Bus stop outside Picture House - when will it return?

[Reg Smeeton]

Since Covid began, the bus stop outside the Picture House has been closed - presumably because of the wider pedestrian area on the opposite side of the road. Pre-covid the opposite side of the street was used for parking, so the road was even narrower (outside rush hour), so the bus stop closure has always seemed unnecessary to me.

Does Southwark have any plans to reinstate it? How can we push them to sort it out?

[Nigello]

I don't think it is needed, to be honest. It is a very narrow footpath and the next stop is really not that far away. Faster journeys help everyone so a little bit of inconvenience for the few will help more - you know, community spirit, greater good, etc. Similarly, the two stops very close togetehr on Peckham Rye are an oddity.

[Spartacus]

Nigello Wrote:

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> I don't think it is needed, to be honest. It is a

> very narrow footpath and the next stop is really

> not that far away. Faster journeys help everyone

> so a little bit of inconvenience for the few will

> help more - you know, community spirit, greater

> good, etc. Similarly, the two stops very close

> togetehr on Peckham Rye are an oddity.

The stop allows disabled and elderly people to easily access the picture house. Whilst the stop outside the post office isn't far for an able bodied person, think how much of a challenge it is for someone in a wheelchair or with mobility issues.

It could make the difference between staying home or going out to see a movie and being social for some

Walk a few feet in their wheelchair tracks rather than make such a bold statement that it's a bit of inconvenience !!!

[KalamityKel]

It's not just about visiting the picture house. If you were to walk from stop to stop they are actually a lot further apart than you think, especially as you come down from the Library.

The stop is also where the P13 joins the main route (when it wants to), there's the school,...

There's a few things to consider here.

[Cora]

Thank you Spartacus, completely agree. Would love to see it re-instated.

[Nigello]

Yes, I agree tehre are few things to consider but it is all about the greater good, don't you think? I think preventing build up of traffic and an increase in noxious fumes at a narrowed section of the road trumps the occasional inconvenience to a much smaller number of people. It's a truism, but you really can't have it all. Also, is your statement about elderly or disabled people based on your own experience or that of a person you are close to, or are you conjecturing how every such person would think? I know a few disabled people and they have a variety of views on many different things and don't like to be seen as a unit. The wheelchair user is also highly mobile and would not balk at an extra two minutes' wheeling, so that is a concrete example of someone who would not be inconvenienced despite their body's limitations.

[Abe_froeman]

Isn't more accessible public transport supposed to reduce traffic and noxious fumes? If it is causing the traffic and fumes then we should get rid of all buses to clear the roads for cars.

[Earl Aelfheah]

I don't understand why they felt the need to close it. As Reg says, the extended pavement is not wider that the car parking spaces that were there before it (in fact it's narrower).

[Nigello]

The shelter means the footpath width there is narrowed by about a half so in the early days of the pandemic the authorities thought it would cause people to be too close to each other.

[Spartacus]

Nigello Wrote:

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> Yes, I agree tehre are few things to consider but

> it is all about the greater good, don't you think?

> I think preventing build up of traffic and an

> increase in noxious fumes at a narrowed section of

> the road trumps the occasional inconvenience to a

> much smaller number of people. It's a truism, but

> you really can't have it all. Also, is your

> statement about elderly or disabled people based

> on your own experience or that of a person you are

> close to, or are you conjecturing how every such

> person would think? I know a few disabled people

> and they have a variety of views on many different

> things and don't like to be seen as a unit. The

> wheelchair user is also highly mobile and would

> not balk at an extra two minutes' wheeling, so

> that is a concrete example of someone who would

> not be inconvenienced despite their body's

> limitations.

Personal experience using a wheelchair!

With the closure of Rye Lane stopping me accessing the cinema there as buses no longer go up Rye Lane , and the closure of this bus stop I am no longer able to get to either of my local cinemas.

Not wanting it all but I do want the same equal opportunity to see a film like you do and why should I and others be forced to "wheel" a bit further because you don't think it's an inconvenience?

Frankly your statement about "the greater good" smacks off disability discrimination on your behalf.

[jazzer]

Nigello - what a crass comment you made, try walking in others footsteps before making your statement and displaying such outright selfish righteousness.

Spartacus - Totally agree with you. Some people seem to have the mind set of beggars can't be choosers, how wrong they are. A disability should not deny anyone ever from the right to parity of opportunity.

