CPZ: Proposed Controlled Parking in East Dulwich

[gkb]

Can anyone help? I am trying to comment on the CPZ, but the road I live on is not within any CPZ zone - I live just outside a zone. So the CPZ consultation will not allow me login and comment..... Is there any way I can comment

[MarkT]

gkb,

I suggest email the lead officer:

[email protected]

I assume, as you live outside the zone, you did not receive a paper copy of the questionnaire. Too late now to post it anyway.

[gkb]

Thank you for your advice and the link - i tried it, but the email was returned as not recognised. Do you have any other suggestions?

[MarkT]

That's the email she gave on the handout at the business consultation meeting. The main consultation pack gives:

phone 020 7525 0127

email [email protected]

[Abe_froeman]

GKB at the bottom of the drop down list for "Street (Required)" there is an option "other" . Just select that, put in your post code and you can move on to the next page.

[Zebedee Tring]

I'm still not clear whether or not Townley Road is to be included in the CPZ. Can anyone clarify this please?

[nunhead_man]

https://www.cycling-embassy.org.uk/blog/2015/11/29/its-time-to-talk-about-shopping

https://www.lowimpact.org/cycle-lanes-bring-more-revenue-to-local-businesses-than-car-parking-spaces-so-why-do-so-many-businesses-think-they-dont/

[Siduhe]

Zebedee Tring Wrote:

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> I'm still not clear whether or not Townley Road is

> to be included in the CPZ. Can anyone clarify this

> please?

According to the detailed maps attached to the consultation, it's not included. See 3 of 5 in the consultation pack:

https://consultations.southwark.gov.uk/environment-leisure/eastdulwichparking/supporting_documents/Map%203%20of%205.pdf

[Jennys]

There were two general less detailed maps. The earlier (purple map) includes Townley Road but the later (pink) one doesn?t. Townley Road is not part of the proposed CPZ on the detailed map either.

[bels123]

I suspect Townley Road would form part of a Dulwich Village consultation zone, early discussions are underway. It was mentioned at the Dulwich Society open meeting in January that many residents and local businesses were having problems with commuter parking.

[Zebedee Tring]

What does a "Dulwich Village consultation zone" mean? Consultation on a possible CPZ?

[Earl Aelfheah]

The only thing which is clear, is that the whole of the surrounding area is destined to become a CPZ.

[Zig-Zag]

...and whichever way any of these "consultations" go, Southwark Council will do exactly what it wants, as per usual. I'm sick to death of contributing via Council Tax to these pointless/meaningless consultations. If we had tubes, "Boris" bikes, and a better network of buses (including east-west) etc we might feel less hard done by.

I bet the Council is full of younger people who have no idea how hard walking everywhere is when older, and standing at bus stops because there are no seats.

Can't wait to escape SE London and London overall

[Rockets]

rahrahrah Wrote:

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> The only thing which is clear, is that the whole

> of the surrounding area is destined to become a

> CPZ.

I agree. If you look at the plans to charge in the Dulwich and Belair car parks it is obvious people will park in the surrounding streets which currently have no CPZs which will act as further justification from the council to extend CPZs to the whole area. Especially considering Belair Park car park is used by parents taking their children to and from Oakfield and Dulwich Prep.

It?s pretty transparent what the council?s plans are and no matter what any of the residents say they will vigorously pursue their plans to completion and engage in a folly consultation process.

When are the next council elections...given the strength of feeling against the council right now perhaps we can mobilise and vote for a change ward by ward?

Also, I think you?ll find most of the councillors don?t actually live in the area they are wreaking havoc upon and are part of Corbyn?s Marxist Momentum crew so probably care little for the ?posh folk? in East Dulwich.

[bels123]

https://turneyandburbage.org.uk/tag/herne-hill-velodrome/

[sanda]

I'm in favour of the CPZ, which seems to be a rare thing, especially given that I am a keen motorist (family car parked at home, and my money-pit time-sink classic car but worth very little is in long term storage).

