Southwark Primary School Admissions for Sept 2013

[Mattsoper]

It won't help with September 2013 admissions but it seems plans are under way for Ivydale School to expand, as revealed by Peter John, Leader of Southwark Council, on Twitter yesterday:

"Delighted that Ivydale School will be expanding onto the Bredinghurst site to provide more primary school places for Peckham Rye & Nunhead."

What that means for the Victorian buildings on that site remains to be seen as they seem far from ideal to be converted for primary school use.

[Renata Hamvas]

Hi Matt, I have posted about this is the main section. Council Officers are hoping to save some of the buildings. We will need to make sure that the plans are well thought through.

Waiting lists: yes the rollercoasters you are seeing Emski and Gina are real. We have entered the time of year when people are moving. Mainland Europe, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Eire are already on holiday. Families are also moving within the UK. This means people are taking up places for older children in primaries and siblings going in high on waiting lists and also just moving close to schools. Also people tend to apply quickly for school places when they move into the area and may not notify the LA quite so quickly when they move away. Unfortunately this means that from what I have seen over the last couple of years, on the whole people tend to slide lower on waiting lists in July and August and then some places become available from September to December. (eg if children don't turn up in September). When I last checked a couple of weeks ago, all local schools are full, the two with the shortest waiting lists are Hollydale, near Nunhead Station and St Francesca Cabrini on Forest Hill Rd. Both have been rated good by Ofsted, St Francesca Cabrini's most recent Ofsted came out about a week ago and I posted about that here

Renata

[Mattsoper]

Thanks for the update, Renata. I'll keep an eye out for updates on the plans.

[FionaC]

Some further information about the proposed Ivydale expansion - here's the letter that's gone to parents.

Fiona

Cllr Fiona Colley

Nunhead Ward

Dear Parents and Carers,

At last night?s governing body meeting, the local authority invited the school to consider its proposal to expand to become a four form entry school split over two sites ? the current school and the former Bredinghurst School site on Inverton Road. The local authority has initially proposed that this expansion would take place in September 2016.

The governing body agreed in principle to enter discussions with the local authority. Expanding the school offers many exciting opportunities for all pupils, staff, parents and the local community. There is the potential to improve the learning environment as well as to offer the Ivydale experience to more local children. As you know, there has been a significant increase in the number of reception-aged pupils in the area, and this proposal would enable us to better serve their needs. The capital investment and greater amount of space would also enable us to create a truly inspirational school.

The proposals are at very early stages, and there is much work to do over the next academic year to develop and agree what the new expanded school could look like. I would like to assure you that no formal commitments are being entered into at this stage ? I, with the governing body, have committed only to working with the local authority to develop proposals. These discussions will begin next term and will, in time involve parents, carers and the local community. I will of course keep you informed as they progress.

Many thanks for your continued support.

Sincerely,

Helen Ingham

Headteacher

[louloulabelle]

Hi

If any of you are attending tomorrows Meet and Greet for Reception entry children in September at Langbourne then you are more than welcome to join an informal lunch get together a few mums have suggested at The Paxton pub.

Will give us a chance to meet other new parents, especially for those of us who were allocated the school rather than it being a choice! and for the kids to meet so it's a little less daunting in September.

So anyone that fancies meeting up just make your way to the Paxton pub (apparently good outdoor space for kids) on the roundabout at Paxton green nr the health centre not far from Langbourne after the event has concluded around 12 noon.

Look forward to meeting some other New parents and Children!!!!

[TJ]

If it is any help, and I want to avoid giving false hope, we had a place at Goodrich which we declined to Southwark, but 6 weeks later despite repeated calls, seems we still have the place judging by the letters we are getting.

I will double check again tomorrow as the pressure for you all is unfair.

I hope a glut of similar oversights by the clowns in town hall is happening and you all get a place.

[number 2]

I am more than a bit worried about the plans for Ivydale. 4 form entry????? That's crazy! I would have thought that, rather than expanding a largish school that has already had a lot of money thrown at it, it would be better to relocate Hollydale which is looking tired and is incredibly cramped to this bigger site rather than create some kind of "super school". I just think this will effectively kill off Hollydale. I am pretty sure I would feel this way even if I had a place at Ivydale rather than Hollydale. I just think 4 form entry is too big for a primary school. Renata, do you know if they even condsidered doing something with Hollydale instead?

[BeccaL]

Number 2 - our daughter is part of the 4-form entry bulge year at Goodrich. We may be biased but it doesn't seem to have had a problematic effect on the school or the kids - they don't know any different, so don't really have a comparison. Of course, others with kids in different years may say differently, but to us it's not been a problem at all...

[nunheadmum]

4 form entry for 1 year is different from 4 form entry every year - it'll double the size of the school and have it split over 2 sites. It's worrying as to what effect it'll have on a school with such a great community atmosphere.

But then again kids need school places and the Council don't have that many options open to them. So, I'm really torn between my own interests and those of the greater community.

It would be interesting to hear the thinking behind the choice of Ivydale over changes to Hollydale - I hadn't thought of that option. And also why a site that wasn't suitable for redevelopment for Bredingshurst school now is suitable for a primary school. Appreciate they are different kinds of schools but it would be interesting to know more.

[Renata Hamvas]

The former Bredinghurst site is five minutes walk from Ivydale and is a site that was formerly used for educational purposes. There is no such site in the vicinity of Hollydale. Bredinghurst school remained where it was while part of the site was used to build the new school. Once the school buildings were complete (now Newlands school), the old school site was vacated.

