Infidelity

[lozzyloz]

Just spent the last four days mediating between a couple of close friends whose marriage is on the rocks because the husband was caught being unfaithful for the last 6 months.

If it happened to you would you consider having your partner back or do you believe in one strike and out?

What would be the terms and how would you go about putting the relationship back on track?

Would it make a difference if there are kids from the relationship?

[Michael Palaeologus]

I have been through this twice with 2 sets of friends. I couple stayed together, 1 couple split.

The reasons were of course complex, but at the core the issue seemed to be:

a - the reasons why the other person strayed

b - the willingness of the injured party to forgive

c - a joint wish to stay together if possible

d - children

Where things broke down completely there were no kids and the straying party was bored in the relationship, the couple had moved apart as people and there had been an unsuccessfull attempt at IVF. Their reaction to the lack of success was very different with the injured party being quite sanguine about it and the one who strayed being bitterly disappointed. This then led to accusations of lack of support and a breakdown in trust and respect. A new partner was found who was newly single and new and shiny and so that was the end of the marriage.

Where things were mended there were 2 kids - much loved and a lovely home. The problem was that the straying partner was spending most of their time away from home, was under huge work stress, had lost their father recently - this had brought up deeply buried issues from childhood (nothing sexual) and all of the precipitated a huge mid-life crisis. The straying was symptomatic of all of these problems. The inured party was of course angry, hurt and very bitter BUT could see what the issues were. Both parties fundamentally wanted the relationship to work and both were willing to put their family and their relationship before themselves as individuals. Much more time is now spent together as a family, there is much more talking and listening, there is a much higher awareness of just how much they rely on each other, mutual respect is now even stronger. I am not saying that things are perfect, no relationship is; but I uld put money on them being together for ever and ever amen.

[lozzyloz]

As you say, infidelity is invariably a symptom of much bigger problems in the relationship which generally revolve around poor communication, being open and honest with your feelings and mutual respect. Having joint children certainly provides some motivation to stay together but I suspect that the thought of selling a heavily mortgaged home, expensive car etc is just as strong an incentive these days!

I guess the central issue though is TRUST. When it's broken it is almost impossible for some people to forgive. If you can't get to a point where you're willing to trust again without setting restrictive conditions then I can't see how it is possible to move forward in a relationship.

[Keef]

Something I feel quite strongly about in these situations, is that if you choose to forgive and take back (not saying you should do, but IF you do), then you have to put it in the past.

You can't win every arguement ever by playing the "you cheated" card. That really isn't fair.

I was cheated on once. Ironic thing was that she spent 5 years being the most obsessively jealous person in the world, and convinced I'd cheat on her, which genuinely never crossed my mind... Well, not seriously anyway. Was not nice, but for me it just showed the state of our relationship and made me wake up and move on with my life.

[TillieTrotter]

Very difficult one this. I'm not sure I could get over it as trust is probably one of the most important things on my tick list. I think I would end up being too bitter to carry the relationship forward. In saying that, two sets of friends got through atrocious cases of infidelity (both involving people from within their circle of friends) and they seem to have come out of the other side!

[gerry]

Lozzy

If the couple want to stay together, they will. Usually its too difficult to repair the relationship without some objective support, but if there is commitment and the couple still love each other, they will get through it. Any couple I know who has been through this went to see a counsellor and learned to build a new relationship. If you want a recommendation, PM me. You can't return to the old relationship because that failed, but you can rebuild, keep what was good and start again. Sorry, yes, I am a counsellor!!! I have seen many couples stay together after an affair, and usually they are much happier afterwards, rebuilding something much better than what they had before.

[lozzyloz]

Thanks Gerry. Part of the problem is that the wife feels she doesn't want to participate in marriage counseling because she doesn't feel that she wants to rebuild the relationship. Naturally a lot of this is anger speaking. She's also being encouraged by her family not to take him back, even though they've been together for 14 years, this has never happened before and he is (with the exception of this indiscretion) a very decent guy. The other complication is that there appears to be a level of dependency on Cocaine. Would they need two counsellors (relationship/addiction) or can one deal with it all?

