Water bubbling up from the ground on the North Cross Road

[CocoC]

As the title of the post says really! Looks like the paving stones are buckling under the pressure and there's quite a lot of water. It's at the bottom end, just past Pretty's.

[chuff]

Call Thames water, after the herne hill flood they might actually send someone out in the next few hours...

[Willard]

Another example of the inept Thames Water not reinvesting their vast profits back into the infrastructure. Look forward to your inflation busting price hike next year everyone!

[EPB]

Apparently the water board were called at six this morning and expect to arrive at about ten o'clock.

[Sue]

Well they still weren't there when I passed around 11.30am.

Was quite an interesting effect with all the little eddies and waterfalls. My granddaughters were fascinated.

[EPB]

Still bubbling away at 1.30.

[uncleglen]

When we had a burst water main a few years ago and the area around CP road had no mains supply for about 3 days, we got chatting to the engineers coming to measure the head of pressure at intervals. He said that the increase in properties that are either being built or turned into flats and require their own mains supply meant that the pumping pressure has to be increased. What with the area being hilly as well-this just added to the pumping pressure problem. The underground pipes- some will be the old Victorian ones I daresay- then give way.

They are replacing the pipes but it is a slow job and by the time it is finished hopefully it will not be obsolete.

Anyway I am now firmly convinced that every problem of infrastructure and front line services, in London especially, is down to overpopulation and that the situation is going to deteriorate and our quality of life is going to suffer.

Every year we have to pay the EU a fine because we have not fulfilled its unrealistic air pollution standards- mainly due to population and car numbers increasing.

The situation is deplorable and is all a result of politicians chasing votes and short-sighted planning (due to the 5 year election cycle.

A builder on a phone in programme today was saying that he works with a lot of East Europeans who rent 3 bedroom houses and then 15 of them will live in it!

[edhistory]

> He said that the increase in properties that are either being built or turned into flats and require their own mains supply meant that the pumping pressure has to be increased.

I have been told this too.

It's Southwark Council's fault for granting planning permission for family houses to be converted into flats.

John K

[StraferJack]

"A builder on a phone in programme today"

let's not question that source then...

15 people living in a three bedroom house will put a lot less pressure on infrastructure than 15 people living in a converted house with say, 6 flats

Not sure what your point is uncleglen

The general one about victorian pipes, modern living expectations and water pressure remains valid ? not sure what bringing foreigners into it does tho?

[MarkE]

edhistory Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> It's Southwark Council's fault for granting

> planning permission for family houses to be

> converted into flats.

>

Not seeking to antagonise... is there any evidence for this (e.g. that a 3-bed Victorian house in ED converted into two flats resulted in more people living there, on average)? I'd be interested to learn more - I had always convinced myself, probably ignorantly, that this wasn't the case, and that houses were (typically) populated by families and flats by singletons or couples. I know that there are no hard-and-fast rules, and that some singletons live in large houses and some large families live in flats, but has there been any research on the habiting numbers before/after conversion?

[rch]

Just to let you all know that I've liaised with our council flood engineers on site in Herne Hill and they are now liaising directly with the Thames Water engineers about this report in North Cross Road. The TW Reference number is 1011226325.

We're told that TW are aware of this report and will definitely be sending a team down to investigate... let me know what happens!

[StraferJack]

it's not the amount of people it's the multiplication of

boilers

toilets

kitchen sink/waste

washing machines

parking spaces

when you divide a house into flats

[polla2256]

More people need more heat, hot water, produce more waste, park more cars and wash more clothes. The water supply is a system, the more you take out the more you need to put in. The more you put in the more stress on the infrastructure at all points (entry, exit, process etc).

Bad planning, greed and poor governance are causing this. It's not just water but airports, rail networks, the electricity grid..... it goes on.

We need smart solutions and smart thinking not arguments, indifference, antiquation and shifting responsibility.

[the-e-dealer]

Yeah move out Polla2256!

