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Ahh.. well I am home alone now, having relieved the babysitter from her duties after my wild and crazy Monday night out sipping my two glasses of rose (my partner is working tonight). However, I don't have a car and can't drive anyway so hopefully that 2nd glass of wine won't make me incapable of dialing for an ambulance should I need to. (BTW - isn't the advice to always wait for the ambulance in case of an emergency and not attempt to drive to the hospital yourself with a seriously ill child or other person for that matter anyway?)


Anyway, I just read a fantastic article on the Motherlode blog of the New York Times - it was all about babies on airplanes and there were lots of moans and discussions about the issues The best response was from the person who said she was on a plane with her baby next to a business man - she felt anxious when the baby started to cry and he smiled at her and said. 'I don't mind babies. They are babies. What I can't stand are adults who act like babies.' YEAH!

helena handbasket Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hellosailer- :)-D (and that's a full pint for me,

> thanks!) .......nothing to add since discussing

> parenting with someone who hasn't done it and

> discussing drinking with someone who doesn't

> really do that either is the curse of this forum.

>

>

> But I have to tell you, this is GOLD:

>

> hellosailor Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > zeban Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> > >I did actually expect an

> > > apology as she could see what she was doing

> but

> > > when I looked at her she didn't say a thing!

> >

> > Maybe she melted on the spot


Oh dear HH, being b**chy AGAIN!!!


Well I am rather hot, maybe even women find me so, so maybe you're right hellosailor ;-)


Interesting how the Mums have started up a thread on this in the family room! http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,783622

zeban Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

> Oh dear HH, being b**chy AGAIN!!!


Zeban, with respect, anyone who can remember the posting history between you and HH would say that for her to leave it at having a wry smile over my joke on this thread would be you getting off pretty darn lightly. It's a miracle that she hasn't responded more vigorously to what many would describe as your repeated bullying of her.

Any yes ,I'd also like to know, why is it interesting that 'the Mums' have started a thread on this in the family room!?

>

> Zeban wrote:


Interesting how the Mums have started up a thread

> on this in the family room!

Scruffy Mummy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

One piece of advice Damian - if you

> want to have a moan or rant or debate do not use a

> user name which can be traced back to your

> business identity. Keep your rant/moan identity

> separate from your business/work identity!


Really? I assume you're referring to Clarissa and the sponge cake business yes?


Babies and prams in pubs... ah come on aren't we done yet?


This is hardly a thread worthy of the main section... *sighs*

Clarrisa and the sponge cake business - I'm curious now! But no, I'm actually referring to the discussion that happens on page 5 of this thread between Damain and other posters about his business and whether it's relevant to this particular discussion or not.
hellosailor: just calm down, you have gone way off topic as this thread was about babies and prams in pubs which I do not have a problem with. The nice thing about this forum is you can get a range of different opinions from different people and I'm entitled to have my opinion without you repeatedly challenging me. I don't know why you felt the need to repeat our converstation in the family forum where what I said was taken completely out of context. For some to say I can't comment cos I don't drink or have children is rubbish, I do drink and am often in the pubs in Dulwich so can comment on this topic. You should apppreciate the fact that people do have different opinions and not take it personally as if I am criticising your parenting skills which of course I most certainly am not! So just leave it be now as I tried to and lets get back on topic shall we?!

DaveR Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Since when has Helen Graves been 'illustrious'?

>

> On the substance, surely by now this has been done

> to death. Some people are selfish idiots. They

> include smug, self-justifying parents who have no

> consideration for the way they and their children

> behave in public and the effect that this has on

> others. They also, however, include people who

> constantly complain about their precious little

> lives being interrupted by the unwelcome presence

> of kids, prams etc. in, God forbid, shops, cafes

> and pubs.

>

> Fortunately, the majority of people are not

> selfish idiots, and somehow manage to rub along

> with each other.



Absolutely spot on. This thread should have stopped with this summary.

hellosailor Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> zeban Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> >

> > Oh dear HH, being b**chy AGAIN!!!

>

> Zeban, with respect, anyone who can remember the

> posting history between you and HH would say that

> for her to leave it at having a wry smile over my

> joke on this thread would be you getting off

> pretty darn lightly. It's a miracle that she

> hasn't responded more vigorously to what many

> would describe as your repeated bullying of her.

> Any yes ,I'd also like to know, why is it

> interesting that 'the Mums' have started a thread

> on this in the family room!?


