E.D.Station controlled parking zone

[buddug]

Thanks for that. So CPZ issue starts at 7.45pm, is that right, or could they bring it forward as they did at the Camberwell CC?

[Huguenot]

Off to pursue your personal attack in public now buddug? ;-)

[buddug]

No, Hugo, just to help see off the goths, visigoths and barbarians at the gate who want to destroy East Dulwich. (By the way, what's the weather like in Singapore today? ;-))

[James Barber]

Hi buddug,

If you want to guarantee not missing anything then I would advise being there from the start at 7pm.

[buddug]

Thanks.

[easytiger]

The majority of people in attendance were against the CPZ proposals this evening and 2 hours were spent on this. One lady (one of the only pro cpz on here?) fought passionately for it, she lives on Derwent.

James Barber voted for option 4 ( CPZ on several streets)

Jonathon Mitchell followed him with option 4.

Rose Shimmel copied them with option 4 then jokingly voted for option 2.

The 5 other councillors couldn't see how CPZ will not be detrimental to the rest of the area and voted option 2, no cpz but make improvements to roads.

A CPZ cannot work was the outcome.

James Barber and his 2 pals have committed political suicide and have lost many votes.

ETA: A big hand to Gsirett and buddug for their brilliant presentations and to all others too.

[fazer71]

We got Number 2

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_lYENdXKR_LA/S6YNZ6QjEFI/AAAAAAAAFFk/S_xZG5TNMMY/s400/turkeys+UKIP+VOTING+FOR+CHRISTMAS.jpg

[citizenED]

I thought the decision was down to Cllr Barrie Hargrove.

[peckhamboy]

It is. But it would surely be career suicide to approve a CPZ in the face of a 65% resident opposition, and majority votes against by the two community councils representing the affected area (including the vote of his own party leader who reputedly said it would be undemocratic to impose a CPZ). If he is still thinking of approving it, maybe he should ask Colin Barrow for his thoughts...

[buddug]

Have just got back from the meeting. A victory for democracy.

However, what was truly astonishing was that James Barber was spinning like a top right up to the end when he voted for option 4. In fact, the figures he quoted about the consultation were so blatantly untrue, he had to be interrupted by several members of the public reminding him and the committee of the actual voting figures.

Because of the way in which he tried to mislead both the audience and his fellow councillors tonight I feel he should stand down tomorrow and apologise to his constituents.

Interestingly, but not surprisingly, he also revealed another side to him. When we broke for refreshments after the vote - and it states in the council's order of business: BREAK AT 9.00 PM Opportunity for residents to talk to Councillors and Officers - he did not show his face in the foyer. I was waiting for him to come out so I could ask him if he was now going to resign, and to explain his behaviour. When it became apparent he wasn't going to appear, I went back into the committee room to seek him out but the meeting had resumed.

James, you are a coward.

[Chener Books]

I listened carefully to Mr Barber.

I could not understand his reasons for not representing his constituents.

John K

[buddug]

Baffling, isn't it?

[Loz]

I have to say that I am disappointed that James chose to vote the way he did. But, on the other hand, one poor decision does not make him a bad councillor (though, given the voter opposition, it arguably makes him a poor politician :)) ) I suspect the sheer weight of opposition to the CPZ made him rather pig-headedly hold his line, rather than be seen to waver.

On balance, though, he is still a force for good around here and I hope that he does not lose too many votes over the issue.

Rose Shimmel sounds like a moron, though. What was she up to in the vote? Was she taking the piss?

[buddug]

By the way, easy tiger, thanks for your praise, but it's undeserved, sadly. It wasn't me who made the presentation, although I did heckle enthusiastically!

And Loz, Barrie Hargroves amazingly said he would abide by the committee's vote. So it's all over, until the next time this topic rears its ugly head. But hopefully by then its main proponents - Barber, Mitchell and Shimmell - will have sunk without trace.

[easytiger]

Chair Lewis said as both community councils voted no cpz then Hargrove cannot implement this cpz. Chair Lewis Robinson said this tonight.

