Secondary School Allocations 2019

[Scrummymummy]

We live in Dulwich Hill area and got Sydenham school first round (we are 1.5KM from the school). We knew that we were out of catchment for both Charters and Kingsdale chances are low unless you get a scholarship. Sydenham is 10 minutes on the bus and a good school.

Whilst ideally Charter North is our first choice, we knew that realistically the chances were very low. We are 120 on the waiting list and it's our nearest school!

I believe also from friends that Forest Hill boys also stretches out this far. Oscar have you checked Sydenham/Forest Hill boys? You can be added to the list if you didn't put them down originally.

[goldilocks]

Removing the automatic sibling priority would seem sensible at secondary though to get away from the problem where people get one child into a secondary and then have another 10 years of school places from the next 2 even if they move significantly out of the area. Whilst I recognise that its nice to have your kids at the same school and is what we'd all want, unless there are specific needs that make independent travel etc unfeasible, the sibling priority isn't as critical as at primary.

In addition, in an area where there are a high number of single sex schools the sibling criteria is even more ridiculous. I have a boy and a girl so why is their need for a sibling place lesser than in a family with two girls or two boys?

Also, whilst I understand the frustration whereby others seemingly have 'a choice' of schools, its worth noting that the greatest distance for some like charter is tiny in a lot of years (partially because of the point I note above re siblings!) so those who seemingly would have a 'choice' may not. Also the distance varies significantly year on year.

[Honor Oakey]

Totally agree with Goldilocks. Re Harris girls. Whilst I can see the pros and cons of lottery, I think it?s fair to say that Harris has always divided opinion locally despite being hugely successful and outstanding. So I can understand why they have looked to more imaginitive ways of filling places.

[motorbird83]

A lottery doesn?t help a school fill places if it?s undersubscribed... I understand it?s much more popular now anyhow

The distance / sibling point seems a bit of a red herring. There are enough schools within a reasonable commute. The issue is that schools that parents desire the most can?t let everyone in.

The solution is to make all the schools as desirable as the most popular ones or make access to the most popular schools a lottery (if distance is seen as unfair criteria) within a reasonable geographic catchment like 2 miles.

A petition for anything else I think is a non starter politically.

[tomskip]

"The solution is to make all the schools as desirable as the most popular ones ..." easier said than done, I think!

The removal of the sibling priority would make the whole process fairer (and yes, in an area with many single sex schools it's an oddity in itself) and would discourage the adroit moving into and out of rental properties that we all know goes on. Also, Kingsdale should not operate a lottery system in a vacuum. Either all schools in a borough do it or none do.

But I and many other parents were saying all this back in 2011 - so good luck with your petition Oscar 38!

[Monkey]

When it comes to Kingsdale, it's not just a "border" issue. I know families from Beckenham who have two/three kids at the school. And a lot of the kids who showed me around on my visit were from quite far away. I wouldn't mind if I had access to Langley Park School in Beckenham for example but the school applies a distance criteria so it's closed to me.

Kingsdale is a drain on school places for people in Southwark as per the report in the Southwark School Places Strategy meeting http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s71640/Report%202017%20Primary%20and%20Secondary%20School%20Place%20Planning%20Strategy%20Update.pdf

[argrahame]

On a different note...for Lewisham schools, we are meant to find out where we are on waiting lists today. I've logged into e-admissions and can't find the info. Does anyone know how we access it? Many thanks

[Honor Oakey]

Monkey there?s kids from all over in all the secondary schools as this thread testifies. If kingsdale didn?t have a lottery, I bet you?d have even less chance of getting in - you?d literally have to be on the doorstep with a house worth several million. The whole system - whether distance, lottery etc is unfair. None of us have a divine right to our first choice school, but it looks to me like most people got schools that are not unreasonable to travel to. I think the best bet would be to scrap the sibling policy and I bet half of kingsdale intake this year is siblings after many years of bulge classes. With that, and teacher?s kids being prioritised and (to be fair a very small number of scholarship places) it?s a wonder anyone gets in.

[tomskip]

Yes, siblings automatically getting a place on the first sibling's lucky outcome in the lottery. Odd.

[Oscar38]

Thanks Scrummymummy, for the recommendation, I would really like us to work towards getting a proactive solution that works better for the community and need people to join forces, so t0 speak. How can we have two or three local secondary schools in the area and not get into one.