[gerry]

HI Lozzy, you are in a very difficult position. Are you friends to both of them or just the wife? He would need to address the cocaine problem with a drugs counsellor, easily found, if he would agree to do that. That can be on the NHS through his GP. She also needs support, but her family are too close to the situation to provide it. They are probably adding to her stress and confusion!! A counsellor to see both of them would at least give each of them a chance to be heard, because I suspect (as you said) there is too much anger and hurt there now for anyone to listen.

[lozzyloz]

I'm very close to both of them (known them since they first met) and they both have a dependency. The husband says he's prepared to get counseling for it but his wife doesn't think she has a problem even.

[downsouth]

gerry Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> He would need to address the cocaine problem with

> a drugs counsellor,

I was going to post what makes you think he has the problem? ANot a great advert for counselling when the man is suspected of the any wrongdoing.

Glad Lozzy cleared it up.

[gerry]

I was following on from why the family were encouraging her not to take him back. I assumed that was part of the reason why. But having said that, if they wanted to start working on the relationship while the cocaine dependency was still there, that would come out in counselling anyway. That would be another issue to discuss. Has the cocaine always been part of their relationship? Any other drugs? Alcohol? Sometimes the couple are trapped in relating to each other through drugs or alcohol and don't know how to get out of it and break the cycle. Usually, if one partner stops, the relationship breaks down because they no longer have "that" in common. So its best that they try together to get help.

[lozzyloz]

Gerry, you've hit the nail on the head. Can you PM me a recommendation to forward onto them. Would they have to wait long to get an appointment? I've never tried to tell them whether they should split or make-up but simply to recognise and face their problems and then decide what to do after that. Currently he has temporarily moved out of the house but is negotiating his way back into the spare room. My hunch tells me that it might be too early to do this until they've started getting some proper help. What do you think?

[gerry]

Yes, I can. However, I agree it could be too soon. They could actually see a counsellor individually in the early weeks - as a matter of course, they have that choice. If they feel they want to come together, that's ok as well. The couple decides what's best for them....and only they can judge when they are ready to take the next step. See my PM

[lozzyloz]

Thanks Gerry you've been really helpful.

[gerry]

Thank you for being such a good friend to them. I hope things work out for them.

[LizzygotDizzy]

Keef wrote:- Ironic thing was that she spent 5 years being the most obsessively jealous person in the world, and convinced I'd cheat on her.

The reason that cheaters always accuse, question or doubt the fidelity of their innocent partners is that they are judging them on how they themselves are in fact behaving. An overly obssessive or jealous lover may themselves be up to more than you bargained for. I have had various friends who have been cheated on and they always say their husbands/boyfriends always accused THEM of chatting up other people/fancying other people, and in the worse cases actually having affairs when in fact they are doing it themselves. One guy was so bad he used to intimately sniff my friend whenever she cam back in from a night out with friends, (although if she was bad am sure she would have sorted herself out in the hygiene dept. before she got home doh!) yet he was the one who had been hiding an affair for 2 years!

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Lozzyloz - Maybe the cocaine use and infidelity are symptoms of the same thing, i.e a wish not to have to deal with something that he is trying to avoid. That could be any number of things in work, his relationship or wider life.

It could be something fundamental that he is scared of and can't handle facing e.g feeling inferior to his partner or boss or sibling; maybe some unfixable debt problem or corner he's become backed into at work but it would really have to be something that is affecting him currently if he has only just started cheating but may have been building up if he's been using for a while.

I think maybe if he can find out what his deepest fear is and finds understanding in his partner, then he has a chance to fix both his cocaine dependency and his marriage.

I would always try to fix it unless it was way beyond repair.

[Keef]

Doing the sniff test is a bit much, I think you know trust has broken down when you're partner is acting like a dog the minute you come in the door!

[TillieTrotter]

Thats hideous and ludicrous, my partner would have got a knee on his sniffer if he had tried that:-S

[Jah Lush]

I find it rather hard to believe that you are discussing someone else's relationship on a public forum. Unbelievable!

[lozzyloz]

You've got a point there Jah and I'd thought about this long and hard before posting.

They don't live in London and don't know about this forum let alone my pseudonym.

I wanted to hear other peoples views to see if there was anything else I could say to help them.

I think there are a lot of people who have/had similar problems and can relate to some of the other issues and answers raised so it was also food for thought.

Sorry if it disturbed you.