LTN: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3

[Abe_froeman]

The pollution is so bad on Lordship Lane at the junctions with Grove Vale and East Dulwich Grove (even at this time of night) that the London Air quality website advises adults and children with lung problems (e.g asthma)to avoid strenuous activity outdoors.

https://www.londonair.org.uk/londonair/nowcast.aspx

[dulwichquine]

It took me 45 mins to drive to Townley Road from Tulse Hill gyratory this morning via Herne Hill after a garage repair. Traffic nose to tail along Norwood Road. Such a convoluted journey and traffic now clearly being pushed onto other roads from closures in Dulwich Village. This is not a good solution!

[Spartacus]

Abe_froeman Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The pollution is so bad on Lordship Lane at the

> junctions with Grove Vale and East Dulwich Grove

> (even at this time of night) that the London Air

> quality website advises adults and children with

> lung problems (e.g asthma)to avoid strenuous

> activity outdoors.

>

> https://www.londonair.org.uk/londonair/nowcast.asp

> x

Gawd bless those dining or drinking outside in this pollution caused by badly implemented road closures

One could almost compare it to the use of asbestos in buildings years ago and people's health now.

Could be an interesting case against councils for increasing pollution by trying "badly" to reduce it.

[heartblock]

I would be rather irritated if I lived on Barry rd....

[ab29]

Cases against councils are possible - a coroner has called for national pollution limits to be reduced following the death of Ella Adoo-Kissi-Debrah. In the meantime, Southwark council has increased the air pollution tenfold on LL and many other roads by introducing the LTNs.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-56801794

[geh]

the fug in the air is palpable, what was a weekly clean and hoover is now needed every couple of days. what was a school bus journey of 40 minutes is now 75/90 minutes, what allowed sustainable footfall for business does not allow it now, what was not working well, is really not working at all for a lot more people. this situation has to be modified.

These proposals were rushed in without any baseline testing and under the "cover" of C-19.

Expenditure on unproven policies continues unchecked.

A few roads benefit whilst the rest of the area suffers disproportionally.

Frankly, shame on you Southwark!

[malumbu]

Government was taken to Court six years ago by the pressure group Client Earth, and ordered to meet air quality legal maximum street level nitrogen dioxide. https://www.clientearth.org/latest/latest-updates/news/uk-supreme-court-orders-government-to-take-immediate-action-on-air-pollution/ This predates the coroners report following the sad death of Ella.

Many of you only seem to be concerned about air quality only when it suits your agenda. I changed my behaviour many years ago. I am not perfect but I have made a number of life choices to reduce my impact on the environment. If you followed my lead and did similar, rather than spending so much time finding reasons not to change, and criticising those who are trying to make a difference, however flawed you may see this, the world would be a better place.

So shame on many of you too.

[alice]

The council alone is responsible for making these damaging changes. That they are implemented in the richest, most privileged section of Southwark is against everything many of us voted for.

[geh]

Malumbo, as with I suspect many on this forum, given the title and local nature of it, I find your interjections tiresome, unhelpful and of course, somewhat irrelevant given your location, which is I believe outside SE22 (correct me if I am wrong), although I admire your dedication.

You simply do not, nor can not know what my personal behavioural changes have been to address the wider issue. If you would like, I'd be happy to engage via a separate post. They are, I am fully aware, not comprehensive, but I feel they are as a family, significant.

So I am not posting solely with my own agenda. I am not only "concerned about air quality only when it suits your agenda" so how dare you presume to suggest I am!

As a parent of an informed and intelligent (not from me!) teenager, I am rightly (and constantly) challenged about my choices and behaviour that will impact on subsequent generations, and as such am fully invested in ameliorating the ongoing and developing crisis.

What I am not happy to do is to stand by and see displacement of a universal problem, greenwashed by an administration that that is committed to pursuing policy seemingly regardless of consequence with little or no consultation.

The current measures, admirable as they may be in initial intention, have done nothing but exacerbate the issue for many and have divided the community, perhaps more than any previous.

It is incumbent on all of us, each and every one of us, to make changes which may not always be immediately comfortable to reverse the current situation. It is also I would suggest, incumbent upon all of us to point out where changes that have been made, which may have been well intentioned but that do not serve or satisfy these aims, or perhaps in this case sadly exacerbate an already unacceptable situation.

geh

[heartblock]

Excellent post geh.

[geh]

Malumbo has been kind enough to DM me and we have exchanged views which are more aligned than the above posts may suggest.

Given the collective strength of feeling on both sides of this argument I can't help thinking it would be more beneficial if this were harnessed in seeking to achieve equitable, practical and longterm solutions to a problem that is undeniably a shared issue, rather than the divisive dialogue that is prevalent.

Perhaps our political leaders could consider this how this could be harnessed, rather than seeking to divide opinion as appears to be the current method.

[Siduhe]

Well I?m afraid Carwatch?️ won?t be back today as SGN has closed part of Melford Road - apparently for safety reasons as people kept jumping the lights, putting the workers at risk.