[uncleglen]

SJ - people who use a house just as a sleeping place will easily live 15 to a 3 bedroomed house- I saw it with my own eyes in East London and the Midlands in the 1970s. A relative is an estate agent in East London and couples rent a house, and after a few months turn up to buy a property as they have all been working and raise the deposit quickly.

[Penguin68]

Population density is much less now (per tenement) than it was in Victorian times (when much of the infrastructure, in particular water supply and waste) was initially being installed - read any contemporary accounts to see just how many people lived to a room in much of the City and East End (and in the West End around Drury Lane and St Giles).

What has changed (as has been noted) is the expectations of individuals in their water usage (and the amount of waste water disposed of).

This absolutely isn't about migrant workers housed in hovels, it is about aspiring and middle-class expectations of what is a 'good' life.

A major problem London has is that it has been a 'modern' city far longer than most others, so it was built a long time ago. Most of the housing in ED is late Victorian or Edwardian, with a minority of houses (many filling 2nd World war bomb scars) being built post 1st, let alone 2nd War. So the underlying infrastructure is there to support people who didn't have washing mashines or dish washers, mutiple flush lavatories in their houses, power showers etc. etc.

No wonder at times it creaks a bit.

[StraferJack]

And many of us will have personally known Australians who sleep a dozen to a room as well - I know that people do "maximise" space in a house.

My question is - given that it's a more efficient use of resources than dividing same house into multiple flats for same number of people, what is your problem with that?

[Inkmaiden]

Water still flowing, no sign of Thames Water.

[East of Dulwich]

Just went past and the tarmac is beginning to bulge upwards. Looks like it's going to be Herne Hill all over again.

Somebody was on their mobile to Thames Water who were "waiting for a gang to arrive". So glad our water bills are going up by almost ?30 a year when this is the service they provide.

[Sue]

We went past again about 7.30pm.

Just the same as it was this morning, plus as East of Dulwich says the tarmac is bulging more than it was before.

Still no sign of any action or even investigation by Thames Water.

Absolute disgrace. What are their priorities, exactly?

Ooops edited for typo!

[polla2256]

the-e-dealer Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Yeah move out Polla2256!

I would but the rail prices made me move in and I work on infrastructure projects so need the chaos really, keeps me in a job.

[uncleglen]

Some of us will have crashed 10-15 to a room on a very temporary basis when young and travelling around but when bringing up children it is hardly ideal.

A developer wanted to convert a house next to me into 3 rabbit hutches but eventually settled for 2 flats with 2 separate mains water supplies and the water has to be pumped at a certain pressure to each flat

[DulwichFox]

Sue Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> We went past again about 7.30pm.

>

> Just the same as it was this morning, plus as East

> of Dulwich says the tarmac is bulging more than it

> was before.

>

> Still no sign of any action or even investigation

> by Thames Water.

>

> Absolute disgrace. What are their priorities,

> exactly?

>

> Ooops edited for typo!

They were there at 23.00 last night....

One has to think about the Technical implications of the operation.

To Repair the Main the water would need to be turned off.

If this is done whilst there is demand for water, people would drain their domestic supply dry.

Their tanks would run empty and their pipes would be air locked. Their Boilers could be damaged if hot water is drawn

off and may need bleeding afterwards.

If the leak is not too serious and NOT in a 3 foot main, then waiting until demand is low will

prevent all of those problems.

Foxy

[rch]

Thanks for confirmation... I just got an email this morning informing me that Thames had attended yesterday and repaired a leak to the 4" domestic supply main. But I was a bit concerned to see the posts here as late as 9.20pm saying that it was still leaking, so it's useful to know that Thames were indeed seen on site at 11pm.

Let me know if anything else happens, our council engineers are on the case liaising closely with Thames.

[JDR]

Unfortunately Thames water are slow to respond with this type of complaint. I work in a local ( ish ) health centre and the same happened. They failed to respond to the road that lifted up and cracked and the calls we made. It was only when the electrics in the health centre started failing and eventually the fire brigade were called who declared the centre unsafe and closed the road did they attend