A dark day - The CPT (Lounged)

[Jah Lush]

karter Wrote:

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> @Jah lush, have not seen you in there either (at

> least not for a couple of years). I've only been

> in on a Sunday.

Sunday some day in June 2005 was it? I'm in there most Sundays so very strange I've not seen you.

[Jah Lush]

The Mag stopped doing football two or three years ago.

[karter]

LOl, with my kids and mates sitting outside. DOH

[BrandNewGuy]

herrd Wrote:

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> Who cares if the CAMRA beards are ruffled?

Eh? So a decent boozer shouldn't have at least one decently kept real ale? CAMRA aren't generally fussy about pubs - you might be surprised to find lots of Wetherspoons in the Good Beer Guide. But, as they say, it's the beer not the pub their judging.

[binary_star]

BrandNewGuy Wrote:

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it's the beer not the pub their judging.

I went in the CPT once for a bitter. The barmaid offered me a taste of the guest ales etc etc, it was typical CAMRA pub style service. Problem was, of the other two people I was drinking with, one drank lager and the other was on spirits. They didn't want to sit in the dingy bar with surly locals and furniture that smelt a bit damp just so I could enjoy a "good" beer (it really wasn't).

Personally I welcome the change and I'm hoping someone does something with The Castle as well!

[binary_star]

Otta Wrote:

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> Yeah, then a few years pass, and everyone wants a

> traditional pub again, but it's too late, because

> it was gutted. Look at The Uplands.

?

Sorry think I've misunderstood this... No-one wants to see the return of The Uplands surely? What a dive.

[Jah Lush]

The Uplands could never have continued as it was and the CPT probably can't either. Change is needed to survive otherwise it goes the way of The Oglander and The Heber Arms. I'd rather a company buys it, does something positive with it and succeeds than some other company buying it, closing it down completely and turning it into a block of flats.

[Otta]

The Uplands was a dive, I just meant that the total gutting of the building in around 2002 was terrible and couldn't be reversed.

The Actress is a vast improvement, but the damage was done, and it's still a loud horrible space.

[Otta]

I love old woodwork and glassware in pubs, that's the sort of stuff I want to keep, whatever they do around it.

[BrandNewGuy]

binary_star Wrote:

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> BrandNewGuy Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> it's the beer not the pub their judging.

>

> I went in the CPT once for a bitter. The barmaid

> offered me a taste of the guest ales etc etc, it

> was typical CAMRA pub style service. Problem was,

> of the other two people I was drinking with, one

> drank lager and the other was on spirits. They

> didn't want to sit in the dingy bar with surly

> locals and furniture that smelt a bit damp just so

> I could enjoy a "good" beer (it really wasn't).

>

> Personally I welcome the change and I'm hoping

> someone does something with The Castle as well!

Fine, but herrd seemed to be suggesting that if they do up the CPT the "CAMRA beards" would be ruffled. All I was suggesting that belonging to CAMRA does not mean you prefer sub-standard pubs. I've made my feelings clear on here about the CPT, so any improvement is welcome. Personally, I don't think there's a really decent pub in ED, but given our "demographic" I'm not sure it's possible any more.

[Jah Lush]

Could agree with you more Otta. Traditional innit. Proper publike.

[Jah Lush]

There are no CAMRA beards in the CPT to the best of my knowledge. Though I like a drop of ale myself you'll find most of the regulars drink lager or Guinness. They do however do a nice pint of Doom Bar and when it's on Spitfire or London Pride. You'll find plenty of those real ale buffs in Hoopers though. And in mentioning Hoopers there's one pub that has changed for the better and still kept it "real".

[herrd]

I wasn't talking about the ales, I usually drink bitter, or even the punters, and for my sins I used to run an ale society in Manchester, so I've mixed with plenty of CAMRA bod.

What I meant was the die-hard beards usually huff and moan if you so much as take a coat of paint off an original ceiling rose, never mind move a bar/door. These primeval cats don't even like CO2 in their beer, although they often drink it with the aid of electric lighting.

Whichever way you look at it, the CPT ain't working. It needs fixing, and if that means::o moving a door/bar, so what? The world will continue to spin, and, you never know, it might, just might, make the place better. The way some folk carry on about change, it's a wonder they use the internet at all. After all, look what it did to the carrier pigeon industry...

[BrandNewGuy]

Jah Lush Wrote:

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> There are no CAMRA beards in the CPT to the best

> of my knowledge. Though I like a drop of ale

> myself you'll find most of the regulars drink

> lager or Guinness. They do however do a nice pint

> of Doom Bar and when it's on Spitfire or London

> Pride. You'll find plenty of those real ale buffs

> in Hoopers though. And in mentioning Hoopers

> there's one pub that has changed for the better

> and still kept it "real".

Agreed about Hoopers - it's the closest thing locally to my "perfect" pub, though Mrs BrandNewGuy pointed out to me that they have a troublesome licence review for "public nuisance" to contend with.

