

> via Honor Oak Park station, with the hopeful

> change in the route to eventually include HOP in

> the route, another alternative may be for the 63

> to turn right into Wood Vale, right again into

> Melford Road and then left on to London Road and

> left again into Wood Vale, returning to the bus

> stop by the Cemetery.

> Apparently weather permitting the works are

> expected to take three months.

This would be a really sensible option, as the 363 already does this in part - however the turn into Wood Vale and particularly having to squeeze through the parked cars at the Horniman end by the traffic island on Wood Vale wouldn't work unless you restrict parking temporarily. There is barely enough room for a car to go past the island if there is a car parked (legally) close to it. Lorries get stuck there regularly, esp at the weekend, and have to reverse.

[dbboy]

As Vik wrote - this was the way things were before the traffic lights where installed. Appreciate it will cause some disruption, but this is only temporary while the road works are completed

:

-------------------------------------------------------

> It used to be permanent until the mid 80's. The

> old Routemasters used to use that route to turn

> before the traffic lights were put in on the

> FHR/Woodvale junction. How long is it expected

> to last for?

[OD]

Thanks for the info everyone, if its only for a few months then i personally wouldnt worry about it...however if I had children I'd be concerned.

Does this mean that the bus stop opposite Therapia Road will be closed too, or will the bus turn right onto FHR from Marmora?

I didnt get a leaflet through my door!

[Vik]

If it's the same as the old set up, it will turn left from FHR into Therapia Road, right into Scutari, right into Marmora and right again to the bus stand by the Old Cemetary. Then start it's route from the stop opposite Therapia.

[OD]

Great thanks Vik!!

[Vik]

No problem :-)

[SkyofFire]

Well, I'm worried about it - the last time buses were diverted along Marmora the fronts of the houses were badly damaged from the vibrations of the buses on the road.

I really would rather not have to deal with the time and expense to deal with this if we can find an alternative.

[Mrs Nicklin]

Just to be sure, it's for 3 months only (ho ho) starting 24th August, right? Not permanent?

Does anyone know what the work is that needs to be done?

We're just in the process of buying a place on Marmora and I really don't like the sound of this!

Thanks

[Katrusja]

The Southwark website is currently down so you can't access the full plans, but the London Register of Roadworks gives the dates as 24/08/2013-23/10/2013: http://public.londonworks.gov.uk/roadworks/?x=GbQAd97c55iFvxJwfN2ztg

The works have been planned for some time to improve safety at the FHR-Brenchley Gardens & FHR-Wood Vale junctions. They include the creation of traffic islands and also resurfacing etc of the bus turnaround lane.

The works have been discussed on the forum: see http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,1148395,1149472#msg-1149472 for example.

K.

[Zedd]

Mrs Nicklin - we have received several letters outlining the works to be completed, so I imagine that all householders along Marmora Road will have been similarly informed so you might be able to find out from your vendor (incidentally none of these letters mentioned the planned bus diversion). I can't actually find the letters though so from memory the works include resurfacing the bus lane, adding in a crossing (next to the cemetary entrance?) and changing the traffic island layout where the buses turn. I am happy to be corrected if I have misremembered any of this, however.

SkyofFire - I am also concerned about the historical damage caused by vibrations but also the prospective damage to parked cars as the roads carry vehicles that are simply too big! Contrary to the opinions of others 3 months actually seems like a LONG time to me when you factor in how often these buses will be running along Marmora/ Therapia day AND night.

If you are similarly concerned I urge you to contact Harriet Harman using the details I posted further up the thread - it is not too late to change the bus route.

[Mrs Nicklin]

Thanks everyone for all the information. Much appreciated. I agree with Zedd too: if you're worried, get in touch with Harriet Harman. It's not too late to change it!

[Marmora Man]

As a vendor myself I passed the details of the bus diversion to the purchaser's solicitors. there seemed to be no issue for them.

A similar diversion has occurred once since we've lived here - it wasn't a problem. As the timing of the current plan has slipped slightly I don't think it will have much impact on children. They do play in the street during summer months - but mostly this is restricted to to the end of Marmora which wouldn't be affected by the buses and, in any case, they'll be back at school soon.

As for damage to houses - they've stood for over 100 years, survived the Blitz and many many internal refurbishments, changes and restructurings - so I imagine they'll survive a few months of bus journey's passing close by.

[Laur]

I agree with 'Marmora Man'.....it's 3 months and was not a problem during the previous diversions when 63 route masters diverted along Mundania road and other nearby roads. I lived there for 30 years & as Marmora Man says rightly so those houses survived the Blitz so " Keep calm and carry on" :)

[neilson99]

If it lasts just 3 months I will eat my hat

Southwarks contractors couldn't stick to a timetable if their lives depended on it. I'd bet a pint that they will still be going at Christmas if previous experience is anything to go by.

[Marmora]

The work was due to start on 5th August 2013 in Forest Hill Road. Nothing happened, we contacted the council and eventually we were told 10 working days later that the work had been delayed due to a Thames water emergency! It is now scheduled to start on 24th August 2013 for 3 months. With the 3 weeks delay already incurred you can expect that it will last longer.

63 bus, every 6 minutes day time, will be diverted from Forest Hill Road to Therapia road then a sharp turn to Scutari Road and another sharp turn into Marmora Road and again a sharp turn into Forest Hill road.

Are you ready for a bus in your street every 6 minutes day time? How wide is Therapia road, what will you do when in your car you have a bus coming towards you? The same for Marmora road and Scutari road. Buses used to drive along Marmora Road in the 80s and caused considerable damages to some houses. The residents got together and the service was stopped because of the damage caused. Do you want your house, flat to be damaged? The Dulwich & South London Press had a front page article on the matter on Friday 26th July 2013

3 months with a bus every 6 minutes can do a lot of damage to your house, your flat, your car etc....

We urge you to email your MP Harriet Harman [email protected] and copy the Councillor Barrie Hargrove [email protected]

A few of us have already emailed her, we need more of you to do it as a very good alternative route was proposed via Brenchley Gardens but was refused without any consideration by Councillor Barry Hargrove

[Mrs Nicklin]

I've just emailed too. Yes, please let's all get in touch with Harriet & Barrie!

[Marmora Man]

A better solution has been proposed by Mrs W.

Stop the No. 63 bus at Peckham. Give locals that use the 63 a pass to use the 363 for free between Peckham and Forest Hill Tavern. A slight inconvenience to passengers but otherwise a rather clever compromise I think.

[Siduhe]

63 bus, every 6 minutes day time, will be diverted from Forest Hill Road to Therapia road then a sharp turn to Scutari Road and another sharp turn into Marmora Road and again a sharp turn into Forest Hill road.

Are you ready for a bus in your street every 6 minutes day time? How wide is Therapia road, what will you do when in your car you have a bus coming towards you? The same for Marmora road and Scutari road. Buses used to drive along Marmora Road in the 80s and caused considerable damages to some houses. The residents got together and the service was stopped because of the damage caused. Do you want your house, flat to be damaged?

Sounds a lot like what we experience on Underhill (which is wider, I agree) and Melford Road (which isn't, in places) with the 363 already. The sharp turns and the noise though definitely. If people are sensible, it works. If people are idiots (normally drivers coming the other way) it doesn't. But for three months, I would say it's liveable with.