north cross road market

[millie7uk]

Annoyed that North cross Road Market is still open when so many are not, people still gathering, no masks, no social distancing, children running around, ok, but people who actually live here feel they cannot go out to shop/chemists as so MANY people etc, are around, Southwark Council have been informed and the fact that they have done anything to stop this so far (through their own negligence) is not an excuse to be a bunch of pratts, show some sense and regard for other people.

[EDguy89]

Hey there's already a thread about the market.

[millie7uk]

Thankyou

[vmdgg]

Trolley Snatcha Wrote:

> If you are annoyed by this, then do not walk down

> North Cross Road on Saturday afternoon, lest you

> be even more annoyed. Very, very simple solution

> that works for all.

^ Exactly. I Couldn't agree more.

I see no need to make life even more miserable by forcing the closure of yet another amenity, just to appease the permanently outraged covid social media mafia.

[Lynne]

Agree as well, vmdgg and trolley Snatcha

[maniana]

"people who actually live here...."

Loving the implication that it's hoardes of outsiders descending on North Cross Road each week and not just residents of the road and surrounding streets grabbing a bite to eat, in the open air.

It's only open for a few hours and isn't even the full street, shouldn't be too hard to avoid for those concerned.

[Jules-and-Boo]

I?m more annoyed we?re on lockdown than I would be banning a market where people can?t stick to rules. Although I gather there are now controls in place.

[DulwichFox]

Marshalls are stopping people not wearing Masks walking through North Cross Road

but ignoring Stall Holders preparing and selling Food not wearing masks.

I spoke to one such Stall holder (Fast Food) not wearing a mask.

He said he did not have to wear a mask because he had been Vaccinated.

I said he could possibly still pass on Covid.

He was 20-30 so do not know under what scheme he may of been Vaccinated.

Fast Food to eat as you walk along is NOT Essential

Let's put a Stop to it.

DulwichFox

[RoundTable]

DulwichFox, what were you doing in the market? Was it an essential trip? How long did you stand there witnessing contraventions? If half of east dulwich go to north street every day to ?see? what is was like and and spent 15 minutes wondering around looking for rule breakers, then no wonder it was busy! Seems to me the market is more full with gawkers than customers!

Pot kettle black

I?ll shut up if you are a market inspector or a policeman.

[ianr]

DulwichFox Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Marshalls are stopping people not

> wearing Masks walking through

> North Cross Road

Are you certain you saw them physically preventing people from doing so?

> but ignoring Stall Holders preparing and

> selling Food not wearing masks.

I don't believe the regulations on wearing of masks in shops, etc would apply to stall holders, or customers, because the market is not indoors. See the definitions of 'relevant place', 'shop' and 'shopping centre' in para.2 of The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings in a Relevant Place) (England) Regulations 2020. The word 'market' doesn't appear.

It seems to me that the best legitimate action would be against instances of gathering, of any group of two or more who aren't from the same household or bubble. That would be for a police officer to do. The best personal safegaurd would probably be to avoid the place if it's crowded. The risk each day of getting infected rises with the number of people you get near to, and masks are far from perfect barriers to something the size of a virus.

[DulwichFox]

RoundTable Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> DulwichFox, what were you doing in the market? Was

> it an essential trip? How long did you stand there

> witnessing contraventions? If half of east dulwich

> go to north street every day to ?see? what is was

> like and and spent 15 minutes wondering around

> looking for rule breakers, then no wonder it was

> busy! Seems to me the market is more full with

> gawkers than customers!

>

> Pot kettle black

>

> I?ll shut up if you are a market inspector or a

> policeman.

I live on Ulverscroft Road. Going to Lordship Lane M&S or Co-op it is a natural route to go through North Cross Road

I also use Lucas and LLoyds Pharmacy on a regular basis. I try and avoid on Market days.

The market is packed. It does not need to be open under the current situation.

DulwichFox

[KidKruger]

Foxy, the quickest route to LL for you is down Whateley Rd.

Only when you want to arrive on LL further North does the market street (NX) feature as a viable route (when no Covid).

