School Places

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

That is definitely a much fairer way to give out school places after looked after children etc.

gebbjane Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Totally agree with this - I?ve heard of some

> schools that have siblings in catchment, then

> catchment as their policy. So if you move out of

> the area and you are applying for a sibling the

> application is considered by distance only - the

> sibling is given no pirority.

>

> peolDulwichBorn&Bred Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > If the sibling priority is removed but not t

> > catchment then I agree totally as I do know of

> > people who had a kid in a Dulwich school, moved

> to

> > a bigger house in Crystal Palace etc when they

> had

> > more children but still commuted to Dulwich for

> > their other children to attend the schools

> here,

> > sibling priority should only apply if they are

> > still within the catchment.

> >

> >

> > northernmonkey Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> > > Its quite clear that the fairer way for this

> to

> > > work would be for the Charter Schools to

> remove

> > > their sibling priority unless either sibling

> > has

> > > SEN where this would make it necessary to

> take

> > > them to school.

> > >

> > > Secondary school age children are expected to

> > > travel independently - and if they could go

> to

> > a

> > > local school this would be even easier.

> > >

> > > In addition, before TCSED was built, for

> those

> > > locally who didn't get a place at Charter

> > North,

> > > the option was Harris Boys and Harris Girls.

> > Why

> > > is it so crucial that siblings go to the same

> > > Charter School, but totally fine to split

> them

> > up

> > > you you have boy / girl siblings otherwise?

> > >

> > > The sibling place priority encourages the

> > behavior

> > > being complained about - where people with 3

> -

> > 4

> > > kids move out once the first has a place but

> > then

> > > continue to travel in for the next 10 years!

[scarlettbanks]

Sounds like a good suggestion to me.

I think the sibling policy is fair for when child 1 gets into school, then child 2 applies to same school and the family haven't moved house.

But I agree something needs to be done to stop families renting near schools with their first kid, and then moving back to their normal home afterwards (and getting all younger siblings into same school, despite not living close). I think the Charter Schools decide on their own admissions policy (not Southwark Council). So perhaps parents should contact the Charter proposing this?

As I said in a previous message, I also like the idea of parents being encouraged to report cases when it is known that this practice is taking place - it feels uncomfortable, but we need to discourage this practice in some way.

[akc74]

We are about 970m from HBAED (and 930m from Charter ED) - we put HB 4th and got it

[Indie1399]

Im hoping lists will move from 15th March. We were told we have until 15th to accept our allocated place, i didn't do anything however the option to accept or decline has now disappeared. I then received a letter a few days ago welcoming us to the school.

We are banking on a waiting list position at one of our listed preferences..waiting is hard so hopefully its not much longer!

[Jellybeanz]

Does anyone know if the head teacher at East Dulwich Charter is leaving? Might be idle gossip but would like to know as considering accepting place there and would like to know..

Thanks!

[akc74]

I believe so, I think the process of recruiting a replacement must currently be happening

[redjam]

Re. head of Charter ED. We had a communication from the school about this yesterday, as follows:

Dear parents/carers

We are delighted to announce the appointment of two new Heads of School for The Charter School East Dulwich and The Charter School North Dulwich. Alison Harbottle will take up the position of Head of School at The Charter School East Dulwich, and Mark Pain will take up the role at The Charter School North Dulwich, both from September. The new appointees will report to Christian Hicks, current Headteacher at North Dulwich, who becomes Executive Headteacher from September across the two secondaries.

Alison Harbottle will be joining the team at East Dulwich from the Aldridge Education Trust, where she is the Senior Trust Lead working with eleven schools and colleges across the country, supporting the CEO and Senior Leaders to develop and implement Trust-wide school improvement strategies. Alison was previously an Assistant Headteacher at The Charter School North Dulwich and went on to become Deputy Headteacher at the Prendergast Ladywell School. Alison will take up her role as Head of School for The Charter School East Dulwich as the new 6th Form welcomes its first intake of students, and as the school moves into its next phase of growth as a 11-18 school offering an inclusive and excellent education for up to 1700 pupils in our part of South East London.

