Proposed East Dulwich CPZ

[edanna]

mrwb Wrote:

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> I park around Goodrich, Barry and Landells road

> multiple times a day. In the last year I've never

> had an issue parking. Usually I would estimate

> there are 10+ spaces within 5 mins walk of where I

> want to be.

>

> The only place in this area I've ever seen parking

> issues is on Lordship lane for the shops.

>

> Interested to hear if anyone on here ever has a

> problem parking? If so which part of the area?

It can be very difficult to park on Fellbrigg, Shawbury, Archdale, Lacon roads and nearby particularly during the day on weekdays and Saturdays. People park to work at or visit the shops, market, mosque, temple etc. The pressure on this area is very different to the roads you mention.

[MarkT]

rh, Abe,

my point, which I should have made clear, is that I question the phrase "would like". No doubt people who strongly object to a CPZ would select the 2 hour regime as the least objectionable option if the CPZ is created. That is very different from saying that those objectors "would like" that option.

Perhaps "prefer" would be more appropriate.

MarkT

[Pugwash]

Residents' parking charges for cars are ?125 pa and ?31.25 for motor bikes. So if you are a 2 car family with lots of family/friends visiting on a regular basis - you could end up paying out around ?10 per week. Visitors (including tradespeople) permits range form ?1.55 for 2 hours to ?5.15 per day. You can also purchase these in blocks of 10 which is cheaper.

Home Care Workers are not permitted to have individual parking permits but their agency is only allowed 5 permits per year to be shared amongst all of their workers. You will need to consider that if you have a care package of say 3 visits a day and a CPZ in introduced in your street (regardless whether it is all day or 2 hours) this may have an impact on your care giver's ability to continue to provide support at the times previously given. Care workers having to find a non CPZ street to park in order to visit you. Of course many carers do not use a car, so this will have little impact for them. However if you have informal carers i.e. family/friends who pop in for a hour or so during the day to cook a meal, help you with personal care etc - they will have to have a visitor's permit on a daily basis.

Having lived in the past, in areas close to stations, I can see the attraction of a 2 hour CPZ to prevent commuters parking. The roads off Lordship Lane are a nightmare to find a parking space. When I had my car serviced by a garage off LL, I used to go down around 9 pm the night before to park the car and put keys through letter box as found that even going around 7 am there were no spaces.

It is important, as MarkT states to make your views known early if you are against CPZ (or only favour a 2 hour) as non communication of your wishes will be seen by Southwark as an acceptance of a CPZ.

[Penguin68]

My daughter, living in Lewisham, has found that the CPZ outside her house extends to 7:00pm - she lives in a normal residential street. There was a commuting car problem there, certainly, although the street was always clear by 6:00 - the extra hour just gives a chance for more fines as evening visitors turn-up. CPZs are not supported by London councils in order to benefit local residents, they are about forcing car use out of London and (whatever they say) revenue generation. Forcing car use out of London (for which an argument can be made) without offering, or being able to offer, effective public transport alternatives is acting against the interests of residents. But who, in Tooley St, gives a flying - well your choice of flying object - for those of us in the south of the borough, some of whom have had the temerity, on occasion, not to vote for the Ruling Party?

[natty01295]

Public transport is slow, Not everyone wants to use it

Owning a Car has got and Will get more expensive

It's your right if you want to drive,??

PLease Respond??

[rollflick]

According to the council website (though all we have are the titles to go by until the consultations start), the proposed CPZs include some measures to reduce bus delays. Decisions following the consultation are due to be made by February 2019.

East Dulwich parking zone (incorporating Lordship Lane bus mitigation measures & Lordship Lane safety improvements)

Peckham West parking zone (incorporating Grove Vale bus (mitigation measures))

http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/mgListPlanItems.aspx?PlanId=536

With Southwark worst affected by drops in bus passengers in London and having seriously missed its own targets to cut bus delays, it's about time the council took action. Otherwise cash strapped TfL could cut our buses further. Whether the proposals will help remains to be seen though.