[gabys1st]

Need to ear masks with 2 way filters N95, or next lot down to filter nano particles that linger in the air

[Spartacus]

gabys1st Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Need to ear masks with 2 way filters N95, or next

> lot down to filter nano particles that linger in

> the air

Ear mask ?

Wow that's going to add to my ppe

[DulwichFox]

KidKruger Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Foxy, the quickest route to LL for you is down

> Whateley Rd.

> Only when you want to arrive on LL further North

> does the market street (NX) feature as a viable

> route (when no Covid).

Whateley is Not quicker. It is longer by 200 steps. North Cross has shops which is a nicer route,

Not a problem when the Market is not open. the market IS a problem.

There was a Snow ball fight in a Field 50 odd people.. Loads of space..

The organiser was fine ?10,000

Market in a congested area with 100's of people

Why aren't Market organisers being fined. ?

Cannot give an example at the mo but I'm sure I have read/heard from somewhere that other markets have had to close.

East Dulwich seems to be outside the law. People with a lot of clout. Friends in the right places.

Foxy

ETA

Broadway Market in Hackney forced to close due to lack of social distancing as shoppers flout rules.

Covid-19: Bovingdon Market 'closed indefinitely' over safety fears

Shuttered by Covid: The end of Dagenham Sunday Market

A Christmas market in Nottingham has been shut down for the

rest of the year after criticism over a lack of social distancing.

Cambridge Market shut down as Covid spreads rapidly through city

Just a few examples I have Found.

What do they have in common ?

Responsible Councils..

Southwark does nothing.

[Penguin68]

If the stall holders were all in cars they'd be stopped pronto - Southwark knows where its priorities lie - 4 wheels bad and cause all problems - two wheels (or two feet) - safe as houses and to be encouraged in droves.

[redjam]

Blimey, from the way everyone's reacting it's as if North Cross Road Market is a heaving mass of bodies. It's not. It's no more than a dozen stalls that were well spaced last time I was there, with marshalls at either end asking people to wear masks. In recent weeks it hasn't been that busy and it's EXTREMELY easy to avoid if you don't want to go through it - either by taking a slightly different route to bypass that short stretch of road or, y'know, avoiding going through it between 11am and 3pm on a Saturday. Do you really think it's safer to go to M&S or Co-op to get your lunch ingredients rather than buying something in the open air? And I'd far rather support a local business through these hard times.

[RoundTable]

redjam Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Blimey, from the way everyone's reacting it's as

> if North Cross Road Market is a heaving mass of

> bodies. It's not. It's no more than a dozen stalls

> that were well spaced last time I was there, with

> marshalls at either end asking people to wear

> masks. In recent weeks it hasn't been that busy

> and it's EXTREMELY easy to avoid if you don't want

> to go through it - either by taking a slightly

> different route to bypass that short stretch of

> road or, y'know, avoiding going through it between

> 11am and 3pm on a Saturday. Do you really think

> it's safer to go to M&S or Co-op to get your lunch

> ingredients rather than buying something in the

> open air? And I'd far rather support a local

> business through these hard times.

Well said!

[RoundTable]

DulwichFox Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> KidKruger Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Foxy, the quickest route to LL for you is down

> > Whateley Rd.

> > Only when you want to arrive on LL further

> North

> > does the market street (NX) feature as a viable

> > route (when no Covid).

>

>

> Whateley is Not quicker. It is longer by 200

> steps. North Cross has shops which is a nicer

> route,

> Not a problem when the Market is not open. the

> market IS a problem.

>

> There was a Snow ball fight in a Field 50 odd

> people.. Loads of space..

> The organiser was fine ?10,000

>

> Market in a congested area with 100's of people

> Why aren't Market organisers being fined. ?

>

> Cannot give an example at the mo but I'm sure I

> have read/heard from somewhere that other markets

> have had to close.

> East Dulwich seems to be outside the law. People

> with a lot of clout. Friends in the right places.

>

>

> Foxy

>

> ETA

>

> Broadway Market in Hackney forced to close due to

> lack of social distancing as shoppers flout

> rules.

>

> Covid-19: Bovingdon Market 'closed indefinitely'

> over safety fears

>

> Shuttered by Covid: The end of Dagenham Sunday

> Market

>

> A Christmas market in Nottingham has been shut

> down for the

> rest of the year after criticism over a lack of

> social distancing.