So we have our own little LTN - and it is glorious - until you look at either end of the street and see the carnage on Wood Vale and Underhill. These things don?t/can?t exist in a vacuum and it?s really easy to see that the nice experience we?ve had for the last 12 hours has come at the expense of our neighbours.

[Siduhe]

@geh, that?s my impression too and I posted something similar way back when we all first discussing this. I cycle far more than I drive, I?m pro LTN and encouraging people to move out of cars for short journeys, I don?t even mind the idea of experimental closures. What I?m so frustrated about is the unwillingness of Southwark to monitor and assess impacts outside the direct closure area so we can all assess, in a transparent way, if these solutions actually work for our area.

It would be great if those who are very positive about the current measures would also push for proper monitoring and assessment. But, as someone living in the Court Lane area said on here a while back - it?s hardly in their interests.

[heartblock]

Thank you geh and Siduhe, this is it really.

The denial of the impact on boundary roads of LTNs has angered, upset and confused residents on LL, EDG, Croxted etc. Southwark refuse to admit there is a real health issue directly caused by badly planned LTNs. They have also been seduced by small vocal groups of residents who wanted a gated rd historically, even before Covid. Most people campaigning for there removal are people who walk, cycle, get the bus and from all different political perspectives, many supporting car reduction and green issues.

These LTNs are poorly planned, no inequality assessment, no pollution monitoring etc.

What has it achieved...division, argument, neighbour against neighbour, but not a reduction in pollution.

Remove these ?temporary? measures, put the plans in your manifesto and put the plan to a vote in the 2022 council elections.

[Rockets]

I agree with everything said above.

It's time for the council to come out of their LTN bunker and begin a proper dialogue with ALL residents - not just those in their own echo chamber. The LTNs are having a devastating impact on those who live, work and are schooled outside of the LTN epicentre and it's time for the council and councillors to admit they are not working and try to engage with everyone to work to find solutions that are fair to everyone - the head in the sand approach, positioning those who are raising legitimate concerns as a "small, vocal minority", pandering to lobby groups and analysing things on a ward-by-ward basis has to stop - it's time for the local councillors to break rank with the party line and do what they were elected to do - represent the views of all of their constituents to the council.

I suspect they may have to start doing this as it is clear that their review could not have been more badly timed as the traffic is horrendous as lockdown lifts and people return to some semblance of normality and it is exposing the fundamental flaws in the approach the council and councillors have taken and validating what many locals were saying would happen when these measures were first mooted under the guise of a need for social distancing.

I suspect as they are reviewing the data they are fast realising there is no way they can positively spin this.

[legalalien]

Some pot plants have now arrived. See pic.

[first mate]

No doubt there'll be some anodyne comment from councillors saying how very lovely the plants look- smiley face politics.

[Rockets]

Ah ha - they've put the planters there to stop the kids from using it as a skate and scooter park.....it seems that skaters are not part of their plans for use of the "Square"!

The killjoys....

[first mate]

If it is okay for Melbourne Grove to be used as an occasional skate board venue, why not the "Square"?!

[LTN BooHoo]

Certainly talk amount yourselves, but I find the discussion rather limited and slightly hypocritical.

We have long standing LTNs in the area that didn't raise any issues. What's the problem now? E.g. Gilkes Crescent and Milo Road, closed road due to rat running.Roads in and around Dulwich have always been congested, mostly due to school runs. Well maybe we should think more about the long-term health of our children that are being run to school.

We have One Dulwich promoting the falsehood that ambulance services are being delayed, However, Darren Farmer gave evidence in March 2021 to Southwark's Environment Scrutiny Committee and stated that this was not the case. (Look it up)

On balance I think the LTNs are a good thing but they will only be successful if the community works together as more must be done to encourage people out of their cars. Trump style scaremongering and falsehoods will serve no one.

I for one was encouraged by the image that was sent about a month ago, showing what Dulwich could look like. Why not work towards a positive outcome rather than something half baked?What will London be like in 30 years time if we don't act now? Can someone provide me with an alternative plan to reduce car journeys?

[Rockets]

This does look like a very deliberate move to stop the kids skating there - it's pretty shameful to be honest given they are so desperate to create modal shift....but to only certain types it appears.

[northernmonkey]

Some of the key One Dulwich supporters continually complained that the kerbing in what was previously the central pedestrian refuge presented a 'dangerous trip hazard'. I can see that for those who don't have great vision, it might be something that wasn't obvious when walking. The new planters are easier to see in the eyeline and will draw attention to the fact that there is an 'obstacle' there.

[Orange owl]

Great idea boohoo. Frien road looks like a nice road to drive too fast on let?s reopen that and Oglander another great rat run it?s just not fair to keep these roads shut just for all the rich posh people who live there

[alice]

Desperate new posters = LTNs dying cry

[Orange owl]

Not a new poster just sick of too many people driving their kids to school from Greenwich,or driving to the park to walk their dog because it?s raining