[JoeChuff]

There's a difference between a lament and a complaint. As an ex-regular (before moving away) I'm sad that the CPT is changing as I liked it the way it was, but I accept that popular tastes have changed. I'll be making sure to enjoy it as much as I can before it changes.

[El Pibe]

116 objections BNG (including 2 from casa Pibe), that's got to stand them in good stead.

And yes, Hoopers is a great example whereby a pub can be revitalised without going down the canoes on the ceiling (20 years ago), pine/chrome (15 years ago), flock wallpaper (10 years ago) or Capital Pubs formula (they're EVERYWHERE!!!!) routes.

I don't think it's especially luddite to lament the loss of those beautiful victorian features (or yearn for their retainment) to yet another bunch of low slung sofas, nursery school plastic chairs and another 6th-form-common-room-ironic makeover is it?

But agreed that keeping the pub alive would be massively preferable over more flats.

[David A]

I've drunk in a few of their places in Brighton and they're fine. A couple were cracking, very sympathetically done.

All quite different really, I only found out they were part of a chain by having a chat with the staff.

El Pibe is probably right on the sofas though.

If anyone's got an old Chesterfield they want to get rid of it might be worth getting in touch with them.

[Sue]

El Pibe Wrote:

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> 116 objections BNG (including 2 from casa Pibe),

> that's got to stand them in good stead.

>

xxxxxxxx

There are only 2 or 3 people supporting the main complainant, against not only a petition with over 120 signatures in support of Hoopers existing licence, but over ninety letters, including mine.

In addition, Southwark Noise Control had no comment to make, and the Met said that they had had no complaints about the pub.

For somebody to choose to move next to a pub when they could have bought a house in many many other places nowhere near a pub, and then complain about occasional noise is beyond belief really. Jamie Hooper took over an absolute dive (The Ivanhoe) and worked really hard to change it into a friendly pub where people not only felt comfortable to go but wanted to go.

If these licence changes go through he will probably have to close altogether. The pub is not on the beaten track and needs music and other events to bring people from outside the immediate community in, unless they are going for the range of ale (it won a CAMRA award).

Jamie has already bent over backwards to try to appease this woman who is complaining, including installing shutters and secondary doors. He has taken a key role in being involved in the local street party etc..

It would be a tragedy if Hoopers were to close.

I sincerely hope that the licensing committee sees sense.

And I don't agree re the Uplands, I think the Actress is a vast improvement. I live round the corner, and I didn't like the vibe in the Uplands at all, whereas I like the Actress.

[Chippy Minton]

Best thing about the Actress is the large HD screen that can be pulled down when required.

The rest of it is pretty good as well.

[Jah Lush]

I've warmed to The Actress recently. One of the few places you can sit outside and enjoy a cigarette with your drink without completely freezing your nuts off due the the heaters outside. I agree it was a complete dump before.

[Otta]

And I don't agree re the Uplands, I think the Actress is a vast improvement. I live round the corner, and I didn't like the vibe in the Uplands at all, whereas I like the Actress.

You're missing my point Sue, The Actress is undoubtedly a vast improvement.

The Uplands pre 2002 was a traditional pub building. It was a dive, but a nice building.

It was then completely gutted, and remained a dive, but one that felt like a cinema foyer. The nice bits of the building could not be replaced.

The Actress is NOT a dive (although not really my bag), and is miles better than The Uplands, buit the gutting of the building in 2002 can not be undone, so the nice stuff about it is lost forever. That is all I am trying to say, I thought it was pretty clear.

[Jeremy]

Sue, I agree wholeheartendly with your comments regarding Hoopers. Someone who moves next to a pub and then complains about the noise obviously has a screw loose. It is an asset to the neighbourhood.

[Otta]

Yep absolutely agree with that. I'm sure the Hearne had complaints from neighbours a few years back about kids playing in the garden. Some people are morons.

[david_carnell]

So everyone seems to agree that Hoopers is doing a great job. And if that's the case what is that they do well that you'd like to see at the "new" CPT?

An well-kept, interesting and changing selection of draught ales, lagers and ciders. Not ubiquitous stuff that is available everywhere.

Simple, tasty food and bar snacks at reasonable prices, sourced from local suppliers. The Montpellier in Peckham do this really well.

A convivial atmosphere with "normal" pub furniture, original fixtures and fittings, a working fire and quiet, if any, music.

Occasional sports, possibly limited to one side of the bar allowing for a quiet drink on the other.

[Otta]

That sounds pretty perfect to me, although I couldn't care less where the food is sourced from as long as it's good quality and doesn't break the bank... Or completely take over.

Another possibility would be to have the "Lounge" bar pretty much just for diners, until say 10pm when the later drinkers come in. It would be convenient for the food being brought down from upstairs, it would be a cosier eating environment (if they keep the fires), and it would leave next door for drinking / watching sport or whatever)