>

> Cambridge Market shut down as Covid spreads

> rapidly through city

>

> Just a few examples I have Found.

>

> What do they have in common ?

> Responsible Councils..

>

> Southwark does nothing.

Those 200 extra steps to avoid north cross roads will do you the world of good during lockdown. Plus anyway you are not supposed to go into non-essential shops so the ?nice? shops in north cross road should be shut. So no reason to have to go through north cross road really.

[Nigello]

But it is NOT just about what "you" want to do. The fact that others are disregarding medical advice/regulations and meeting up for social light bites, keeping close to one another, etc. does have an impact on others, an impact that could copromiise somebody's health badly. So it is entirely invalid to say "don't go there and then all is fine". If the non-compliant people's actions had no impact at all on those who decide to stay inside or shop alone, masked and quickly, it would be fair to criticise them but this is the opposite of what is correct, namely that all of us a potential vectors to a new variant of an already easily transmissable and possibly deadly virus. Sheesh, nobody needs a pulled pork sandwich and weekend catch up au marche that much!

[RoundTable]

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> But it is NOT just about what "you" want to do.

> The fact that others are disregarding medical

> advice/regulations and meeting up for social light

> bites, keeping close to one another, etc. does

> have an impact on others, an impact that could

> copromiise somebody's health badly. So it is

> entirely invalid to say "don't go there and then

> all is fine". If the non-compliant people's

> actions had no impact at all on those who decide

> to stay inside or shop alone, masked and quickly,

> it would be fair to criticise them but this is the

> opposite of what is correct, namely that all of us

> a potential vectors to a new variant of an already

> easily transmissable and possibly deadly virus.

> Sheesh, nobody needs a pulled pork sandwich and

> weekend catch up au marche that much!

But the argument is about the market being busy. It seems it is busy because folks go to gawk. By your logic, nobody needs M&S that much that they are prepared to stand in a queue. In fact, plenty supermarkets are busier than north cross road AND they are indoor. So if folks are so worried about the impact of north cross market, why are they not as worried about the impact of supermarkets? It is because of having options that risk spreads out. It is when people are forced down to one specific shop that crowds happen.

I would not be having this conversation if the argument was against ALL types of shops that encourage crowds, not just selectively a food market that is near their doorstop. It was a slight pong of ?not in my back garden? attitude.

[DulwichFox]

> Those 200 extra steps to avoid north cross roads

> will do you the world of good during lockdown.

> Plus anyway you are not supposed to go into

> non-essential shops so the ?nice? shops in north

> cross road should be shut. So no reason to have to

> go through north cross road really.

Not worried about 200 steps . but when its cold and wet I want to get out as little as possible

and stay in the warm.

Before Covid I was walking 4 - 5 Miles a day.

I use Lucas to buy Loose Flour and Use Lloyds for regular medical needs

Asthma medicine.. From DMC and Diabetic Blood sugar test strips.

I am local here for last 41 years (25 years in Ulverscroft. }

Why should anyone like myself be restricted and told what roads I should and should not use

Why should ANYONE be told what roads they should and should not use.

(Apologies for any incorrect use of Grammar or Spelling )

Fox

[Whoeveritis]

NCR market encourages people to loiter, hang around chatting, meet up and not socially distance. I don?t think inside shops do this, do they?

[n dulwich northerner]

In normal times that's a fair description of a market. It really wasn't like this today or on recent, drier weekends.

Rather than judging things with one's own eyes, I wonder if this thread amounts to anything more than assumptions muttered behind twitching net curtains?

[redjam]

It absolutely does not encourage people to loiter (in fact there are signs asking you not to) and I have seen no evidence of people 'meeting up for social light bites' at the market, certainly not since lockdown. There are no tables/chairs out on the streets or spaces where you're encouraged to linger. You might have to wait for some food to be prepared so maybe that adds to the impression of busyness but it's no worse than people waiting in a queue outside M&S.

Agree with the earlier point that the more places are open where we can buy food, the more the risk is spread. If only supermarkets are open then we really will have a problem.