With respect hellosailor, how on earth can you start a sentence with 'with respect' and then accuse me of bullying'! Bullying!!!! I think you'll find HH tries to tear you to shreds if you have a different opinion to her so I'd suggest IF you are going to accuse anyone of bullying it would be her and also possibly yourself if you look deep within and read your posts again. Please feel free anyone to take a look at this so-called 'bullying' and then let me know what you think. What the truth is is it goes a little something like this:


(As Marie81 has already found out on this forum), if you so much as dare to have a different opinion to the Mums in the family room they unfortunately gang up on you and try to belittle your opinion. Marie81 sums it up nicely in this post:


hellosailor: just calm down, you have gone way off topic as this thread was about babies and prams in pubs which I do not have a problem with. The nice thing about this forum is you can get a range of different opinions from different people and I'm entitled to have my opinion without you repeatedly challenging me. I don't know why you felt the need to repeat our converstation in the family forum where what I said was taken completely out of context. For some to say I can't comment cos I don't drink or have children is rubbish, I do drink and am often in the pubs in Dulwich so can comment on this topic. You should apppreciate the fact that people do have different opinions and not take it personally as if I am criticising your parenting skills which of course I most certainly am not! So just leave it be now as I tried to and lets get back on topic shall we?!

I have always found Helena Handbasket to have her own mind, and has often gone against the "popular trends" in the family room, so to suggest that she is a Family Room bully is a total nonsense.


Zeban, I have no problem with you personally, but there are several examples of you having an issue with a specific poster (more than one), and seemingly arguing with them in any thread, about any subject. It's tiresome.

It's irrational to believe that because someone hasn't got experience of drinking alcohol and having kids, their views on combining alcohol environments and children are not valid. Perhaps they're MORE valid because they're less likely to be tainted by a desire for alcohol..


Marie81's view aligns very closely to mine and I am a Dad.

So is my view also invalid because it aligns with Marie81's, because she is not 'one of us' ?

Ridiculous.


Bit of a weird world if our views are only 'allowed' if we have in-depth experience of everything we speak about !!!!

I think Marie81's claim that people don't want her to have an opinion on prams in pubs is rather disingenuous to say the least?! Also peculiar to say that I've taken the thread off topic, when it was her that started lecturing those of us with children on whether we should or shouldn't be having a glass of wine with a meal in the privacy of our own home. Nothing to do with prams in pubs. Off topic, no?


I in no way think that she shouldn't have an opinion on that matter, nor have I said so!


I did however feel compelled to respond to her suggestion that any amount of drinking while in the care of a child - and she has clarified that she does indeed include in that having one glass of wine with dinner in your own home while your child is asleep upstairs - is indicative that you have an addiction problem and are also that you are an irresponsible parent. She does seem to make an exception for parents without a driving license, which confuses her principle somewhat, but there you go.


Marie81, when you put statements like the ones you have out into the ether on this forum, or any other public domain, you will find that people do come back at you, it's the nature of the beast. And for what it's worth, you may not feel that calling people addicts for enjoying the odd glass of wine in their own home or saying they are irresponsible parents if they do so is 'criticising their parenting skills' but many would beg to differ. The phrase 'are you one of those parents then?!' was surely not designed to win friends?

And I do not need to be told to 'calm down' because I don't agree with you or because I have asked you to clarify what you're saying. I'm perfectly calm thanks, your posts have given me a bit of light relief and something to have a giggle about if anything!

I have been easy on you, but you seem to unravel without any help from me.


Tear you to shreds? Are you joking? I haven't but I seriously should have.


Maybe next time.






hellosailor Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> zeban Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> >

> > Oh dear HH, being b**chy AGAIN!!!

>

> Zeban, with respect, anyone who can remember the

> posting history between you and HH would say that

> for her to leave it at having a wry smile over my

> joke on this thread would be you getting off

> pretty darn lightly. It's a miracle that she

> hasn't responded more vigorously to what many

> would describe as your repeated bullying of her.

> Any yes ,I'd also like to know, why is it

> interesting that 'the Mums' have started a thread

> on this in the family room!?

> >

> > Zeban wrote:

>

> Interesting how the Mums have started up a thread

> > on this in the family room!

Posted by: helena handbasket Yesterday, 09:59PM


" .......nothing to add since discussing parenting with someone who hasn't done it and discussing drinking with someone who doesn't really do that either is the curse of this forum"


I read that as an attempt to diminish Marie81's viewpoint on account of her 'lacking credentials'.


If all it takes is to knock one out and have a kid to be the knower of all things children welfare then we've a country full of experts haven't we ?

Marie81's viewpoint was diminished by her extreme judgemental attictude to other people - she not only said they shouldn't be doing it but that those people had actual problems


So based on that, people are (rightly IMO) intolerant of what else she has to say, and it is that which invalidates her opinion

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