Fox advice please

[Foxhelp]

Hello, I awoke this morning to find two tiny fox cubs at the end of my garden. They appear to have been abandoned by their mother and I don't know what to do. They keep trying to jump up at the fence but they are too tiny and the fence too high. They are currently hiding at the back of my shed. Do you think the mother will come back for them tonight? I have left out a bowl of dog food and some water. Does anyone know who I should call? They appear healthy and I can tell they are looking for their mum. They are very cute and I really don't want to see them perish. Please can someone tell me what to do? Thank you

They have obviously followed her over the fence and into the garden but cant get back out on their own. She is nowhere to be seen.

[Saffron]

Phone the Fox Project for specific advice? http://www.foxproject.org.uk/

[Foxhelp]

The RSPCA say they do not relocate or collect abandoned animals. The Neighbourhood vets at the bottom of Barry Rd say they do not deal with this and have no idea. Southwark council have just said they do not provide a service for this and I should call the RSPCA, which I have already done. Its seems no on wants to know, so am I supposed to sit and watch the fox cubs die? ( if of course the mother doesn't come back for them).

[Saffron]

from the RSPCA webpage:

Many fox cubs are unnecessarily brought into care because they are thought to be abandoned. A study of foxes in Bristol showed that 95% of such cubs would survive if returned to where they were found. Watch the cubs from a distance for at least 24 hrs to see if their parents are still feeding them. Only intervene immediately if the cubs are in direct danger. Should you disturb a fox litter, causing the mother to run away, try and leave the cubs where they are and monitor from a distance. Mum should return for them and move them to a more secure location when she feels it's safe. For more information see The Fox Website and our FAQ.

http://www.rspca.org.uk/allaboutanimals/wildlife/orphanedanimals

[Foxhelp]

Yes I have read this. So I will just wait and hope she returns. Thank you

[Saffron]

Are they in a sheltered area where you can observe them (sounds like they are corralled in your backgarden)? I think you're doing the right thing. Watch them 24 hours before trying to intervene. Were you able to contact the Fox Project?

[Saffron]

Here's another webpage with contact numbers:

http://www.nfws.org.uk/fox_cubs.html

[Foxhelp]

They are just so unbelievably cute its breaking my heart :(

[Saffron]

From the nfws website above:

Fox Cubs: Golden Rules

Fox Cubs:

Golden Rules

If you have just taken down an old shed and found a litter of cubs without mum, please do not move the cubs. The vixen will return for them if the area is quiet and left alone.

If you discover a fox cub in a dangerous place ie near a road, near dogs etc, then please contact us or your nearest Wildlife Rescue Centre. If the cub is in immediate danger, then pick it up and take it indoors. Depending on age, remember they can and often will bite.

If you are able to approach a fox cub and if so wish pick it up, there is usually a problem, again please make contact.

If you think a litter of cubs have been abandoned because there is no sign of mum. Leave an egg out in its shell (raw) near the earth, usually if the egg has gone in the morning it informs you that an adult fox has at least visited the earth.

If you have found a fox cub at whatever age, please do not attempt to rear it yourselves. We have spoke to many misguided and misinformed people who on taking on a litter of fox cubs (average 5), phone us with only one survivor left, all because they failed to provide what the cubs needed.

Never give cows milk. If you have to give them something let it be water.

If a fox cub become entangled in wire in your garden, don?t just let it go if you untangle it. Contact us or your local Rescue Centre.

Don't take on an orphaned fox cub as a pet!

In short, rather than sit back and wait for 24 hrs, our advice would be to look at every situation as it is. Each senario will have a different set of circumstances, so each should be dealt with individually. So if in doubt shout, contact us or your local wildlife rescue centre for further advice.

[Foxhelp]

The fox project are only open weekdays and have a recorded message. I am praying she comes back for them. What are the chances though? She left them in a vunerable place ( I have dogs)

Saffron , I am leaving out a raw egg now, thanks for helping.

