MMR, do you or don't you?

[emza78]

My little one is due her 12 month old MMR vaccine next week, I'm really unsure about giving it to her though. Just wondered what other people's opinions were on this? How easy is it to get them done separately? Anyone know of any places around here? Also wondering whether our private medical insurance would cover it?

Thanks in advance!

[olympia]

Hi

I had similar concerns and the bupa website outlines the MMR in really understandable terms. The main thing that struck me was that separate injections are not that easy to come by and are said not to be licensed in the UK. Have a read of it, helps you make up your mind I think. We have decided to go ahead with it.

hope that helps

[Senor Chevalier]

There was a rather lively EDF-style debate on this matter some time ago between people informed to varying degrees providing their 2 pennies worth alongside lashings of hearsay and conjecture.

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,549067,page=1

Can't say I read all of it.

[Ruth_Baldock]

I believe you can get the single dose shots done at private clinics- i discovered this whilst researching clinics who do the CP vaccine.

We had the first set of MMR jabs when my son was 14mo. Theyre meant to have boosters at 15mo but Southwark are the only place in the UK that stipulate the booster should be given at 15mo rather than 3yrs. So thats when he will be having the second jab/booster.

I did not hesitate to have him vaccinated- not just for hiw health but for he benefit of everyone else he interacts with too. Also, i am non-rubella/measles immune despite numerous vaccines, sonhe had absolutely no natural immunity from me.

[Saffron]

As an alternative to giving single injections, have you looked into altered schedules of immunisation? This would mean that you start the MMR series later and have more time between the jabs. These types of "delayed" schedules are now gaining popularity in countries such as the US and Denmark. After reading the actual research articles for myself (Andrew Wakefield = total idiot, btw), including information about alternative dosing schedules, Mr Saff and I decided for Little Saff that we would use the combined MMR, but take an alternate schedule for jabs.

I found the nurses were always telling me off for being "late" b/c I was off the NHS schedule. I would just roll my eyes and start pouring out whatever sob story I had to hand about how I have no help around the house, am forgetful, have univeristy commmittments, etc... basically anything but actually tell them that I was purposefully using a different vaccination schedule. If I did, then I found that I tended to get lectured, or worse still get drawn into an argument.

I like the combined jab b/c it's fewer injections. And although I think the NHS schedule is safe (in relative terms of course, I also think the delayed schedules are safe. After reading the evidence, I felt like the delayed schedule was right for us.

Two years ago, there was an outbreak of measles at a local school/nursery. And last summer, there was a widespread outbreak of mumps in Surrey/East Sussex, which my friend's non-immunised teenage daughter contracted. This is just by way of saying that herd immunity is not viable in London and the Southeast in general. You need to think very carefully about what you would do, and how you would feel, if your child became seriously ill with one of these infections. If you feel unsure about the MMR, taking a delayed immunisation schedule might be the right course of action for you and your LO. xx

[Bumpkin]

Saffron, what are the benefits of the delayed schedule in your opinion?

Just curious, but little B has already all the injections as advised when advised and no adverse reactions.

[KattyKit]

Hi

I have not seen any evidence regarding the benefit of altered immunisation scheduling. I think part of it's popularity in the states is down to Dr Sears' book but this isn't based on sound medical or scientific advice. Dr Sears thinks that a way to alleviate parent's worries about immunisations is to offer an alternative schedule where the injections are more spaced out - there isn't any decent research backing his views up.

Southwark has had a serious and prolonged outbreak of measles and if you are considering delaying the first MMR or have any worries about it please talk to your GP or practice nurse.

[Saffron]

Sear's book is an interesting but unscientific piece of propaganda, which has just happened to capitalize on a movement that was already underway for many reasons. There are many different vaccine schedules in use for a variety of reasons.

The current "short" schedule for vaccine delivery in many areas was put in place not b/c it provides better efficacy to the individual, but b/c studies showed that delayed schedules led to low compliance, i.e., parents on delayed schedules were more likely to miss crucial later booster doses, resulting in poor immunity.

It's not that a delayed schedule has "benefits" immunologically over a short schedule, or vice versa. It's more that a delayed schedule (w/in reason obviously... let's not be hyperbolic about it) is effective and safe provided that the boosters are still given with/in a reasonable time frame, and that all of the boosters are received.

[KattyKit]

Hi

The current imms schedule was not put in place solely to do with reasons of compliance. Many other factors are considered when advising the department of health on scheduling = including average age of infection, vaccine efficacy and disease burden etc. There is currently no evidence to support advising parents to adopt an alternative schedule. Choosing to space out vaccinations rather than using the current schedule opens a window where unvaccinated children

would be at increased risk infection as heard immunity would fall.

If people are worried about immunising there child they should talk it over with a health professional.

[candj]

For what it's worth, my three have had their MMRs, the older two with boosters already. My youngest who turned one this week just had his and so far no reaction from him and none from his sisters before. I didn't hesitate at all, but can understand your concerns. Good luck with the decision.

[missmack1981]

The 'researcher' who was supposed to link MMR and Autism has been struck off for his ridiculous report. What more can be done to prove there is no evidence to say the risks of having the MMR jab outweigh the potentially fatal risks of not having it?? A public shooting?

A decrease in the MMR uptake WILL increase the spread of these highly infectious and dangerous diseases... Not once did I question protecting my children.

[cuppa tea]

My son had his first MMR at about 15 months and then a booster at just over 2 years. He's 4.5 now and for one reason or another we haven't yet done the pre-school boosters. Does anyone know if he has to have another MMR booster, or is 2 considered enough? 3 shots of it sounds a bit excessive in my (very non-medical) opinion..

[candj]

Cuppatea I think you have had the booster as it's only two jabs ( the mmr then the booster after).