[apmuso]

Personally I'm for a 12-2 CPZ in the Grove Vale area, but I appreciate the arguments against. I can seldom park anywhere near the house on a weekday and the situation has definitely deteriorated (we've lived in the same house for 21 years). What I don't get is how vexed people are getting about it. As I understand it, the council are willing to implement a CPZ where there is enough support on a road by road basis, rather than firehose the area with them. Surely we wait and see what the response is and if we lose, we lose - unless there is 10% overspend on the leave side - I mean against side...

[intexasatthe moment]

I think maybe the whole concept of a CPZ appeals to ppl who think it will guarantee them a parking space near their house in exchange for a fee,

I've known friends in CPZ and their experience has been a reduction in parking spaces and a continuing difficulty in finding a space .

Factor in the domino effect caused by a CPZ in one road to adjacent streets , increased complexity for parking for carers ( formal and informal ) and my own personal fear which is that CPZs encourage the turning of front gardens into hard surfaced car parking areas then it seems less of the soloution that some think .

[apmuso]

Agree with intexas re front gardens. It is not a solution. However, our desire for the CPZ is not solely based on being able to park. The congestion on Melbourne is insufferable on most days at certain times, combined with air pollution, damage to cars and really worrying levels of road rage makes us think that a CPZ would go some way to helping.

[intexasatthe moment]

Apusmo I'm not sure that a CPZ will reduce traffic .Are you thinking less vehicles looking to park and parking ? It won't reduce thru traffic will it ?

And it will reduce car parking spaces so may add to rage ,congestion ,air pollution etc

[apmuso]

You're right intexas - it won't reduce the amount of traffic. We're a rat run - always have been, always will be. But every time I'm driving in Herne Hill in a CPZ road, I'm struck by the number of empty bays - which for us would hugely improve traffic flow. In my 21 years here, I have witnessed such incredible levels of congestion and really ugly road rage. There has to be a better way. We'd be up for making MG one-way, but the council have always rejected the idea.

[Sally Eva]

One ways (particularly lovely straight ones) tend to increase speed.

[MarkT]

Apmuso wrote:

?Personally I'm for a 12-2 CPZ in the Grove Vale area, but I appreciate the arguments against.?

?As I understand it, the council are willing to implement a CPZ where there is enough support on a road by road basis, rather than firehose the area with them.?

Why do you understand it will be implemented on a road by road basis? I have quoted above (Oct 17) from the Dog Kennel Hill Report:

- 14 streets out of a total 29 streets voted yes to a CPZ.

- 47% of all respondents voted yes to a CPZ.

- Based on the results of the informal consultation, officers are making the following recommendations: To implement a parking zone throughout the whole study area.

As you are for a CPZ, you might agree with the officers that 47% of a 15% response is, to use your phrase, ?enough support?, but you are demonstrably wrong that it will be implemented on a road by road basis?

I also question your phrase ?the Council are willing to implement?. I think that determined would be more apt. In each area that has previously rejected a CPZ, they try again until they have "enough support" to justify bulldozing it through.

I?d like to explore your appreciation of the arguments against in a later post.

MarkT

[ed26]

Will the council demonstrate that the CPZ is not being introduced as a revenue generator? There's around 60 cars in our street. At ?125 per permit, that will work out at c?7,500 p.a. to implement and enforce / maintain the zone. This seems over the top.

A particularly successful scheme I have seen outside London near a railway station only enforced the CPZ from 9am to 10am. This is enough to ensure that commuters can't leave their cars unattended for the whole day, but cost less to enforce and caused less inconvenience to locals. In that case, the reduction in parking enabled the streets to reserve some non-parking spaces, allowing passing places and improving the flow of traffic.

Slightly off-topic @apmuso - I'm occasionally guilty of using MG to cut through. As EDG into LL is a no right turn, it's much easier to head up MG, cut through onto LL and turn left before taking a right into North Cross Road. Maybe putting traffic lights on the EDG/LL junction would improve the EDG traffic flow, taking some pressure off MG? It would also make it much easier to cross EDG as a pedestrian, which can be a dangerous manoeuvre.