We only moved to South London a few years ago and before that had always lived in various parts of North London with CPZs that worked very well. Shops thrived on our local roads and people walked and cycled a lot more, leaving the driving for when you need to head out of town. New shops were constantly opening and the area became nicer and more attractive. What has surprised me about East Dulwich is how much people love their cars and will drive them for even the shortest trip, behaviour that is more like what I see in the suburbs in the UK than central London (although not as bad as America).

I've seen on this forum and heard in person all sorts of doomsday arguments that I find hard to believe given the years I spent living in CPZs. Such as mum's can't go to coffee shops on LL without their car, or take their children on Lordship Lane without a car to carry all the children's stuff, or buy groceries without their car. I even had a Lib Dem candidate (failed) on my doorstep claiming that tile shops will have to close if there isn't enough parking for people to load up all the tiles they've bought. And more.

A few things that strike me about this CPZ that are really good:

- 30 mins free parking for shops must be a good thing, it keeps the cars moving so shops will have a new car parked outside their shop every 30 mins. Why isn't that good for custom? I rarely go to Lorship Lane by car as I find it impossible to ever park due to the number of cars that park for long periods. The only times I ever drive there is if I'm dropping stuff off at a charity shop and even then have to park on double yellows. Providing short term parking is ideal for people from near and far who want to pop into the shops. If you need longer, you pay just a few pounds. Given the high cost of land in London, the cost of parking seems remarkably cheap!

- increased pedestrian space and cycle parking is a good thing for everyone. The reality is that we all need to change our transport usage. Dulwich is a lovely green area but there are too many cars! I know I might sound like a hypocrite as a keen motorist, but central London isn't designed for lots of cars. Lordship Lane has frequent busses going up and down the road and it is very well served by public transport. Blocking up the road with cars parked all day just leaves less space for shoppers coming by car, and less space for pedestrians, mum's with buggies, children on bikes and scooters and so on. My son loves to cycle and he is only 5, but hates Lordship Lane saying "it is really smelly with the cars, and there isn't any space". I agree. I don't like pushing our baby down their either. The shops on Lordship Lane would get more custom if it wasn't so clogged up with vehicles. It really could be made so much nicer and the changes to the pavements should be welcomed.

- the cost of a parking permit is insignificant compared to the overall cost of running a vehicle. I think many people do not realise just how expensive a car is to run and there are so many other forms of transport that are cheaper and more efficient. The arguments then often go to the fact old people or the disabled must use a car, but that isn't true. My parents and in-laws visit us from out of town, are very old and one of them requires a wheelchair. And yet when here we walk around and use the pavements (except when their are so many blocked cars obstructing wheelchairs!). Disabled users can also apply for blue badges, so if they need to park, they can. I've also noticed some criticism of the local councillors for being Corbynites. From what I have seen, they are certainly not Corbynites and one even told me on my doorstep how much they hated Corbyn! I was unfortunate enough to live for 3 years in Jeremy Corbyn's constituency in Islington (he is dreadful on every level), and in that borough the resident's permit charges track vehicle emissions similar to VED, so the yummy mummy driving to the local cafe in a Landrover Discovery in Islington would be paying ?475 a year for a parking permit. Ouch!

- My main concern about the East Dulwich scheme is that it doesn't include the road we live on and I do expect spill over from the CPZ. The zone should be extended further but the fringes of the zone should have much shorter restricted hours (e.g. 10-12). A few hours a day will stop people from leaving cars in these residential areas, but will mean only a minor inconvenience to visitors: disabled badge holders would pay nothing, tradesmen and other visitors would need a scratchcard for just the 2 hour window. This was exactly what we had in the area we lived in NW London, and the cost was ?1.80 a day for a tradesman during the working day. Again, compared to the cost of cars, and tradesmen, a small price to pay and it mean tradesmen could actually park closer - often saving us money in reduced charges from their hourly charges. We still visit friends in that area, by car, and it really isn't a problem. East Dulwich will survive!