It's amazing how the jab schedules vary from year to year- for my first child the booster was a preschool booster at 4 years, then second child booster was at 2 years and now it's practically within a month of the first mmr jab.

[prickle]

When my kids were at the MMR age, the debate over links to autism was still rife. I delayed and prevaricated and as a result nearly 'forgot' to have them immunised. What brought me to my senses was a trip abroad and I got them done with haste before departure.

With hindsight, I think I was mad to think that I knew better than the mainstream medical advice. I think we should trust the NHS and follow the advised vacination schedule.

[Fidgetsmum]

Slightly off the scheduling topic, but...

If you ever wonder about measles and the effect it could have on your child (and I mean could, it might not of course) then read this by Roald Dahl.

Roald Dahl - measles

There is NOT a link between the MMR jab and autism - no peer reviewed research suggests there is. Andrew Wakefield is a fraud:

Andrew Wakefield

and note his 'abuse of developmentally challenged children' in his 'research' and the link between his future business venture and the paper he was fraudulently creating. The guy had applied for a 'single vaccination patent' just before embarking on this 'research'.

Measles is a terrible illness that our brilliant society had nearly managed to wipe out. Also, the second dose is not a booster; it is a dose to produce immunity in the small number of persons (2?5%) who fail to develop measles immunity after the first dose.

Personally, although I absolutely hate my children having the MMR, I wouldn't have them NOT have it. I know too many people with small babies for a start... imagine my daughter caught it then passed it on to a small baby pre-immunisation, with all the potential implications? I couldn't bare it.

It's not an easy decision at all. Good luck.

[prickle]

If you ever wonder about measles and the effect it could have on your child (and I mean could, it might not of course) then read this by Roald Dahl.

Thank you for posting this - poignant and relevant today. Says it all really. Don't delay, get your children immunised!

edited to say, can't type today!

[TE44]

I wouldn't trust a system that uses scare tactics instead of educating and being honest. Anyone whos children have been damaged by vaccines will know the fight they must have for it to be even recognised. Although a system is set by goverment, I don't think there figures show a true reflection of the people affected.

[emza78]

Thanks for the advice everyone, it's been really useful.

I think for now we're going to delay it and not rush into making a rash decision, it seems there's lots more googling to be done!

Wishing you all a merry christmas

x

[TE44]

There's lots of info emza78, you can only do what you think is best, merry christmas to you, have fun.

[randomv]

Ruth_Baldock Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

> We had the first set of MMR jabs when my son was

> 14mo. Theyre meant to have boosters at 15mo but

> Southwark are the only place in the UK that

> stipulate the booster should be given at 15mo

> rather than 3yrs. So thats when he will be having

> the second jab/booster.

Not quite: Lewisham and Bromley also do at 15 months. Probably any boroughs which have had outbreaks of measles (like Lewisham) and their close neighbours (like Bromley).

[newcomer]

Hi Emza78. Just to let you know that i also AGONISED over this decision as my son has had some bad reactions to his DtaP jabs. Since I 'almost died' (this is according to my mum, who has a tendency to dramatise... but in this case I think she's being truthful) from measles when I was 7, I know first-hand how beneficial it is to have a vaccination available. But I was worried about the potential side effects from having 3 live vaccines at the same time. So I spoke to every doctor I knew and:

- delayed the MMR slightly to 15 months, when it was a period of better weather and a decent period of time had lapsed since my son's previous jabs;

- held off on giving him any other live vaccines (e.g., chicken pox vaccine) within 3 months of the jab;

- gave him a spoonful of Minadex (Vits A and C) every day for a week before and a week after the jab; and

- took his temperature and assessed his 'wellness' before he got the jab.

I doubt these steps would make much, if any, difference to the risks involved, but at least they helped me to feel that I was doing SOMETHING to help. To set your mind at rest, my son had NO discernible side effects in the following weeks. The only thing I noticed was that, in my own strictly non-professional opinion, I think his immune system was a bit 'knocked' after the jab as he seemed to be more prone to catching colds, viruses etc. for the next few months. I'm not sure why this would be - perhaps his system was busy developing antibodies to the various MMR components, and didn't have spare reserves to fight colds? Or maybe I just became slightly paranoid and over-observant! Or sheer coincidence. Who knows.

Anyhow, I wish you very well with your decision- I really do empathise!

[nancyse15]

I would just get it over and done with and take her in for the MMR. Both my children have had theirs with no side effects. Separate jabs might seem to be a better option, but I think they are very expensive and bothersome and in the end why put your child through the trauma of extra jabs and upset if there is no proven benefit?

[JessicaR]

We did, but it was a tough decision. Separate jabs are supposedly not as effective. There are lots of books out there that make it sound so dangerous, but in the end you just have to trust your instincts!

[QueenMab]

Even if there ARE risks linked to the MMR jabs (although, as others have pointed out, there is NO peer-reviewed research for this), the risks to your children (and to others such as pregnant women who have to rely on group immunity) of not vaccinating is far higher.

Anyone whose thinking is that they "wouldn't trust a system that uses scare tactics instead of educating and being honest" is not even being rational, which goes to show how much hysteria and irrational thinking end up informing some of the most crucial decisions for our children. Very sad.

[TE44]

Just because your opinion differs from mine does not make my views irrational. I wonder if you met someone whos child had been damaged by vaccine you would hold the same view. How sad it is that when parents are faced with this decision, they have no understanding for someone who chooses differently. As someone says above, you can only go with your instinct.There was an on line study done recently, looking at vaccinated and unvaccinated children, (will try 2 find link later), this was the first study done. It was recognised in these studies that often people who do not get there children vaccinated may often have a similiar view to what there children eat, medicine etc. I think the bigger picture is important, and as we all know, we can only do our best, regardless of what your decision is.