Application for extended late licence at the Great Exhibition

[BigED]

Apparently the owners/managers of The Great Exhibition have applied for a late licence that would see them open until 2.00 a.m. on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays and until midnight on all other nights (with special de-restrictions applying on bank holidays). The application, if approved, would allow live and recorded music and dancing until these times and the applicants want to remove a number of existing restrictions. They also want to have an outside courtyard bar serving alcohol.

If you want to find out more and/or wish to send your views to Southwark Council, you can do so here:

http://app.southwark.gov.uk/licensing/LicPremisesAppliedDetails.asp?systemkey=838498

I quite like the Great Exhibition, despite my initial reservations, but personally, I have some concerns:

- the immediate vicinity of the corner of Underhill Road and Crystal Palace Road is wholly residential and it is not an area where there is any tradition of late-night noise

- the new pub is very noisy - the doors and windows are left open which may be great for ventilation but causes a lot of noise for neighbouring properties - this is in contrast to, for example, The Actress, where the doors are shut from 10 p.m. and there is no access to the outdoors areas - smokers have to use the space outside the front door which is staffed by an accredited security person. There seems to be no equivalent at The Great Exhibition where people are free to sit , drink and smoke outside without restriction or time limit (beyond the existing opening hours).

- the smoking area/courtyard is already a considerable source of noise going late into the night. The space is not enclosed by a roof (otherwise it couldn't be used for smoking) so the noise just escapes out making life less pleasant for their neighbours. Having an additional bar outside will significantly increase the existing problem of noise.

- there are already problems with drunk and rowdy people leaving the Great Exhibit after midnight. Extending weekend opening times until 2.00 a.m. will mean that increased disturbance is caused to residential neighbours for longer into the night;

- today, a group of people took up place in the front seating area and started singing, accompanied by a trumpet - if you were within a hundred yards, you will have heard their rendition of Ring of Fire. It was early evening and, with the trumpet, very loud - perhaps just the wrong time/place?

Unfortunately, unlike with planning applications, there is no statutory requirement on the council to notify neighbours, so if you want to have your say - for or against - then you will need to contact the council yourself via the link above.

Like I said, I quite like the new pub, but I want The Great Exhibition to be good neighbours. The Actress and The Plough have to abide by restrictions on their use of music, their use of outside space and keeping doors and windows closed from 10.00 pm; it would be nice if similar restrictions were placed on the Great Exhibition which is in an even more residential area than those two pubs. And if the Great Exhibition does have those conditions imposed I will be more than happy to go along and continue giving them my business.

PS - closing date for comments: August 02 2012

[Lishyloo]

LOl I'm sure your business would be greatly missed the odd pint really helps. Unfortunately pubs sell alcohol and need to sell vast amounts to stay open, people drink and like to get drunk hence going to the pub. These establishments can't operate on people drinking half pints of ale and tap water which I see residents of ed purchasing many times in the exhibition. Soon we will need a late night licence to walk the streets of east Dulwich

[the-e-dealer]

The doors at the Actress are closed BECAUSE they have extended hours and have to comply to keep them. It maybe you can get the Exhibition to clean its act up by letting it have extended hours. However this is a residential area its a 'local' pub. Maybe one late night a week say till 1 (and no relaxation on bank holidays) might be acceptable but this application is over the top. Frankly I don't see the Licensing Comitee allowing it, but you should campaign to give a clear message. And you can attend this committee.

[Alan Medic]

"- today, a group of people took up place in the front seating area and started singing, accompanied by a trumpet - if you were within a hundred yards, you will have heard their rendition of Ring of Fire. It was early evening and, with the trumpet, very loud - perhaps just the wrong time/place?"

I live nearby and heard this and thought it was kinda nice that people were happy. I was caught with my guard down though and missed a good chance to complain.

[civilservant]

I quite like the oeuvre of J Cash, but if someone insisted on tootling Ring of Fire on a trumpet at 1 in the morning, I would feel rather upset. Even AM might start feeling that people were being happy at his expense...

I'm definitely with BigED on this. He was there first, so he's def entitled to feel unhappy at the prospect of noise till 2 am several days of the week. This is not serving the local community in any way - people need their sleep!

As for Lishyloo, is this the same poster who, just last week, described the Great Exhibition thus:"The pub is pile of crap poor beer poor food and poor service"?

[Siduhe]

As far as I can see from the Great Exhibition's twitter feed, the music was not organised by them, but was impromptu from the Dulwich Uke club at 8.30pm on a summer Saturday night. A link is here so people can form their own views. I thought it sounded fab from the place it was recorded from, but then I wasn't sitting right next to their table.

[DulwichFox]

Pubs do not need Extended hours to stay open..

Pubs used to close at 15.00 and reopen at 17.30.

They closed at 23.00 22.30 outside London.

And they survived..

More Pubs have closed since licening laws were relaxed. and all day drinking was introduced.

Pubs used to be for Locals... run by The Landlord and the Missus.. They looked after their customers.

Provided free food on Sundays and some evenings. Darts Matches / Crib nights. and the like.

Pubs now are run for huge proifit and greed. Many with poor quality overpriced food.

Additional staffing costs and having to pay out for Security will inevitabaly lead to price increases.

Will have to wait and see..

Fox.

[kford]

The music was from the Dulwich Ukelele lot. Consider it a free performance!

[husbandjim]

I live next door to TGE and have done for 8 years. There is no doubting the improvements that have been made and I think it is a great addition to the neighbourhood. The uke band on a Saturday afternoon and early evening is a very welcome sound across the fences! I like the efforts that are being made to make this a proper local where everyone is encouraged to get involved with things like the market, beer tastings and live local music.

