My first visit to LL (in decades)

[cdonline]

With so much cat-napping and gangs of concerned residents hitting the streets to protect our moggies, is East Dulwich on a downward spiral of lawlessness and anarchy?

[Big Jim]

Camberwell isn't a dump - the chances of getting mugged, shot or stabbed in a dump are pretty slim. In Camberwell however...

Mind you, watching the drunks wrestle on the green is quite amusing.

If we could get rid of the Iceland building and the block that Budgens is in, then LL would look a lot better. Oh, and the Police Station could do with a face lift (preferably one that makes it fall over).

[mockney piers]

I think I too have mentioned the architectural paucity of east dulwich v the riches of camberwell. I'm a member of the camberwell flickr group and enjoy the odd walk, whereas the "We are what we are and we ain't what we ain't" group meet in East Dulwich rapidly ended up in a pub.

That said, we never felt like someone might steal the cameras in East Dulwich, I get a bit nervy in some bits of camberwell on me tod and camera laden.

In fact the ED pootle resulted in thre windows, some flowers, a police light, a council vehicle and a woman having a poo

Not much architectural splendour other than ant's lovely effort of boarded building

 

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Maurice, I'll sawp my council house in East Dulwich for yours in Camberwell if you like.

I love the houses in Camberwell and was used to living in a dump, so I'd be like a pig in sh!t, especially as my daughter lives down the road! (obviously before I moved to the prestigious ED!!)

[Louisa]

Maurice has a few decent points I think. Why on earth has ED not got a Christmas tree with lights on somewhere like Goose Green roundabout? Dulwich is famously the Dickens location for the Pickwick Papers and rather than live upto the historical tie with this classic book and the festive ties with Dickens, Southwark Council would be happier wasting money on a crappy sculpture. How can we be proud of the area when it doesnt even make the effort half the time? Maybe ED should setup another borough all for itself.

Louisa.

[EDOldie]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We should bring back the old Camberwell Council that administered Dulwich. We could be part of Surrey again. (top hole, what?) Lights in the trees at Goose Green would be good. Do we like the Southwark lampost lights? Or is this more light pollution and a drain on the planet? Should all Christmas lights be banned until we've saved the planet?

Surely Dulwich Village was the area Mr Pickwick retired to. I was told that Dickens used to drink at the Greyhound, between Burbage Road & Aysgarth Road, demolished at the turn of the (last) century, and merged with the Crown, which is how he knew Dulwich. The same place is the site of Pickwick Road. I think I'll start a thread in the lounge on Forumites who could be Dickens characters, you know The Administrator - Scrooge, that sort of thing.

[Keef]

Didn't he live somewhere near the Fox on the hill, or am I getting mixed up? Agree that LL could be made to look a lot more festive.

[EDOldie]

John Ruskin lived on Denmark Hill. Hence Ruskin Park.

[Asset]

John Ruskin Street off Wally Road.

[EDOldie]

I think Ruskin & Dickens were contemporaries, but I'm a bit hazy about all this. Did they drink together at the original Dog? does anyone know? Perhaps we could have a Dickens day in Dulwich. Or is that open to misinterpretation?

[Keef]

Here is a bit of info. Wonder if the "Dulwich Church" in Pickwick Papers was St Barnabas.

He used to drink in The Greyhound, which if memory serves, was a seperate pub to The Crown, and they later combined the 2 names. According to that site, The Greyhound he used to use was opposite the present day Dog.

[PeckhamRose]

Dickens drank every bloody where!

Pubs from S E London all the way down to Broadstairs and beyond reckon "Dickens drank here".

Also, Crown and Greyhound were two separate pubs but the landlord of one bought the other and shut one down and combined the two names to one pub. At least, that's what the expert on Robert Elms show said.

[Jah Lush]

I grew up in Pickwick Road and indeed Dickens did drink everywhere and another place was the Grove House Tavern on Camberwell Grove which is mentioned in Tales of Two Cities but under a different name.

[mockney piers]

London has a long history of Lushes, right up to our very own Jah.

My ancestor was something of an old soak in his day too. He and Pepys frequented many inns and watched London burn from the Anchor on bankside.

There's even a pub named after him today, up the road in Deptford, though his town planning left a lot to be desired.

[MrBen]

I agree with Maurice in respect of architecture (if we remove an areas content from the argument). But the photo of ED above is not too bad - the facades above the shops painted pastels is a nice touch - I've always liked that.

I also like the 4 storey buildings you can see opposite the EDT when sitting upstairs. If you look at them closely they are rather nice terraces with some elaborate touches. But they sorely need repairing and repainted.

A couple of simple changes that would make the best of LL:

- Have a limit as to how long a Hunter Hindwoods Payne (or similar) commercial To Let/Sold board can be kept up for. Because some of the HHP signs on the empty shops have been there for well over a year even though they have let/sold. Other areas have these rules in place. It makes everything less ugly. And why should they get free advertising for that long anyway?

- Plant some small trees along the lower stretch of LL.

- Get council to incentivise or enforce freeholders in some way to repaint and repair frontages. LL freeholders of commercial premises have reaped a massive return lately. I know of one who has acheived a capital gain of 700% since 1998 and rental increase of even more since this time. That's HUGE. So why cant they be made to keep up repairs on the buildings?

- Just have some basic planning laws that require shop frontages to pass planning approval so that they blend in with the surrounding environment. They have this in other areas why not here? Suggest ugly plastic facades and huge flashing Foxstons style neon lights be limited to Blackpool.

Finally, and not so easy, is to demolish the police station. They cant catch burglars anyway from what I can see. The building looks like an East German KGB headquarters. And it sucks.

*Bob* above, suggests Maurice should prefer people to buildings. Tongue in cheek I know but the bottom line is that the two are inextricably linked. Our surroundings affect the way we feel and have an emotional impact subconciously or otherwise.

[Keef]

Actually, the KGB buildings were all rather grand on the outside. ;-)

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

Maybe that part should be called Lubyanka Lane.

[Frisco]

Maurice, were you really expecting the architecture of LL to have changed in the decades since your last visitation?

ED isn't really known for its architectural wonders, but rather as an example of an unspoilt Victorian suburb, and it is this which seems to attract people to it. If I wanted grand Georgian, I'd go to the gentrified islands in Camberwell, but (having lived one of those before coming to ED) I'd be conscious of the many down-sides of that.

[Frisco]

"Lights in the trees at Goose Green would be good."

I was only thinking that myself, and it would make an amazing difference. I wonder if anyone will look to improve the very 'municipal' looking Christmas lights on LL before next year. An impressive but tasteful display could be good for trade.

[Maurice]

Absolutely Frisco but my memory fades and all the buzz about ED upped my expectations of what I might find. I also agree completely with the downsides of our islands. Sigh.