Sunlit uplands. Are we there yet?

[diable rouge]

The benchmark for me is the total silence from Brexit politicians and supporters.

Had there been a even a scintilla of a Brexit related 'success' they would be harping on about it ad infinitum.

If the Tories, as polls suggest, are routed at the next GE and Brexity MPs like Rees-Mogg and the 2019 intake lose their seats, there's a good chance you will see more people in the party sticking their head above the parapet and calling out Brexit for the failure it is...

[Sephiroth]

The rollbacks just keep coming 

 

(and that’s all there ever will be.  All self-inflicted loss. No gain - not to mention the costs inflicted on neighbouring countries)

 

a moral stain on this country forever 

 

https://news.sky.com/story/eu-equality-laws-to-be-reinstated-to-avoid-gap-in-protections-for-workers-13002094

 

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by Sephiroth

[Sephiroth]

Let’s check in on divergence 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/dec/29/were-out-of-step-how-post-brexit-uk-is-drifting-from-eu-standards?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

 

 

oh

and the much-delayed U.K. checks on imports starts in a few weeks   That will go well too 

 

 

[Sephiroth]

Farage told you in 2016 to vote leave or else it would be the end of steel in the uk

 

It’s 2024 and uk steel is over despite leaving the eu.  So now Farage is onto the next scam and blaming net zero 

meanwhile Johnson is now advocating for another trump presidency

 

Dangerous grifters the lot of them. And too many people continue to pretend to not see 

[Spartacus]

Come now Sep

TATA Steel.are an Indian owned company and their decision to move to cleaner arc furnaces isn't one that is related to EU directives but environmental reasons. 

It is very sad that so many are losing their jobs in the industry but TATA are still going to be making steel in the UK using cleaner technologies and with a large multi million cash injection from the government. 

[Sephiroth]

I’m not saying the tata steel decision is Brexit related 

 

what I’m saying is that farage, Johnson’s and co said that it was imperative to vote  leave to save the British steel industry 

[vladi]

What some us may not have grasped is that proposed new electric arc furnaces will largely be using raw steel made by blast furnaces owned by Tata in India and then shipped half way round the world to the UK.. Some of the input will be scrap metal.

So it appears this is largely a matter of off-shoring the carbon problem and creating more jobs in India at the expense of the Port Talbot workforce.
It's a win for the politicos who can enhance their green credentials. And a win to Tata who make more profits.

Meanwhile our Port Talbot workers are shafted.

Giving up the blast furnaces means also that there will be no need for coking coal in the UK and so the  new mine near Whitehaven. Result;  is more jobs lost.

What a way to run a country!

 

[Spartacus]

Going green 

Damned if you do, damned if you don't by the sounds of it.

Virgin steel still needs the higher temperatures produced by coke and we are simply offshoring the carbon foot print for it.

is it a good thing ? Possibly not but it is  an industry trend and hopefully investment and new technologies will be made in alternative virgin steel production that doesn't need coke and can demonstrate a much greater footprint than the blast furnaces may become redundant. 

[vladi]

Living in hope that new investment will spawn new technologies to replace the blast furnace process to make pig iron is a pipe dream.

So why scrap the two blast furnaces before there is any hint of an alternative? It's plain crazy!

Making pig iron is a chemical process only achieved at the high temperatures achieved by using high quality coke. iron ore, lime and oxygen.  The pig iron output is later made into steel using the Bessemer refining process.

[Sephiroth]

The extent of the "greeness" of new processes can be debated - but it isn't really a Brexit debate

 

The point In this thread is workers were lied to and encouraged to vote against their own interests. And they have no way of  registering their change of heart now they know. And that applies right across the country in swathes of industries

[malumbu]

This is Brexit related.  Leaving the EU meant that it was much easier to provide state aid to Tata to support jobs and our economy.  This was also why Corbyn supported Brexit, so we could maintain old school heavy industry. 

"In December 2023, the Government finalised a plan to provide Tata Steel with a grant of £500 million exclusively for decarbonisation of its steel production at Port Talbot. This grant is part of a larger potential capital investment by Tata Steel totalling £1.25 billion. The grant proposal is currently being evaluated by the Subsidy Advice Unit (SAU) of the Competition and Markets Authority. The SAU is planning to publish a report on the grant’s compliance with the subsidy control requirements on 6 February 2024."

House of Commons Library: https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9941/

On supporting decarbonisation of steel some EU states are providing state aid (see above reference).

One could argue that the UK need to support traditional steel production for strategic reasons.  Ultimately it is much cheaper to produce it elsewhere in the globe.

It may be a bit of a side show re: Brexit, but still waiting for the benefits almost 8 years later.

[Sephiroth]

Been a good week hasn't it?