[apmuso]

MarkT - you assume that the ED CPZ scheme will be rolled out in exactly the same manner as the Dog Kennel one. Not what I'd heard.

ed26 - you shouldn't feel guilty about using MG! It is what it is. The main concerns for residents have always been congestion, pollution, damage and road rage as well as the obvious parking inconvenience, so any solution to mitigate any of those issues would be welcome.

Agree entirely about the single or 2 hour window for the scheme. That's what we'll be campaigning for.

[edanna]

The 9-10 window may work for people parking to catch the train. But if the parking pressure is from people driving to work at shops and local businesses, or to go to shops or restaurants, or cinema or mosque, the parking pressure would likely be just the same after 10.

[ED_moots]

ed26 Wrote:

> Slightly off-topic @apmuso - I'm occasionally

> guilty of using MG to cut through. As EDG into LL

> is a no right turn, it's much easier to head up

> MG, cut through onto LL and turn left before

> taking a right into North Cross Road. Maybe

> putting traffic lights on the EDG/LL junction

> would improve the EDG traffic flow, taking some

> pressure off MG? It would also make it much easier

> to cross EDG as a pedestrian, which can be a

> dangerous manoeuvre.

From EDG you can turn right on to Matham and then right onto LL, slightly shorter and theres a box junction to help you out, also you can avoid all the stuck cars and road rage

[northernexile]

Received a letter from Southwark today stating the CPZ will go live on 17th December, M-F, 11am to 1pm. First time any documentation has been sent in a year, certainly not had sight of any further consultation information.

Ironic that looking out on the street there are 4 parking spaces free. This despite 2 skips, 3 vans and a bag of builders sand taking up space. Oh, and 3 morons who don't know how to park. Add onto that the person on our street who wrote for a CPZ, someone who has 4 cars in their family, and will duly benefit from a sizeable discount.

Surely its time residents with multiple cars were penalised accordingly. There are only 2 people in their household entitled to drive! As has already been mentioned, a CPZ doesn't give you a parking spot outside of your house as a right. Something people will find out soon enough.

Truly ridiculous decision.

[Pugwash]

Are you sure that you get discounts for multiple car ownership?

[bels123]

Discount? Each household can get max of 3 permits but only for cars registered to that property with DVLA. Only discounts I can see are for disabled badges, motorbikes and electric vehicles.

[singalto]

I haven?t had any letter from Southwark about this at any stage. How do we get our permits if they don?t write to us? Is it the whole proposed CPZ going live?

[rupert james]

northernexile Wrote:

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> Received a letter from Southwark today stating the

> CPZ will go live on 17th December, M-F, 11am to

> 1pm. First time any documentation has been sent

> in a year, certainly not had sight of any further

> consultation information.

>

> Ironic that looking out on the street there are 4

> parking spaces free. This despite 2 skips, 3 vans

> and a bag of builders sand taking up space. Oh,

> and 3 morons who don't know how to park. Add onto

> that the person on our street who wrote for a CPZ,

> someone who has 4 cars in their family, and will

> duly benefit from a sizeable discount.

>

> Surely its time residents with multiple cars were

> penalised accordingly. There are only 2 people in

> their household entitled to drive! As has already

> been mentioned, a CPZ doesn't give you a parking

> spot outside of your house as a right. Something

> people will find out soon enough.

>

> Truly ridiculous decision.

Think this going live refers to the DKH CPZ

Which will in time force ED to became a CPZ. We did not want the DKH CPZ, voted against but told we have to accept the will of Southwark

[Froglander]

Does anyone have a link to the DKH CPZ?

[rupert james]

http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s71241/Appendix%201%20Consultation%20report%20and%20appendices.pdf

Think this the link

[intexasatthe moment]

There's a map in this link https://consultations.southwark.gov.uk/environment-leisure/dogkennelhill/