This has really upset my weekend.

[Saffron]

In a pinch... could Celia Hammond Animal Trust help? http://www.celiahammond.org/

[Saffron]

Foxhelp Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The fox project are only open weekdays and have a

> recorded message. I am praying she comes back for

> them. What are the chances though? She left them

> in a vunerable place ( I have dogs)

>

> Saffron , I am leaving out a raw egg now, thanks

> for helping.

> This has really upset my weekend.

Oh dear :( Do keep the Forum updated. Let's hope they're ok. If the mother is quite young herself, she may not have realised your garden wasn't quite as safe as she thought (re dogs). I think it's quite normal for vixens to leave the cubs for periods of time once they're a few weeks old. Fingers crossed. xx

[Foxhelp]

Yes, fingers crossed. Just went up to the end of garden and they are both in the gap between the back of shed wall and high fence, about a foot wide at most. Looking up at me with big sorrowful eyes. So ive thrown some dog meat in. I really really hope she comes back, heartless cow ;(

[PeckhamRose]

She will probably come back. Set up a discreet webcam and send us a link!

[Saffron]

Haha, I like it: 'Fox Watch ED'!! :)

[Foxhelp]

Hi all, well the cubs perished and the RSPCA's last reply has just been received. Unbelievable and they wont be getting a single penny from me in the future. See below

Hello, I recently called you because I had two abandoned fox cubs in my garden. You said you could not help as you do not collect or rehome abandoned foxes and told me to call my local environmental health team. I did this and they said they do not provide a service for abandoned fox cubs. What do I do if this happens again, who do I call?? You were happy to see them perish and this is not acceptable from the RSPCA. I await your reply.

Sent 08/05/2013, 08:35:00

US

Hi

Thank you for your enquiry.

You have not said how old you believe these fox cubs to be or described their condition. However, it is correct that the RSPCA is not able to remove healthy wildlife.

We would suggest that you look at our living with foxes information sheet on our website, which includes information on how to deter foxes from your garden.

Kind regards

RSPCA Advice Team

The RSPCA rescues, rehabilitates and re-homes hundreds of thousands of animals each year. We offer advice on caring for all animals and campaign to change laws that will protect them, which we will enforce through prosecution. Our work relies on your support, so why not get involved http://www.rspca.org.uk/getinvolved or donate today http://www.rspca.org.uk/donate. You can make a difference.

Reply 08/05/2013, 14:32:23

YOU

I am not a wildlife expert. I called Saturday. They were abandoned by their mother. She didn't come back. They perished. I find your attitude unacceptable. What am I supposed to do if this happens again? I await your response

Sent 08/05/2013, 19:53:31

US

Dear

Please accept my apologies for the delay in replying to your concerns and dissatisfaction with the RSPCA's service.

Our 24 hour control centre receives over 1.1 million calls each year, so our dedicated team of around 400 inspectors (spread across the country and working shifts so not all on duty at any one time) have extremely heavy workloads. We need to prioritise their calls according to urgency.

Unfortunately without your address and confirmation of the phone number you called us from, I can't review how your phone call was handled but I do need to reiterate that sometimes our limited resources force us to make difficult decisions. I can assure you it is not that we were disinterested in what you reported to us, simply the demand for our services proved hard to meet and we have to allocate officers to jobs very carefully by setting strict criteria.

I am sure this reply will not be the one you had hoped for, but as a charity we must carefully allocate what resources we have to stretch them as far as possible. Sadly this does mean we are not always able to respond in the way that would be ideal.

Animal welfare is and always will be at the core of the RSPCA?s work and we are always grateful to members of the public, such as yourself, who share our concern. I am just sorry that on this occasion we were not able to help reach a successful outcome.

I hope in time you will reconsider your opinion of us, as this incident is not a true reflection of our work for animal welfare.