[Scruffy Mummy]

There are three very good secondary schools in the area which aren't over-subscribed I believe - that's Harris Girls East Dulwich, Harris Boys Peckham Rye and St Thomas the Apostle College (which is an outstanding school - boys only) . All have really good Ofsted reports and both seem to be growing in popularlity. Obv not everyone's first choice is a single sex school but they are good schools. I really thought St Thomas was exceptional and at least 50% of their school population isn't Catholic. If you really don't want single sex or religous schools, Deptford Green is a mixed school is just outside the area but if you are the Peckham Rye side of ED it's not to difficult to get to - again gaining in popularity. I do think everyone can get into a reasonably good secondary school - but not everyone can get into the most desirable secondary schools but ironically, the most desireable aren't neccessarily the 'best' in terms of education or even for your child.

[kristymac1]

Scruffy Mummy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There are three very good secondary schools in the

> area which aren't over-subscribed I believe -

> that's Harris Girls East Dulwich, Harris Boys

> Peckham Rye and St Thomas the Apostle College

> (which is an outstanding school - boys only)

Harris Girls and Harris Boys are also 'outstanding' schools. I believe Harris Girls is oversubscribed this year.

[muccimagic]

James Barber Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I suspect that lack of simplicity is just another

> way of selection - selection of parents who are

> likely to ensure their children do their homework,

> turn up on time, etc.

James Barber, sadly I believe this very true. If you had the misfortune to navigate the special needs education system, you would see further confirmation of this hidden selection process.Something which does not sit comfortably with me either, as a mother and as a professional.

[Gubodge]

If Kingsdale were to apply a distance criteria then it certainly wouldn?t benefit ED kids. Gypsy Hill, Crystal Palace and West Norwood are all closer, and that?s where the majority of the pupils come from now. The fact that those areas aren?t Southwark is academic. To my knowledge no London secondary schools prioritise in-borough applications and that is as it should be.

[Elfy]

We live pretty close to Kingsdale (walking distance) and we are not in Southwark. This year out of an intake of 90 at my son's primary school, less than 10 got into Kingsdale of which some are siblings. So I'm not sure they are taking kids who live closer... I suspect the intake has gone down massively as there was a bulge class in previous years, and now there are loads of siblings.

[hpsaucey]

muccimagic Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> James Barber Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I suspect that lack of simplicity is just

> another

> > way of selection - selection of parents who are

> > likely to ensure their children do their

> homework,

> > turn up on time, etc.

>

> James Barber, sadly I believe this very true. If

> you had the misfortune to navigate the special

> needs education system, you would see further

> confirmation of this hidden selection

> process.Something which does not sit comfortably

> with me either, as a mother and as a professional.

Absolutely agree!

HP

[Gubodge]

I think you?re right, Elfy. Years 8 and 9 are both bulges (I?m not sure whether 7 was as well) so there will have been a very large number of siblings coming through this year. It?d be interesting to see what the stats are.

[Katiesa]

If I'm not too late to this post can I ask if anyone knows wgat the catchment distance was this year for the new charter?

Thank you

[Katiesa]

P.s Also is there an app or a way of working out the distance on a map. We are the small Sainsburys end of Lordship Lane

[Monkey]

I think the furthest place allocated on distance for Charter ED last year was 1.3km. To see how far you are, use Google Maps.

On another note, i?d be interested to hear of people getting places at Sydenham School from the waiting list and how far they are from the school, just for anecdotal information.

[Scrummymummy]

Hi Katiesa,

This is a good site to use to plot -https://www.daftlogic.com/

I just calculated it's just under 1.2km from Sainsbury's Local to Jarvis Road.

However your place on the waiting list should also give you an indication.

We are passed Sainsbury's further south and 153 on the waiting list, so basically no chance.

It could be the catchment has shrunk this year.

[Oscar38]

on a quick note, I asked the Dulwich Hill Councilor on Saturday at the CPZ meeting, what the Council is looking to do, to address this issue of a 'black hole' for secondary schools in the Dulwich Hill ward. "nothing" was the response!

I did ask, why the Council could not negotiate with the local schools, Charter North, East and Harris ED. to remove the distance criteria and give local secondary school intake children, a chance at attending a local school. Or get the local schools to prioritize our children on the list of siblings and special needs, as we are clearly disadvantaged by not having a fair chance at a local school and having to commute 3km - 8km to Secondary school that has available space. But he claims that the Council while it assist schools with a bit of funding, they have no control over how the local schools are run and blame the Government. I guess its all about that 'List' then!

[Monkey]

Been trying to engage councillors on the issue by email and no answer. Dunno why I voted for them now...

[BellendenBear]

Charter ED furthest distance offer was 954m this year.

[sarvester]

Thank for that info, do you think that distance was on offer day or after that Bellendenbear?