Mark Pain will step up into the position of Head of School at North Dulwich from his current role as Deputy Headteacher in charge of Curriculum and Assessment. Mark has been part of the Senior Leadership team at North Dulwich since joining as an Assistant Headteacher in 2014. He was previously a Director of Learning at Pegasus College, part of the Riddlesdown Collegiate. Mark will be responsible for ensuring The Charter School North Dulwich not only maintains its outstanding record of academic excellence but also continues to develop and improve for all our pupils.

Both will also be focussed on ensuring that all pupils continue to access the education, support and interventions that they need as schools return to normality after the disruption caused by the pandemic.

These are two excellent appointments. Both Alison and Mark are highly talented and experienced senior leaders who have the commitment and drive we need as we work together to improve our secondary schools still further. The new leadership structure marks an exciting step forward as we seek to continue to develop our schools as beacons of educational excellence both locally and nationally, providing greater opportunity for collaboration and co-operation that will enable us to offer an even more fantastic academic education for all our pupils alongside the wide-ranging cultural, artistic and sporting opportunities that we know are so important for their wider learning and development.

[LoulaRose]

RoundTable Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> When the estate on greendale gets built, that will

> become a cash cow for rental properties to get

> into either charter. Unless Southwark do something

> about it, except they can?t, because when they

> gave permission to build charter east they did not

> insist on a clause giving preference to children

> in local primary schools (as is the case in a lot

> of boroughs increasingly, because they anticipate

> such problem).

I expect the answer to this is in another thread, but has planning for the estate on Green Dale been granted?

[Trish123]

Deleted.

I noticed people already commented on the unfairness of the sibling policy for secondary school. I totally agree

[Trish123]

Does anybody know if Charter East Dulwich Stagger lunch times? I can't imagine more than 1,500 kids trying to get lunch at the same time. I have heard it is nearly impossible in Kingsdale with 2,000 kids, also very difficult in Charter North Dulwich unless you want to miss the whole break queuing.

[Trish123]

Also, Why is the Head Teacher of Charter East Dulwich moving?

[Trish123]

Dr De Soto Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Anyone getting the impression that the catchment

> areas are smaller this year?

As Charter East Dulwich grows the catchment will get smaller as most of the places will be taken by siblings, children teachers and children with EHCP. They should really remove the sibling policy for secondary school as it is very unfair.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

They do, it?s on the timetable https://www.chartereastdulwich.org.uk/page/?title=Our+School+Day&pid=86

Trish123 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Does anybody know if Charter East Dulwich Stagger

> lunch times? I can't imagine more than 1,500 kids

> trying to get lunch at the same time. I have heard

> it is nearly impossible in Kingsdale with 2,000

> kids, also very difficult in Charter North Dulwich

> unless you want to miss the whole break queuing.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

He is being replaced by the past Assistant Head from Charter North from what I can gather.

Trish123 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Also, Why is the Head Teacher of Charter East

> Dulwich moving?

[Soylent Green]

The sibling policy is only unfair to people who have only one child, who are in the minority. For the majority, it means only having to go through the horrible place?/no place?/waiting list? scenario once. Whilst I appreciate that it is hard for parents who have not been allocated their favoured schools at this time of year, would you really want to go through the same scenario for each of your children?

[tomskip]

In an area with so many single sex schools, the sibling policy very often simply doesn't apply anyway! Either it's important that siblings go to the same school for reasons other than convenience, or it isn't.

Sibling priority is definitely to be scrutinised if the family have moved out of "catchment" and so they are sending children to school maybe 2km away when a child who lives less than 1km away does not get a place.

Also, there are plenty of NT children who get a sibling place because their older sibling has SEN such as dyslexia. Again, I don't see the need for this. If 11 year old siblings are expected to go on a train or bus to separate schools in a different borough for their education then NT siblings or siblings who have moved away could also reasonably be expected to do the same.

[redjam]

Re. headteacher leaving Charter ED - he is going to become the head of the London Academy of Excellence in Stratford (such a daft name I can't even type it with a straight face, though it is a hugely successful school). He will be 'expanding LAE substantially and developing a network of like-minded schools', apparently.

