LTN: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3

[flippit]

Have a look at.........

https://videalert.com/civil-traffic-enforcement/bollard-control/

If they Southwark invested some of the money they received from central government on ANPR access then we would not be having the concentrated pollution and grief we are having at present.

The chattering classes in Dulwich will not forgive the arrogance of Cllrs RICHARD LEEMING and MARGY NEWENS for sacrifising our health because of their stupidity.

[smooch]

I think the most awful thing is the anger, division and animosity that Southwark Council have created and seem oblivious/ambivilent to.

They really do not give a F**k that this is one of many threads that are pages and pages long with arguments from both sides of the fence and they are just ignoring it totally. We get the occasaional foray in from some poor petrified councillor who has to tow the party line but probably has some difficulty in dealing with this amount of anger. The 'consultation' questions are so blatantly leading one could cry.

After such an awful year, you would think they would consult with key contributors - bus drivers, emergency services and perhaps the local businesses who have created such a fantastic local high street. But no - of course not....

Just before the local elections I had some representative who was trying to say that the local chaos was not Southwarks fault but a citywide problem - I pulled her up on this (they implented them) when I asked what her opinions were about the serious concerns of local businesses she was very flustered and had no answer. As a lifelong labour supporter I was very clear in my current mood - poor thing did not know what to say.

We have had COVID, we have had BREXIT and a bunch of ivory tower idiots are playing roulette with peoples lives and livelihoods.

[legalalien]

Smooch I agree. Perhaps (and I?m speaking for myself here), the best part of a year in lockdown has caused many people to focus more on what is happening in their local neighbourhood and how the processes work - and are not happy with what they see. For years I have blithely assumed that some sort of in built checks and balances ensured transparency and accountability in local govt but on a closer look some of these aren?t operating properly. I think that with such a massive majority at the polls, the Labour local govt administration may have become less sensitive to local views on their policies?

[tiddles]

Legalalien - yes me too - it seems the whims and fancies of some people who may have no connection with an area are steamrolling an agenda. One imagines there to be due diligence- but there are many Southwark employees who are not familiar with the area at all (I have a friend who lives in lewes and a relation based in Nottinghamshire who both work for Southwark council. I feel there needs to be an understanding of an area before imposing such changes and a willingness to examine the results.

[hammerman]

Totally agree Tiddles! It seems like Southwark Council are run by people who want to bring in rules for this and that (Will Norman, who lives in East London, take note) but wait until it hits their own living and working area!

Southwark Council also seem unable to keep on top of their housing stock.

[Droid]

Dale Foden ( Head of Highways, no less) should take a trip to Birmingham where the council implemented their ANPR scheme today. Maybe if Southwark used some of the funding they received for this rather than expensive benches (?1,000 a pop) and the planters then we wouldnt be having all this grief over displaced pollution and congestion.

This is from https://airqualitynews.com/2021/01/27/new-cameras-installed-in-birmingham-ahead-of-caz/

Siemens Mobility has installed 67 automatic number plate recognition cameras (ANPR) in Birmingham ahead of the new Clean Air Zone (CAZ).

The ANPR cameras will identify and register every vehicle that enters the CAZ in order to identify which vehicles are exempt from charges.

The Class D CAZ has been designed to deter drivers of the most polluting vehicles from entering the zone, drivers of all vehicles will be charged, including cars, if they do not meet the latest emissions standards.

The ANPR cameras at the heart of the scheme.

[richard tudor]

When did Dale Foden become a Cllr? not seen any confirmation of this from Southwark. If he is who does he represent/Ward.

[exdulwicher]

When did Dale Foden become a Cllr? not seen any confirmation of this from Southwark. If he is who does he represent/Ward.

He's not a councillor, he's Head of Highways at Southwark Council.

[exdulwicher]

News of TfL's latest Government bailout here:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-agrees-conditions-based-108-billion-funding-deal-with-transport-for-london

In amongst it are the following requirements:

- deliver ?300 million of savings or new income sources in 2021 to 2022

- identify new or increased sources of revenue for TfL of between ?0.5 billion to ?1 billion each year from 2023

- set aside at least ?100 million to continue the delivery of healthy streets and active travel programmes

[legalalien]

Any thoughts on potential impact on the Bakerloo line extension? I started reading a Southwark paper about that earlier this morning and was struck by how much Southwark seem to be relying on Old Kent Road development to achieve housing and climate emergency commitments. Need to have a proper read when I get a chance.