 

- The UK gave up on negotiations to extend our trade deal with Canada, leaving us worse off than when we were an EU member https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68098177

- New incoming border checks will add £200 million a year to the cost of our food and drink. https://eastangliabylines.co.uk/brexit-fallout-200m-price-hike-looms-for-fruit-and-veg-imports/

- MPs were warned that the EU's upcoming ETIAS/EES border systems may lead to 14-hour queues to enter (the rest of) Europe from the autumn. https://itv.com/news/2024-01-25/traffic-gridlock-and-14-hour-queues-await-tourists-entering-to-europe-mps-told

- There were warnings of possible shortages of flowers for Valentines Day because of the new incoming border checks. https://news.sky.com/story/roses-are-red-violets-are-blue-fears-of-shortages-on-valentines-day-over-brexit-checks-with-the-eu-13056060

- A plan to extend visas for British expats in France from 90 to 180 days was blocked by France's Constitutional Council court (a decision which has no right of appeal). https://lbc.co.uk/news/french-court-blocks-allow-british-expats-stay-france-90-days/

- Rishi Sunak's pledge to ensure no future laws can create a border down the Irish Sea has gone down like a bucket of sick in TUV quarters. (And has sent the blood pressure of the usual suspect Brexiters sky-high.) https://belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/brexit/jim-allister-rishi-sunaks-offer-to-dup-on-sea-border-makes-a-nonsense-of-brexit/a1159820922.html

- The EU's plans to increase bulk medicine procurement across the bloc risk creating shortages in Britain because they have very significantly greater buying power than the UK does. https://theguardian.com/science/2024/jan/25/eu-plan-medicine-stockpile-uk-record-shortages

[Sephiroth]

And 8 years (eight!) after the referendum what is it about ending freedom of movement that British people don’t get?

 

anyone?

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13009671/amp/brits-forced-leave-french-homes-brexit-rules-visa-rights-thrown-out.html

[Sephiroth]

4th anniversary yesterday lads. 
 

no celebrations? 
 

no one?

[Sephiroth]

British farmers screwed by Australian deal.  Long term pain for short term popular headlines. Sums the whole exercise up

 

ironic that arch brexiteer Catty is back in Australia but will still be telling  himself and us it was a good idea for the uk

 

https://www.nationalworld.com/news/politics/brexit-british-beef-australia-trade-4556041

 

 

[TheCat]

I'm touched that you're thinking of me.

It must get rather dull to just keep posting to yourself on this thread I suppose.

'Arch Brexiteer'?...Good one:)

[diable rouge]

Cat, I'm surprised that you still view the Forum, did you sell your ED home or rent it out and therefore still have ties with the area?

If the latter, should we expect a Cat 2.0 at some point?...

 

[TheCat]

I just cant get me enough of an LTN argument DR...;)

I hadnt checked in on the forum in quite a long time, but had reason to, as am planning a quick trip back later this year...and of course couldn't resist a peek at Sunlit Uplands.

I still have ties, and I wouldn't rule out a Cat 2.0 in years to come. 

Anyway. Hope all well or well enough. Cat's returning to hibernation now.

[malumbu]

Poltergeist part 2 (They're back).  Bit quiet without you Cat.

On this subject Brexit was about getting our country back, 8 years later Reform (ex Brexit party) are still campaigning with this slogan.  

(Part 1 was on my bring back Boris thread)

[Sephiroth]

unbelievable  - not only does he pop back up to NOT address a point, he then lies about how often he checks the  forum

"I hadnt checked in on the forum in quite a long time, but had reason to, as am planning a quick trip back later this year...and of course couldn't resist a peek at Sunlit Uplands."

I wonder what "quite a long time" can be defined as? Days? Weeks? Months?

Because dear reader, if we were to take a look at forum IP records I can assure you that Cat is a regular visitor - he just chooses not to post. But mention his name and boom there he is

But yes, there is merit to the argument that there is no-one posting on here which given how much the population loves to grumble about the cost of everything it still collectively won't engage with what it needs to do to start addressing the problems

And I used the Australian trade deal as an example 

 

 

[Spartacus]

55 minutes ago, Sephiroth said:

 

Because dear reader, if we were to take a look at forum IP records I can assure you that Cat is a regular visitor - he just chooses not to post. But mention his name and boom there he is

 

 

Are you able to see forum ip records and frequency of access because normal users can't 🤔 

[Sephiroth]

nope - I can't see anything - what I said was "IF were to take a look we would see"

But if we look at Cat's profile any of us  can see "last visited" - and he has been a frequent visitor

 

 

[Spartacus]

2 hours ago, Sephiroth said:

nope - I can't see anything - what I said was "IF were to take a look we would see"

But if we look at Cat's profile any of us  can see "last visited" - and he has been a frequent visitor

 

 

Lol 

You sound like you are Cats stalker or fan boy 😉🤣

Got to admit checking when users are on isn't something I've done. 

[Sephiroth]

"You sound like you are Cats stalker or fan boy "

 

nope - just wary. Call it a hangover from my days as a moderator on here

[diable rouge]

It's amazing how many people still don't realise that they're leaving an electronic footprint as they browse around online and/or while using their smart phones...