I think the proposals to charge for parking in the local parks are also a good idea, but again will result in spillover and so the CPZ (very limited hours) should be extended to cover all of the areas around these parks too. I do find it amazing how I see people drive 1/2 a mile to go and park in Dulwich Park to then walk their dog in the park...

[Pugwash]

I tried to get some parking 'scratch cards' a couple of years ago - although I am disabled I do not qualify for a blue badge. Since at times I have to drive around the borough I tried to get some scratch cards (these were easy to purchase some years ago and could be used in any part of Southwark)as some places I needed to visit were in CPZs/Resident permit parking etc. I was advised by Southwark, that the scratch card scheme was no longer available and to get visitor permits, these were only available for your own street/road. It would be handy if the borough wide scratch cards were still available. In some areas, even if you have a Blue Badge you do not get free parking - I cannot remember if it is Westminster or Camden you have to pay for parking. When my mother was alive, she had a blue badge as was a wheelchair user, but we came across several car parks where blue badge holders still had to pay charges.

[TheCat]

Jennys Wrote:

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> mikeb Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Interesting that Townley Road is not in the

> zone.

> > It is probably the local road most parked upon

> by

> > non-residents, particularly schoolkids in their

> > Fiat 500s.

>

>

> I thought from looking at the map that Townley

> Road is included. Can anyone confirm one way or

> the other. We live in Beauval Road and I am

> assuming we will get the cars from the Health

> Centre, dentist, and the staff and students from

> Alleyn?s school.

We're in Beauval as well. I think we are in for an absolute nightmare. Given the zone will almost surround us on 3 sides (i.e. goes all the up lordship lane parallel to Beauval, finishing at the junction with Barry Road). As you say, with Alleyns and the Townley Clinic, we already have enough non-residents parking on the road as it is. I expect they've just stopped at the ward boundary which runs along LL...But I feel a more 'natural' boundary as far as parking is concerned would be to take the whole scheme to the village intersection - i.e. so taking in Beauval, Dovercourt, Woodwarde, Dekker, Druce etc. Alternatively, perhaps Woodwarde road would make a better boundary, seeing Beauval, the lower part of Dovercourt, Townley and Calton all come into the zone.

But I can pontificate until the cows come home, Southwark will do what Southwark want to do...

[Rockets]

Southwark have already decided what they want to do - they decided it before the consultation process began and that was to have a CPZ across the whole of East Dulwich and surrounding areas to further tax car ownership.

Everyone knows that no matter what anyone in East Dulwich says we are going to get a CPZ. Over 8,000 signatures have been collected by traders on Lordship Lane opposing the move but these will be discounted. The council's own research showed that East Dulwich was thriving and a lot of that came from people driving from postcodes beyond SE22 and SE5 but they are choosing to ignore this.

Sanda - be careful what you wish for. Your negative experience of Corbyn in Islington will likely become the norm in East Dulwich - remember, the affluent are the enemy and Southwark have been circling East Dulwich for years and now have self-professed Marxist councillors "representing" our community.

I think a lot of people have been taking a stand as they see this as the tip of the iceberg and have looked closely at the CPZ proposal and seen the only outcome is that people will pay ?125 a year for a scheme that will only provide a temporary rest-bite and that with the plans for double-yellows across drop kerbs there will actually be a net-loss of parking spaces on many streets.

Throw in the council fast-tracking charging to park at the local parks and it is clear what the motive is here. And the council will default to the "cuts in central govt funding" narrative but that is what council tax increases are designed to help alleviate.

Given the council is going to force a CPZ on the community I think the best solution would be a 9.00am to 10.00am controlled parking zone which alleviates the commuter and long-term parking issue but allows East Dulwich to continue to thrive. This would be a commonsense approach but we know that Southwark Council and commonsense are like oil and water....

[Abe_froeman]

"Throw in the council fast-tracking charging to park at the local parks and it is clear what the motive is here. "

I think this is spot on.

If they did implement the CPZ and there was still free parking in the parks it would be chaos. The two sets of restrictions go hand in hand and if one is a done deal so must be the other.

[ed_pete]

Nice one Sherry.