[exdulwicher]

Any thoughts on potential impact on the Bakerloo line extension?

The land is safeguarded, that happened a couple of months ago.

But there's still no funding in place for it or timeline on delivery, it's very much in the "we'd like to do it" pile at the moment. The consultations on it were all very positive.

However on the upside, you can't just leave land safeguarded for ever although equally the safeguarding process does not give any powers for the extension to be built...

Not sure how long it would take to build the whole thing if the full funding and planning was in place.

[Penguin68]

Totally agree Tiddles! It seems like Southwark Council are run by people who want to bring in rules for this and that (Will Norman, who lives in East London, take note) but wait until it hits their own living and working area!

It is the 'local roads for local people' Royston Vaisey mind-set which has bedevilled the initial creation of our local LTN. There is no reason why someone not domiciled in, or even working in, Southwark cannot come up with a workable and fair solution which does not just shunt traffic problems into areas with less influential residents. Not that they have, of course.

London is made up of many (often contiguous) residential areas where residents of one necessarily, in order to live their lives and work their jobs, have to cross over into and through others. If each one is to set up their borders and exclude 'foreigners' (and how often that is prayed in aid by those advocating CTNs?) then all we will get is resentment and anger.

And very poor use of infrastructure - where some roads now are hardly use at all, and others are almost permanently gridlockd. I wonder, if road and pavement repair and refurbishment was consequent on volume of usage (which it probably should be, given that it is usage which wears it out) how quickly those in LTNs would start squealing for potholes to be filled.

[legalalien]

Here?s the report from December that they recently consulted on, there?s timeframes in there. It does talk about possible level of development with or without the extension, but as the new properties have to be car free, not having the extension would massively affect demand/ feasibility you?d think. It all seems very ambitious and I suspect there?ll be similar gentrification etc issues as have happened at the Elephant. Not really relevant to this thread, but is probably an indication of some of the things we might expect to see in the Climate Change Strategy.

https://www.southwark.gov.uk/assets/attach/31613/210111_OKRAAP_Addendum_Reduced.pdf

[Rockets]

Does anyone know what Southwark's rules on bike sheds are? Can you build an "out-building" in your front garden without issue?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-57159538

[legalalien]

Reading through this month's forward plan. There will be another couple of "minor traffic schemes" in July and September and a placeholder has been put in for a decision on the Dulwich schemes in September - and on the Peckham Rye East schemes in November (decisions have to be flagged up in advance).

https://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/mgIssueHistoryHome.aspx?IId=50026429&PlanId=672.

Some other interesting upcoming things as well which I'll try and flag up when detail is available.

[Dogkennelhillbilly]

Droid Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Dale Foden ( Head of Highways, no less) should

> take a trip to Birmingham where the council

> implemented their ANPR scheme today. Maybe if

> Southwark used some of the funding they received

> for this rather than expensive benches (?1,000 a

> pop) and the planters then we wouldnt be having

> all this grief over displaced pollution and

> congestion.

> This is from

> https://airqualitynews.com/2021/01/27/new-cameras-

> installed-in-birmingham-ahead-of-caz/

>

> Siemens Mobility has installed 67 automatic number

> plate recognition cameras (ANPR) in Birmingham

> ahead of the new Clean Air Zone (CAZ).

>

> The ANPR cameras will identify and register every

> vehicle that enters the CAZ in order to identify

> which vehicles are exempt from charges.

>

> The Class D CAZ has been designed to deter drivers

> of the most polluting vehicles from entering the

> zone, drivers of all vehicles will be charged,

> including cars, if they do not meet the latest

> emissions standards.

>

> The ANPR cameras at the heart of the scheme.

This is the same technology that has already been installed for the ULEZ. It works because it's accessing information already held on the computer at Swansea: the emissions of each vehicle.

The OneDulwich fantasy is of a scheme which inconveniences everyone except them, administered by a computer system that already magically knows whether a car benefits from all the specific exemptions that OneDulwich wants, and without having a Controlled Parking Zone.

It is not a good faith request: they know it is not practical. Like the totally bonkers suggestion that HGVs could turn around in the area covered by flowerpots at the end of Calton Ave, the point is not to propose solutions that would actually reduce congestion or emissions. It's to gum up the process and spread confusion.

