Parking Charge notices this morning in Peckham Park

[the-e-dealer]

"WARNING NORMAL ROAD RULES APPLY ON THIS HIGHWAY"

[njc97]

Kid Kruger - damn these wardens, targeting those people who are breaking the law, rather than just wandering around issuing tickets at random.

[LadyDeliah]

DJKQ, I drive, cycle, walk, take mini-cabs (rarely) and use public transport.

I sold my car about 6 years ago and use a Zipcar/van when I really need something more than my bike, which is not often.

There is no need for individual car ownership in London unless you are disabled.

Ambulances and other priority vehicles take longer to get to where they are needed because of individual car ownership and the congestion they cause.

I see no good reason to continue to support the right to individual car ownership over everyone elses' rights, health and safety.

[DJKillaQueen]

'There is no need for individual car ownership in London unless you are disabled.'

Or work in a trade or are self employed in a service sector (or have to transport equipment as part of your job), have to work nights or long hours, work 20 miles outside of London where there is no transport link. It's such a daft comment to make. I can think of many reasons why people need to own a vehicle who live in London. You think everyone works in an office at the end of a tube or bus route, no more than an hour away, obviously.

[LadyDeliah]

Tradesmen and people who carry equipment usually have vans. There is nowhere in the UK that is not accessible by train and bike.

The majority of people who own cars do so because they find it convenient, not because they need to.

[the-e-dealer]

LadyDeliah Wrote:

THIS IS CLEARLY NONSENCE

-------------------------------------------------------

> Tradesmen and people who carry equipment usually

> have vans. There is nowhere in the UK that is not

> accessible by train and bike.

>

> The majority of people who own cars do so because

> they find it convenient, not because they need to.

[LadyDeliah]

Care to elaborate e-dealer?

[Willard]

LadyD:

>

> There is no need for individual car ownership in

> London unless you are disabled.

>

> I see no good reason to continue to support the

> right to individual car ownership over everyone

> elses' rights, health and safety.

Congratulations - this is undoubtedly the biggest load of utter cockwobble I've ever read on the EDF. It really does take the biscuit. With gems like this, I'm going to have to start following you on twitter...

[DJKillaQueen]

There are places not accessible...I've worked at some of them. Try working in the film industry LD...you'll change your mind on that one (some locations are very remote). You try cycling to Shepparton studios six days a week as well....to work a 12 hour day. Or how about Pinewood? Try it by public tranport and tell me if you would be happy with a four hour journey on top of a 12 hour working day six days a week (the journey takes an hour by motorcycle and costs far less). Because that's the kind of thing you are not considering.

So vans are ok then? And many self employed people do use cars instead of vans. I know lots of people that do.

And where is your evidence that most people own cars for convenience? It's an assumption you make to fit in with your eccentric views.

Last time I looked, trains and buses are so overcrowded during peak hour that the system would collapse if every vehicle user switched to them anyway.

[DJKillaQueen]

Worse still I'm having to agree with the e-dealer............ :D

[LadyDeliah]

Ok, think about it for a minute. How many people that you know actually need to own a car?

Getting shopping and commuting don't count. I know someone who cycles to Dagenham from here and he's in his early 50's. I also know a 48 year old, self-employed painter & decorator who cycles all over London on jobs. plus paying ?6 to a mini-cab driver to bring your shopping home, if it's too heavy to carry negates the perceived need for a car for shopping.

Most people want a car because it makes their lives easier, not because they need one.

Believing your convenience is more important than the health & safety of others means you are selfish.

[LadyDeliah]

Willard, welcome. You'll find I'm a bundle of lighthearted joy, my tweets and retweets are full of sunshine and fluff.

[DJKillaQueen]

I disagree...commuting DOES count. No-one in my profession can work without a vehicle. You have to be on set on time every day.....no excuses. And some locations have no train or bus links.....really they don't.

Outside of those professions or circumstances where a vehicle is necessary, I don't know anyone who drives to work. I do know many people with poor mobilty for whom a vehicle is their only way of getting about.

I think you are a bit rich to call anyone selfish because they use a mode of tranport you don't approve of LD. And to do so just because you don't have need of it is definitely a selfish view. Common sense should tell you that cycling is not possible for every journey or for everyone. Just as common sense should tell you that the vast majority of drivers do NOT have accidents or endanger peoples lives every time they go for a drive.

[uncleglen]

It's a time thing. I gave up my car in aid of the environment for several years andused buses. I used to leave the house at 7 and got home at 7 and missed many hours of my children's young lives. Since no-one else seemed to give a flying fig for the environment I took up driving once again. I have a small car and am amazed at the increase in massive cars on the road 'wasting' our finite resource-oil. The absurdity of still making plastic bags convinces me that people are really stupid on the whole- and if you can't beat 'em join 'em!

[DJKillaQueen]

I have some sympathy for that view uncleglen - especially when it comes to vanity vehicles and plastic bags and packaging. Even electric cars...much lauded as the solution, require energy to be used elsewhere to generate the electricity and the impact on the global environment is negative. Electricity is a more wasteful way to power vehicles than fuel because of the way in which electricity decays en route anyway, so it's not the answer.

Environmental issues are such a minefield and I too have been left feeling there isn't any real will by anyone (companies, governments and individuals en mass) to do anything that will really make a difference.

The other thing that bugs me too is that if I need to say go to Liverpool suddenly, that a Train ticket costs three times what the petrol costs to go there and back. I prefer to use the train for those journeys and can get cheap tickets up to a week in advance. But not on the day or night before. That does frustrate me.

[Willard]

Well I'm afraid DJKQ, that's just too bad. You should pay 3 times the cost on a lousy ticket that's not guaranteed to get you on location on time. To do otherwise is selfishly risking people's lives.