Dan and the team have been very considerate about noise and taken on how I am affected, respectfully closing the 'yard' at 1030 or 11. However it is a local pub, not boho bar and I cannot see how later licences are needed for any other reason that to milk an extra few quid out of some wasted people who seriously should have gone home before the current closing time. We are lucky in Dulwich to have late opening pubs on the high street and I don't think we need them in the back streets where children and adults are setting alarms to wake up for school or work at 7am . I am currently on my way to work after very little sleep as a result of someone so drunk at 1am that 6 or so people had to spend the night loudly debating whether to call him an ambulance. I am knackered and probably won't pop in to my local tonight for a pint or two because I will need to try and catch up on the sleep I missed...

Let's keep this pub open but make it a proper local that kicks you out at closing time so that everyone is able to get back in there for opening time. Those who want to get hammered after midnight should go to one of the later opening pubs on the main drag - better still go to a club and dance off that pending hangover.

[stephen509]

Personally don't see a problem if it's just Thursday, Friday & Saturday. Esp Friday & Saturday.

husbandjim Wrote:

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> I live next door to TGE and have done for 8 years.

> There is no doubting the improvements that have

> been made and I think it is a great addition to

> the neighbourhood. The uke band on a Saturday

> afternoon and early evening is a very welcome

> sound across the fences! I like the efforts that

> are being made to make this a proper local where

> everyone is encouraged to get involved with things

> like the market, beer tastings and live local

> music.

>

> Dan and the team have been very considerate about

> noise and taken on how I am affected, respectfully

> closing the 'yard' at 1030 or 11. However it is a

> local pub, not boho bar and I cannot see how later

> licences are needed for any other reason that to

> milk an extra few quid out of some wasted people

> who seriously should have gone home before the

> current closing time. We are lucky in Dulwich to

> have late opening pubs on the high street and I

> don't think we need them in the back streets where

> children and adults are setting alarms to wake up

> for school or work at 7am . I am currently on my

> way to work after very little sleep as a result of

> someone so drunk at 1am that 6 or so people had to

> spend the night loudly debating whether to call

> him an ambulance. I am knackered and probably

> won't pop in to my local tonight for a pint or two

> because I will need to try and catch up on the

> sleep I missed...

>

> Let's keep this pub open but make it a proper

> local that kicks you out at closing time so that

> everyone is able to get back in there for opening

> time. Those who want to get hammered after

> midnight should go to one of the later opening

> pubs on the main drag - better still go to a club

> and dance off that pending hangover.

[Gidget]

Stephen509, so people don't need their sleep on Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights? Where do you live?

[the-e-dealer]

Probably has no Family and no kids.

[Ukjoncollins]

Fantastic news if it goes through.

[njc97]

Dulwich fox - pubs coped with restricted opening hours because property prices were much lower, people could smoke in pubs etc etc. And they also did shit food, banned women from the bar, had leaking toilets and if a non-local turned up, the music stopped, everyone stared and it was made clear they weren't welcome. Wasn't that all great?

[trizza]

Something a little odd has happened to this place anyway. I really like it but my other half went in on the weekend (saturday) not so long ago and there was a full blown disco on - couldn't hear themselves talk so left (although I am not sure if this is a one off). It's one thing having extended opening hours in a neighbourhood boozer but another thing if they are competing with places on Lorship Lane to become Adventure Bar mark 2.

[stephen509]

Underhill Road. Perhaps they could try out Saturdays first?

Obviously if it ends up too loud the license would be revoked?

Gidget Wrote:

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> Stephen509, so people don't need their sleep on

> Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights? Where do

> you live?

[stephen509]

Family. No kids yet :-)

the-e-dealer Wrote:

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> Probably has no Family and no kids.

[DulwichFox]

njc97 Wrote:

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> Dulwich fox - pubs coped with restricted opening

> hours because

property prices were much lower, So were wages

> people could smoke in pubs etc etc. And they also

> did

shit food, Nothing different there then. (not All Outlets

banned women from the bar, Where..

had leaking toilets Could mention a few places with not so nice toilets.

and if a non-local turned up, the music stopped, everyone stared and it was made clear they weren't welcome

Where was that then. ?? Dodge City. Wild West

Wasn't that all great?

Foxed ??

[showboat]

Once again Fox you're being obtuse and you know it.

Pubs like those being described certainly did exist, and you know full well that one up side to the legislation of recent years surrounding H+S and so on has been to makes to make pubs safer. The era you describe was one of the landlord answering to no one, which can make for problems.

HOWEVER...I agree that the corporatisation of the pub industry has overall been very bad. Hey, when you're right you're right. The big chains took away the soul of many places, and the tenanted side of things? Don't get me started on how evil the pubcos can be *coughEnterpriseInnsareabunchofevilwankerscough*.

That's why I left that industry.

But I'm not sure changing the old opening times in itself a bad thing. The continent has later hours and nowhere near the late night drinking issues we do (I generalise, but the point is mostly accurate). Perhaps that speaks to more of a cultural issue. FWIW I don't think TGE should have those hours. LL causes enough issues.

[silverfox]

Not a chance

[El Pibe]

I lived for three years on said corner in very close proximity and never once had any issue with noise.

It's nice to see a bit of life being brought bag to the old dog as it goes.

[DulwichFox]

showboat Wrote:

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> Once again Fox you're being obtuse and you know

> it.

I doubt that you know the true meaning of the word obtuse

Obtuse Defin. Characterized by a lack of intelligence or sensitivity.

Would therefore seem that you are the one who is being obtuse unless of course it was genuinly meant as an insult.

Fox.

[the-e-dealer]

Can be confused:  abstruse, obtuse .

[DulwichFox]

the-e-dealer Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Can be confused:  abstruse, obtuse .

Abstruse Defin. Difficult to understand.

I think my post was very simple to understand. and read.

Fox.

[showboat]

You're not even worth it Fox...