Renata

[Mae]

I agree with other posters- this surely runs the risk of turning Ivydale into even more of the "go to" school in Nunhead than it already is and sidelining other Nunhead schools like Hollydale and Rye Oak. My daughter will be starting in 2014 and has no chance of getting into Ivydale based on this years distances :(

[kam1]

Just found out they have added a bulge class at fairlawn, we were previously 12 on the waiting list and have now got a place for our son. Thrilled as it was our first choice, hope some of you are in a similar position.

[FionaC]

As Renata has said the difficulty with trying to expand Hollydale is finding space to do it. In fact because of the limited space, a couple of years ago the school wanted to get smaller (from 1 1/2 forms of entry to 1 form of entry), but this wasn't possible given the high level of demand for places.

The council will be continuing to speak to Hollydale's head and governors as we persue the primary investment strategy. Purely speculation, but perhaps the expansion of Ivydale would mean Hollydale could go down in size after all. I could certainly imagine that whilst some parents would prefer the "super school" 4FE Ivydale and others a more intimate 1 FE Hollydale - they'd be very different with different pros and cons. Anyway, we'll have to see what Hollydale's head and governors views are.

Mae - on the timing of Ivydale's expansion, whilst the new buildings definitely won't be ready till Sept 16, we are going to be working closely with the school to see if there is any way to start the expansion for reception classes any earlier in '14 or '15 within the existing buildings and sites, but we'll have to see as I know the school is already very tight for space.

NunheadMum - I'm also keen to work through the implications of the expansion of the Ivydale on the community feel of the school. It's one of the issues I'll be discussing with the Head when I meet her in September. My feeling is that there must be some creative way of making the split sites a virtue and creating a smaller school feel within what will be a large primary.

Fiona

Cllr Fiona Colley

Nunhead Ward

[James Barber]

Why expan Ivydale when it sounds like you've identified land for a new school?

[buggie]

James - it's snared earlier in the thread... The current government doesn't allow LA's to open new schools (that Michael Gove is a darling isn't he?!).

Much as I'm not against academies (least said on free schools the better), Ivydale is my nearest primary school, all of my neighbours children attend/have attended & thrived, so would rather see a well established school incorporate the site than have to dip into the unknown.

[FionaC]

James - Buggie has answered for me! We have a site we can use for very much need additional primary places right by an existing popular heavily oversubscribed community primary school. So the obvious thing to was to approach Ivydale to see if they were interested rather than seeking a new provider.

[nunheadmum]

But increasing the size of the school to 4 form entry could undermine exactly what is so good about Ivydale - the lovely community feel. Already at 3 reception classes, the feel is different from when my first child started with only 2 classes - we don't know the other parents in the other classes as we did before. And it doesn't feel like as many new parents are stepping up to get involved in things that are going on in the school. (I could be wrong, that's only my perspective.)

That may be a minor point if the teaching is the same - the teaching is what affects the kids most. A larger school may improve other things. But I think that expanding the school will mean a lot of unknowns and a lot of work will be needed - by the council, the school AND the parents - to ensure the good bits of Ivydale don't get lost.

[Carbonara]

"Just been hearing about a lot of people renting houses for a few months and then moving out once they're in. SO ANNOYING. I know people do it, but it shouldn't be allowed."

It isn't allowed! Not if they have another house which they own in the general area, and have taken on a short term rental as well as that house. If renters happen to rent v close to a school as their only home, that is a different matter.

[Cora]

That's my suspicion of why the waiting lists are changing so much.....many people moving to the area are more affluent so when they don't get into a school they want then they can afford to rent nearer, briefly.

Can't blame them, but makes the system very unfair...it's why I like lottery admissions...even playing field...you either get in or don't....wonder what happens with lottery waiting list though?

[LondonMix]

Like Carbonara said, you can't rent a place closer to a school while still having another home. They are very strict about checking up on this. I had a friend who had genuinely sold her home and moved and the school required proof from her solicitor that the other home had been sold. They also check council tax records etc.

If the place they are renting is genuinely a family's primary residence, I'm not really sure the fact that they decided to rent close to a school is unreasonable but its definitely terrible that the shortage of spaces means that only those who happen to live close to a school can get in to one.

Hopefully, the various plans for primary school expansion (Ivydale, the new free schools, etc) will help make this less the case.

[Renata Hamvas]

Cora,

that breaks admissions regulations. They need to use their place of residence for school applications, if someone rents eg a small flat while still owning a family home nearby, indicating they are planning to move back, LAs can and do remove offers of places.

With lottery waiting lists, these are also done by lottery. Basically everyone in a band is put in lattery draw order and the top x no of places are offered. If some of these places become free, these are offered to the next highest people on the list.

Renata

[rachel83]

What if parents are separated (or pretend to be separated) for the purposes of using a rental property as the address for the application, not the home address? How would that be checked, especially if there is no written custody arrangement.

[sb]

.

[Abney]

I spoke to Lewisham and they only go on the address offered to them at the time of the application. It never gets checked again after that. So you could rent a place short term and move away. It won't be checked.

[louloulabelle]

There is hope...

We didnt get any of our 6 choices. We were given Langbourne. Our best waiting list was initially 27th at Bessemer Grange (our no.1 choice). Goodrich etc are not even worth chatting about as we were in the 70's on the lists..

Today we were offered a place at Bessemer Grange so in 3 months we have gone from 27th to being offered a place.

I was pessimistic and didn't think it would happen and went ahead and bought Langbourne uniform but we do now have a silver lining so keep the faith disillusioned of dulwich. It can happen.

oh and if anyone wants brand new langbourne uniform at discounted price I have some to sell!!!