Well done for sticking up for the self employed on here. I too work as a freelancer in TV and film and a car, van, whatever is a must. End of. Kind of seems stupid to actually even have to type that ffs.

And LadyD I checked you out on Twitter, and sorry love, it's not you - it's me. Not gonna work out.

[LadyDeliah]

Willard, you've got me crying into my Horlix now.

Any way back to our convo. If public transport is crap, you guys work in media, make some noise and get it on the political agenda. Everyone owning a car is totally unsustainable, so someone needs to come up with a plan B soon.

Oh, and just out of interest, are you two saying that no-one who works with you guys is a non-car owner then?

[DJKillaQueen]

But everyone doesn't own a car LD and many people never will. And a lot of former car owners have abandoned cars because of the cost vs use. London will always have problems because of it's size and density, and most major cities have pressures during peak hours. Outside of that though the roads move ok.

I work in drama/ features (and I guess Willard too), not current affairs so not really the right area to raise awareness.

And yes....I don't know a single person who works on location in the film industry or TV drama that doesn't own a car, or motorbike. It's essential. Production will often provide transport for specific crew members to use as well. Actors are always collected by private hire cars. Even one essential technician or actor being late, can cost a production thousands. It can't happen. It sounds brutal I know but that's how it is. Post production is a little more flexible because a lot of editing facilites are located in soho and around White City, but editors and their assistants are often based at one of the big studios during the shoot and again, public transport isn't good enough.

There was one (huge) production I worked on where I had no vehicle for two weeks. To get to this out of use airfield (on which the set was built) in the middle of nowhere, and be on set at 7am meant I had to leave at 4am. Cycle to Herne Hill Station. Take a variety of trains towards St. Albans. And then cycle 15 miles up and down hills from the station at the other end to get to the set on this airfield. I would get home, after doing the same journey in reverse, at 10pm. You do the maths on how much sleep I got. I was 29 then and those two weeks destroyed me. There is no way that now at the age of 45 I could do that journey. Driving time though was 1 hr and 30 minutes each way - so a huge difference. Film people are also usually travelling just before and just after peak hour too (unless doing a night shoot).

Indeed during my two year apprenticeship, the better placements (on the bigger productions) went to those apprentices with their own transport, because not having transport severely limited which productions you could work on.

It's just one example of why some working people have to commute by road. This issue is not black and white.

Uncleglen's point about time being taken away from family time is also a good one. Long working hours are bad enough for family life. I can also understand why people drive to give them more time with their children.

[LadyDeliah]

So on your evidence, not all your colleagues use their cars then DJKQ. (Motorbikes and cabs too).

[DJKillaQueen]

No they do......... All drama is shot either in studios and on location. I thought I'd made that very clear from just the example above. Willard has backed that up too, because he works in the same profession.

During my apprenticeship, not all placements were in drama. Some were post production placements in Soho for example, so I could cycle. But apprenticeships send you somewhere for anything from a week to a month, not the 3 to 12 months that a full job does. So it's possible to do an apprenticeship and only ever be placed at the point that productions are 'in town'. That isn't the case once you become a freelancer in the profession, where you are employed on a production from start to finish.

Even in other genres like sports or documentary, technicians again are sent all over the place, sometimes changing locations several times a day. They need to get between those locations as quickly and easily as possible. Again public transport isn't the best option. Time is money in production. Of the twelve hours each day you have all those crew and cast etc shooting you need them to shoot as much as possible. Not have time wasted on trains and buses that take forever to get anywhere.

I really don't have to explain this any more. I know my own profession and what people need to work in it.

There are far softer targets to challenge anyway...like the school run for example.

[Cam123]

Sorry to pull this back to topic, but I got a ticket there last year along with several other cars as there was some sort of kids' sports day going on. I contested my ticket and got a cheque through the post to refund my fine - which was interesting because I hadn't paid it.

[Willard]

LadyDeliah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

Everyone owning a

> car is totally unsustainable, so someone needs to

> come up with a plan B soon.

>

From LadyD's Twitter profile: @LadyChe3

I'm an uncompromising, revolutionary, eco-warrior, wannabe farmer, kick-ass immigration lawyer, mother and grandmother!

London

Being an "uncompromising, revolutionary, eco-warrior, wannabe farmer, kick-ass immigration lawyer, mother and grandmother" I'm sure you're only too aware of the environmental impact of having kids, who have kids, who have kids etc. It actually leaves a far higher carbon footprint and is more unsustainable than people who drive cars who don't have kids, people like me for instance.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2011/sep/27/not-have-children-environmental-reasons

(one of many links I could have put in)

However, how many people on here would try and spout a load of "one size fits all" bile, preaching that people shouldn't have kids? Not many I suspect.

Keep your borderline fascist views to yourself. You will always have a bigger carbon footprint than me. Eco warrior.

[LadyDeliah]

Willard, that would depend on whether I'm into buying my kids all kinds of shiny crap they don't need, or if I live a green lifestyle with them or not.

A large family in a poor country living a basic life have a far lower carbon footprint than a typical small western family. It's not about family size, it's about how much of the planet you consume (did you even read the article you posted?).

By the way Willard, calling my views borderline fascist and telling me to keep them to myself because they differ from yours makes you a bit of an intolerant wanker in my humble opinion.

[LadyDeliah]

And Willard here's another view on population v consumption:

http://m.guardian.co.uk/environment/georgemonbiot/2011/oct/27/population-consumption-threat-to-planet

[Bluerevolution]

I love the way everyone has overlooked Renata's suggestion to "walk" ! A four letter word ?

FYI, very rarely does anyone in the acting profession drive themselves to set.