Re. the earlier question about staggered lunch breaks, yes, even Kingsdale do it for their 2,000+ pupils! My daughter in Year 11 is currently having her 'lunch' at 10.45am - she's not best pleased. Hopefully it won't continue like this once Covid restrictions are removed.

[DuncanW]

Soylent, I'm not certain that's right.

If you have two kids or more and at the time your eldest is applying for secondary schools, they can't get a local school because other families have moved into the area to get their eldest in, and then moved out and the younger ones are getting sibling priority, would that not be a disadvantage?

[Soylent Green]

That follows the assumption that a) a place does not come up at a preferred school between March and September (or even later, since some children do change school in the first year, or later), b) That the family does not grow to like the school that the eldest attends, even if it wasn't a top choice in the first place.

Our first choice was Charter, we got Kingsdale, son chose to stay with Kingsdale when a waiting list place came up at Charter. Daughter, who has special needs and therefore could truly choose secondary, decided to follow brother to Kingsdale, because it felt familiar and she knew her brother liked it. Sibling policy is not just about school commute(as many on her seem to express as a reason against a sibling policy), there is a considerable amount of emotional attachment too, and schools would lose their community feel if they lost the loyalty of families. Moreover, from a school's point of view, building a relationship with families where there are problems is important. No sibling policy would make this much harder. This idea of people swooping into an area for the school places and then moving out is a distraction, as very few people actually do it.

[DuncanW]

Of course if a place comes up before September, then it's no harm, no foul, right?

I'm glad your two are at a school you all like. But for many families it's not a case of missing out on one super-oversubscribed, Outstanding school in Dulwich and getting another super-oversubscribed Outstanding school in Dulwich.

Many families are missing out on all the great local schools and their kids are having to travel much further, and to schools that are not as highly rated (possibly unjustly) as the ones local to where they live.

I genuinely don't know the prevalence of how many people move in and out of catchment to get school places, but I know it does happen. There's also a case to be made for families who just move out of the area for unconnected reasons to not have the sibling priority.

Anecdotally, my two siblings and I all went to different schools, and it didn't cause any problems at all. The same is true of my own kids.

Obviously, situations involving children with SEN should still be handled with sensitivity.

[Trish123]

Deleted. Quoted wrong message

[Trish123]

redjam Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Re. headteacher leaving Charter ED - he is going

> to become the head of the London Academy of

> Excellence in Stratford (such a daft name I can't

> even type it with a straight face, though it is a

> hugely successful school). He will be 'expanding

> LAE substantially and developing a network of

> like-minded schools', apparently.

>

> Re. the earlier question about staggered lunch

> breaks, yes, even Kingsdale do it for their 2,000+

> pupils! My daughter in Year 11 is currently having

> her 'lunch' at 10.45am - she's not best pleased.

> Hopefully it won't continue like this once Covid

> restrictions are removed.

Thank you. I do not think Charter North Dulwich stagger lunch breaks; Glad to hear Charter East Dulwich does as I can't imagine all those children out at the same time in such a small space.

The sibling policy really needs to be removed in Secondary school. Agree with Duncan, it is not good that local children have to travel miles for another school when children from other areas are commuting to our local schools. Just look at how many children get bus or train and you will find out which ones do not live locally. It is sad that even with a new school of 1,700 children we still do not have enough secondary school places in Dulwich.

[northernmonkey]

Obviously schools are academy trusts and therefore set their own admissions policies, but it feels as though this needs a campaign to address. I think there is a not insignificant number of people who plan to move for secondary school and the increasing trend is to rent during year 6 for school applications for the eldest child, and then at some point during year 7 move into a more 'forever home' slightly further out.

If its not an issue that we should be concerned about, perhaps the schools could indicate how many sibling places were awarded where the sibling lives outside the 'furthest distance offered' criteria?

[RoundTable]

Have people waiting for first choice school moved up or down the list after the March 15th deadline?

[Mrs.E]

@roundtable

I didn?t think we got an update from Southwark until 1st April?