Meanwhile, someone in the militant wing of the anti-LTN lobby has been ripping up plants from the plant pots and scattering them across the tarmac, and spraying yellow paint across "Road closed" signs. That includes the one at the top of Gilkes Crescent - when Gilkes Crescent has been a dead end for years and unrelated to the LTN scheme.

What is wrong with these people?

[heartblock]

Thanks legal, is it an open meeting. On another note ED Grove during this school holiday is literally ?a breath of fresh air? I hopped on a 37 bus yesterday as had hurt my knee gardening over the BH and it swept down East Dulwich Grove. The schools and Southwark really need to rethink how much school traffic has been concentrated on school roads like ED Grove and Croxted due to LTNs.

[Droid]

Dogkennelhillbilly Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

ANPR works. If it's good enough for ULEZ and Birmingham Clean Air Zone plus the Police etc, etc. why are you against it?

Are you some kind of computer-sceptic technophobe?

Do not assume that everyone subscribes to Onedulwich's views on the matter. Also, there is no mention of ANPR cameras on OneDulwich's website or any of their documents that I've see.

As to your comment "gum up the process and spread confusion" - that is reminiscent of the way in which totalitarian regimes comment on dissenters. Think China, Iran, etc

The manner in which Southwark has :-

(a) Introduced LTNs under Covid emergency measures.

(b) Manipulated the stats

© Failed to respond to requests for data

(d) Issued a blatantly biased review questionnaire.

I don't support aggressive anti-LTN action (that's for XR juveniles) but I do understand why some locals are incensed over the way this has been introduced. These people's lives are being made unbearable by increased pollution and disruption. Their physical and mental health matters to them.

>

> This is the same technology that has already been

> installed for the ULEZ. It works because it's

> accessing information already held on the computer

> at Swansea: the emissions of each vehicle.

>

> The OneDulwich fantasy is of a scheme which

> inconveniences everyone except them, administered

> by a computer system that already magically knows

> whether a car benefits from all the specific

> exemptions that OneDulwich wants, and without

> having a Controlled Parking Zone.

>

> It is not a good faith request: they know it is

> not practical. Like the totally bonkers suggestion

> that HGVs could turn around in the area covered by

> flowerpots at the end of Calton Ave, the point is

> not to propose solutions that would actually

> reduce congestion or emissions. It's to gum up the

> process and spread confusion.

>

[Earl Aelfheah]

eastdulwichlocal99 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I really don?t know what all the fuss is about -

> the roads are only busy at rush hour like they

> have always been. Go down from 9:30am onwards and

> it?s really quiet. Removing the LTNs won?t change

> the rush hour jam one bit.

>

> Meanwhile it was great to see people socialising

> outside the coffee shop on Melbourne Grove which

> doubles as a wine bar in the evening. Similarly

> the new Dulwich Square with the seated area is a

> great idea.

>

> Encouraging less car use is a step in the right

> direction, all the council need to do now is

> install some proper cycling lanes to make it safer

> for the cyclists which I suspect will come at some

> point. I think those against need to come to terms

> that the LTNs are here to stay which will be

> further backed up by the consultation.

I certainly think people have forgotten what it was like pre lockdown / LTN

[Bicknell]

its about fairness @rahrahrah

reducing traffic for all not pushing it on to croxted, edg, lorship lane, etc.

what a mess at the moment - sensible people like you and me cant even talk solutons. real shame. labour party seems to have forgotten about core voters

[ab29]

Bicknell, some people just don't care about anything but themselves - sad but true.

[heartblock]

The Labour Party in Southwark doesn?t represent me anymore, sadly. Building on poorer estates green space and children?s playgrounds while diverting traffic from a road such as Court Lane, with its enormous gardens that back onto a huge park to Croxted and ED Grove.

I?m surprised that the idealistic values of fairness and equality have been lost in a haze of self-congratulation, entrenched views and arrogance. Followed up by approval of smear tactics towards residential anti-pollution campaigns.

[Rockets]

And Rahx3 - to be fair it was the council's previous interventions that made the DV/Court Lane junction the mess you show in your tweet - I am not trying to say it was perfect before but the alterations they made increased pollution and congestion and also made the junction a lot less safe for all users of it.

[alice]

That?s how I feel. Very depressing.

[legalalien]

As a lifelong swing voter: I can understand that you feel let down, but there is a silver lining. Maybe many people outside the core Labour tribe share your views on lots of issues, even if you disagree with them on others? That?s how I choose to look at things. I?m not keen on heavily whipped party politics. We need a whole new thread on the infilling of estates, methinks....