blood sports and other such things

[Thomas Micklewright]

Guten abend.

So, blood sports? What's your take on them, from bull fighting in Spain,.hare coursing in Ireland and stag hunting in England. Badger cull anyone?

If expressing belief through a glass window doesn't do it for you, then you are cordially invited to a talk on fox hunting at the Blue brick cafe, 7.30pm 8th December. It would be great to see pro-hunters there for a balanced discussion.

Hope you can all make it,

Tom

For more info or to chat about hunts drop me a line [email protected]

[Otta]

Is a badger cull a blood sport?

I'm against most, and I'm not sure about the badger cull (because I don't know the arguments for it very well).

I do think that if you're going to talk about blood sports, you should stick to blood sports.

[Loz]

I hate to break it to you, but isn't fox hunting illegal?

Personally, I'm not in favour, hare coursing especially. But you are off the mark with badger culling - it's not a 'blood sport'.

[katie1997]

Thomas Micklewright Wrote:

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It would be great to

> see pro-hunters there for a balanced discussion.

> Hope you can all make it,

Tom - if you do a search, you'll find there's a previous thread asking if there are any hunters in East Dulwich. There weren't. And not many of the pro-hunting persuasion either. So am not sure if you're likely to get a 'balanced discussion' going.

I know you are really passionate about animals and their welfare but I'd love to see you start a thread about something else too.

[david_carnell]

Love it. Can't get enough. I'm sitting here in my pants smeared in the juices of the Scotch Woodcock as we speak.

All my own work. Went out there......dispatched it myself.

Gruesome stuff. Wouldn't have it any other way.

[Chick]

katie1997 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Thomas Micklewright Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> It would be great to

> > see pro-hunters there for a balanced

> discussion.

> > Hope you can all make it,

>

> Tom - if you do a search, you'll find there's a

> previous thread asking if there are any hunters in

> East Dulwich. There weren't. And not many of the

> pro-hunting persuasion either. So am not sure if

> you're likely to get a 'balanced discussion'

> going.

>

> I know you are really passionate about animals and

> their welfare but I'd love to see you start a

> thread about something else too.

You are forgeting trollthehunter?

[steveo]

In the UK, how many foxes, badgers, deer, hares and other things with pretty faces are killed for sport a year? I have no idea. Ten? A thousand? 100,000?

And how many pigs, cows, sheep, fish and birds for the pot?

About a billion apparently.

In the parlance of the hunter, aren't the guns trained on the wrong target?

[LadyDeliah]

I'd like to start a Dulwich hunt to cull all the mangy foxes in the area!

[DaveR]

I'm not actively pro-hunting, but I'm very pro-freedom, and I've never been entirely persuaded by the anti arguments. Bear baiting (for example) is predicated on cruelty and exploitation, and is essentially, indefensible; fox hunting isn't.

So, Tom, what are your views on badger culling?

Badger cull

['bout now]

Fox hunting maybe illegal but it's virtually an unenforced law. Most hunts applied the rules until local police forces explained (again) that they did not have the time and resource to observe and prosecute.

I'm not pro but a huge amount of parliamentary time was wasted on a massive fudge.

[DulwichFox]

Huntsmen/women often tell us about the good service they provide by getting rid of Dozens of foxes each year.

Benefiting farmers and pet owners....

But..

As soon as someone suggests they are slaughtering dozens of defenceless animals each year...

They reply, "We only take one or two foxes each year. Most foxes get away unarmed."

Funny that..

Fox.

[Thomas Micklewright]

More fozes are killed by cars than hunts - so yes DulwichFox your right, they can't use the 'its to protect my chickens' argument.

Sorry i shouldnt have added badger culling, it isnt a sport. I dont agree with it, because a) I dont think it will work b) its to protect cattle, and I dont believe in keeping cattle.

Im very suprised to see such an anti-hunt react from people, whats the difference between hunting and killing a fox and keeping a cow in a shed all its life and then cutting its throat?

Tom

ps. just for you katie i'll go and post about something else in the general section, keep your peepers open!

[hellosailor]

Thomas Micklewright Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

> Im very suprised to see such an anti-hunt react

> from people, whats the difference between hunting

> and killing a fox and keeping a cow in a shed all

> its life and then cutting its throat?

>

> you really can't see any difference at all between foxes being hunted for fun and cows being killed for food?