[redjam]

Nigello Wrote:

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> The shelter means the footpath width there is

> narrowed by about a half so in the early days of

> the pandemic the authorities thought it would

> cause people to be too close to each other.

The irony with this argument is that the next bus stop down by the Post Office is now extra crowded due to the closure of the previous stop, which is not helpful for social distancing given that there's always a queue of people waiting outside the Post Office.

I absolutely agree with the OP - there's no reason for the Picturehouse bus stop to remain closed. In fact there was never a good reason to close it in the first place.

[Nigello]

I am the opposite of self-righteous - how could I be when I am acknowledging difficulties and problems on a number of fronts and presenting an in-the-round view? Take a step back and understand that nobody is making a personal attack on anyone else because we are unknown to each other and we cannot know everyone's personal situations unless told - a lot of irateness could be avoided if this were acknowledged! Not all things are possible all the time and that all personal predicaments and future events cannot be factored in when discussing public facilities. This does not make me crass let alone dismissive of anyone. (As it stands, nobody at all has parity of opportunity to use this stop because there is no opportunity - the stop is closed!) Of course it would be preferable if every bus stop could stay open at all times in all circumstances so that as many people could use it as their first preference but that would be an impossibility. Covid has made us aware that services and finances are finite and that humans - able bodied or not - are adaptable and pragmatic, even when there is some personal cost to making those adaptations.

[Spartacus]

Keep digging that hole Nigello

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China's down this way

[jazzer]

So are you are saying parity of opportunity does not exist, if that is not discrimination, I really don't know what is???

If you actually read what I had written, I said "what a crass comment you made". I did not call you crass.

Yes, anything is possible, there is no such thing as "can't". It's a mindset.

Before Transport for London was created, bus stops were NEVER, EVER closed.

We have all paid a heavy personal cost over the past 15 months, just think about the thousands upon thousands who have lost their lives through Covid and the impact that has had on friends and family of the deceased.

I'd suggest being a bit more thoughtful for those who are less able than yourself and you may just wish to consider the impact these things are having on others in the local community rather than presenting yourself to be so high and mighty, as its a long way up but an even longer way back down.

[richard tudor]

Nigello Wrote:

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> The shelter means the footpath width there is

> narrowed by about a half so in the early days of

> the pandemic the authorities thought it would

> cause people to be too close to each other.

Did the residents of ED/LL ever worry about this. I cannot remember they did.

[Spartacus]

Everything else aside, back to the original question raised

When ?

[Bic Basher]

Spartacus Wrote:

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> Everything else aside, back to the original

> question raised

>

> When ?

Presumably once all Covid restrictions are lifted.

[OutOfFocus]

> Presumably once all Covid restrictions are lifted.

Until if (when?) they get imposed again.

[Abe_froeman]

I suspect it will reopen shortly after the council have proved that buses on Lordship Lane are not being delayed by the new LTNs.

Having fewer stops offsets the impact of the increased traffic on bus journey times, so I don't think you can expect this stop to reopen any time earlier than the end of the LTN consultation.

[Sue]

Abe_froeman Wrote:

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> I suspect it will reopen shortly after the council

> have proved that buses on Lordship Lane are not

> being delayed by the new LTNs.

>

> Having fewer stops offsets the impact of the

> increased traffic on bus journey times, so I don't

> think you can expect this stop to reopen any time

> earlier than the end of the LTN consultation.

How cynical!

[Metallic]

Sue Wrote:

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> Abe_froeman Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I suspect it will reopen shortly after the

> council

> > have proved that buses on Lordship Lane are not

> > being delayed by the new LTNs.

> >

> > Having fewer stops offsets the impact of the

> > increased traffic on bus journey times, so I

> don't

> > think you can expect this stop to reopen any

> time

> > earlier than the end of the LTN consultation.

>

>

> How cynical!

It may be cynical, but it is what everyone believes!

[Abe_froeman]

There is no other logical explanation for it to remain closed.

[northernmonkey]

I think there is still a random perception that its narrow and needs to be closed for 'social distancing'. As we know its a bit ridiculous as others are more congested. So would support reopening. Suggest people write to their local councilor to ask for attention to be given to it!

[jazzer]

While I totally agree that this stop should be re-opened immediately, I fear the argument will be that as the other side of the road has been narrowed to allow people to walk in the fenced off area thus they will not. As was suggested bombard your councillors so they have to take action.