Kind regards

Veronica Morrison

Information & Advice Manager

RSPCA

Southern Support Centre

The RSPCA rescues, rehabilitates and re-homes hundreds of thousands of animals each year. We offer advice on caring for all animals and campaign to change laws that will protect them, which we will enforce through prosecution. Our work relies on your support, so why not get involved

[UncleBen]

Thats sad (foxes), and bad (rspca).

I stopped supporting them years ago as the Queen or someone was their patron and we all know she murders deer and foxes etc.

[kiera]

Foxhelp, it is unfortunate that you waited until the cubs were dead to post again on the forum. The last advice you had been given, by Saffron, was very good advice, from the National Fox Welfare Society. Their advice was not to sit back and wait. They suggested getting in touch with them or your local wildlife rescue centre. Saffron also asked you to keep the forum updated. You obviously wanted to do the right thing, so it's very sad that you did not follow-up the very good advice you were given. If you didn't know how to contact The National Fox Welfare Society or a local WIldlife Rescue Centre, there's no doubt Forumites would have looked up the contact details for you.

[Voyageur]

kiera Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Foxhelp, it is unfortunate that you waited until

> the cubs were dead to post again on the forum. The

> last advice you had been given, by Saffron, was

> very good advice, from the National Fox Welfare

> Society. Their advice was not to sit back and

> wait. They suggested getting in touch with them or

> your local wildlife rescue centre. Saffron also

> asked you to keep the forum updated. You obviously

> wanted to do the right thing, so it's very sad

> that you did not follow-up the very good advice

> you were given. If you didn't know how to contact

> The National Fox Welfare Society or a local

> WIldlife Rescue Centre, there's no doubt Forumites

> would have looked up the contact details for you.

Wow..... now you have added a guilt trip into the proceedings. Well done!

[Foxhelp]

Oh well.. they were shut at weekends and only had recorded messages. I left messages everywhere I could think of and no one called me back, sad. The RSPCA only responded yesterday. Maybe you will have better luck contacting the right people for me. Can you find that out for me please? What I want to know is who do I contact should this happen again Kiera? Where is the local wildlife rescue centre that is open weekends? Please let me know , thank you.

[aquarius moon]

Although I'm not blaming you at all for what happened, kind of agree with Kiera about your lack of communication on the forum.

Obviously I don't know when the poor cubs died, but you posted on a Saturday.

If they were still alive Sun/Mon and you had no response from RSPCA etc., and vixen hadn't returned, I'm sure if you had posted further info about this, somebody on here would have offered to come & collect the cubs & take them to an appropriate rescue centre.

Not me personally as I don't drive, but there are loads of animal lovers on here, that do, who would probably be glad to help if it happens again.

[Foxhelp]

Lack of communication?? No one answered apart from Saffron!!! I didnt see any animal lovers answering my post. I gave up on here. Why did no one get intouch? I did what Saffron said but they were closed. I left messages. The fox project is in Tonbridge Wells and the National Fox Wildlife Society is in Northants which probably explains why they didn't even bother to call back. The Rspca didn't want to help and I just couldn't find a local wildlife centre. Incase it happens again is there anyone on here who will come and collect the cubs and take them to an appropriate rescue centre as aquarius moon suggests? Many thanks

[aquarius moon]

Like I said, I'm not blaming you at all.

All I'm saying is that when you posted on the saturday, there was a chance that the vixen would return so it was best not to get involved, hence the lack of help offers.

If, however, she still hadn't returned the next day and/or the cubs condition was starting to deteriorate, if you had posted on here, somebody would have offered to help.

[Foxhelp]

Bullshit im afraid but thanks for optimism after the event. No one responded meant No one was interested. I am still waiting for advice on who to call and what to do should it happen again. Animal lovers anywhere?

[aquarius moon]

No, not bullshit.

Just wondering why you didn't keep the forum updated, as Saffron suggested.

It was early days & mum could have come back.

If a few days passed & she still hadn't returned, a lot more people would have been interested & offered help.