>

[DaveR]

"Im very suprised to see such an anti-hunt react from people, whats the difference between hunting and killing a fox and keeping a cow in a shed all its life and then cutting its throat? "

Steak.

[Thomas Micklewright]

my point is, you dont need to eat meat, you dont need to hunt foxes, however people still kill them for fun (whether thats sport or food).

how do you justify killing a cow, but not a stag? bit like the dog/pig argument, why not eat your dog?http://www.animalaid.org.uk/h/n/NEWS/news_veggie/ALL/2563//

[aquarius moon]

No. You don't need to eat meat,

You don't need to hunt foxes,

You don't have to kill anything.

Live & let live.

Be kind to all living creatures.

[Annette Curtain]

Thomas Micklewright Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> my point is, you dont need to eat meat, you dont

> need to hunt foxes, however people still kill them

> for fun (whether thats sport or food).

>

> how do you justify killing a cow, but not a stag?

> bit like the dog/pig argument, why not eat your

> dog?http://www.animalaid.org.uk/h/n/NEWS/news_vegg

> ie/ALL/2563//

I have eaten my dog !

(in a weird way)

NETTE:-$

[Thomas Micklewright]

Just a reminder to.say the meeting is this thursday at 7.30pm, blue brick cafe, hope to.see you there Tom

[Annette Curtain]

On Saturday just gone, I stroked the pig that i'll eat on the 17th.

True

NETTE

[maxxi]

TM - "my point is, you dont need to eat meat, you dont need to hunt foxes,"

Well Tommy, you don't NEED a lot of stuff... y'know?

TM - "how do you justify killing a cow, but not a stag?"

I would kill and eat both - long hanging and slow cooking is the answer for an older stag.

TM - "why not eat your dog?"

My 'largely carnivorous' dog and I (assuming I had one) have the same viewpoint - we try only to eat vegetarians.

Still, chin up Tommy - no matter how naive you are there is always someone more cloud-bound than yourself...

*waves at Aq. Mn. who is attempting to tie pink ribbons onto a crack squirrel*

[peterstorm1985]

I tend to think that killing an animal in the field is a much better way to put food on the table than the meat section of Sainsbury's - certainly in terms of natural animal welfare - but it's not terribly practical for most of us. BUT, I don't think of shooting a stag, or pheasant, or even rabbit (vermin in my mind but tasty nevertheless) as a sport. And even if you do get enjoyment out of it, that's a long way from bull fighting which is entirely for the pleasure of killing. If they gave you a slice off the rump to take home afterwards I'd be a lot happier with the idea.

I would agree with maxxi about only eating vegetarians (dogs/people?) but if you've ever seen what a free range chicken will eat given the chance you'll realise the rules aren't quite as simple as you thought.

[Thomas Micklewright]

sounds kinda creepy nette.

thanks for all those that turned up for the meteing re. blood sports, very intersting to hear the fox hunting law has has little effect on stopping hunting, and we need to really push for a tighten on the loop holes Mr Blair left in the bill.

If you would like to find out more about hunters breaking the law have a look at:

http://hsa.enviroweb.org/

[peterstorm1985]

OK, so I'm going to have to ask this. Why waste so much time worrying about a few foxes when there are thousands of factory farmed chickens suffering a far worse existence?

I guess because fox hunting (which I personally think is disgusting) is perceived to be a rich man's sport and so it's easily press worthy.

Of course there are a few posh twits who love to race across the English countryside and revel in the final bloodbath but the number of foxes killed (maimed/suffering) are so small (relatively) that it seems a disproportionate amount of energy (and money) to spend on something when that same effort could do so much good elsewhere.

Why not picket the chicken and chip shops in Lordship lane? The cruelty that intensive factory farming of chickens causes is so much greater in a single week than the total amount of suffering of the national population of foxes in a year.

p.s. If anyone were to open a free-range chicken and chip shop, I'd go there every week.

[Thomas Micklewright]

I try to cover all issues peter. If every month I held a group meeting about factory farms no one would turn up. Variety is the spice of life ...

However I agree chicken shops are the biggest animal welfare issue in ED.and something I will persue after meat free days. The problem is, they are a chain and not a local independent shop and don't even return letters or calls. They give nothing back to ed, only take.

Any ideas how to go about encouraging them to improve animal welfare?

Tom