Buddug, agreed, James spins and lies and should resign.

[first mate]

I was shocked by James tonight, it is one thing to bravely/pig headedly hold one's line in the face of overwhelming opposition, but this was something else.... a unique perspective on the figures.

I would also like to thank Giles Sirett, Max Sharp (hope I got the name right) and Gill (?) who all did a sterling job.

[Bobby P]

I attended the Council meeting, and it was tense and passionate, with deputations both against the CPZ and (in the case of Derwent Grove residents) for it.

After the vote, we did indeed hear from the Councillors that Barrie Hargrove had committed to abide by the vote of the two Community Councils. As both Camberwell and Dulwich voted "No", that should indeed be an end to the matter (for now).

Assuming no turnarounds, this is indeed a victory for local democracy, thanks in no small part the the extremely hard work by some residents, such as Giles, who - should he ever decide to stand for local councillor himself (!!) would I'm sure find a lot support from grateful residents.

One final word: I did feel sorry for the Derwent Grove delegation, who put a passionate case for a CPZ on their road (alone). While I still think this would never work as they hoped, and it is certain that displacement would then move any problem to the neighbouring streets, we were invited tonight to consider other ways to alleviate their parking issues. If commuters ARE the problem on Derwent (though one does wonder why commuters are not a problem on Elsie, who were vehemently against the CPZ), then perhaps rather than a CPZ, the Council could consider simply putting up some "No Commuters" signs on the road, or some similar wording. While I'm not sure such a thing exists, knowing how people fret over "official" signs (and the fact that they may get ticketed/clamped/towed), surely even if it were not policed or enforced, it would in fact deter any actual commuters nervous of retribution. If, as I suspect, the problem is not commuters, but (as on Elsie) the sheer number of residents' and local business' cars, then it would have little effect, but then neither would a CPZ...

The other long term suggestion of investigating creating actual paid carparks (Sainsbury's, the Hospital site) should also be looked at. Any commuters that do exist, and some shoppers, would very likely happily pay a small parking fee (if it were not too much) for guaranteed parking rather than driving round congested streets looking for the elusive "free" space, and this might just make that essential modicum of difference to the residents of said streets.

[monica]

And I am going to vote get the keys to the community notice board off JB, for taking down the posters re the CPZ consultation. There are 2 guardians who hold keys to those notice boards, on Northcross Rd and by the station. Mr Barber and myself, poor show all round, JB!!! >:D

[Loz]

And a big cheer for the EDF. Without the forum, you can bet there would have been no way to get the groundswell of opposition together at such short notice.

Just shows what a valuable resource this place is.

[northlondoner]

What Loz said

[first mate]

Yes, big cheer for EDF. I was wondering if it could be nominated for a Southwark civic award/ or has this already been done?

Without the EDF we may not had the result we got tonight.

[helena handbasket]

buddug Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> No, Hugo, just to help see off the goths,

> visigoths and barbarians at the gate who want to

> destroy East Dulwich. (By the way, what's the

> weather like in Singapore today? ;-))

You did it! You won! *pumps fist in air*

Woo hoo! CHAMP!

Now you get to .......erm, what did you win again?

Anyway, now what will you do with all of your time?

[gsirett]

I took a number of things away from tonight:

1. I really do empathise with the people sat behind me from Derwent Grove. I understand that parking is a huge issue for them. If, for any moment, I thought any of the CPZ options proposed would sort their problems out I would have thought twice about saying my piece tonight. For me, Helen Hayes (one of the councillors) was the best speaker of the night. She summed it up perfectly ?We cant?t keep everybody happy on this issue.... we know you?ve got problems, but a CPZ is going to cause more/ problems for more people elsewhere.?

2. Southwark?s engagement with its people on this subject has been AWFUL. The ?magic out of the air? 1/3/7 Road options ? hmmmm . Tonight?s meeting can be put down as a victory for democracy but, really, should it have to come down to a 19th century husting to gauge public opinion? Surely they can manage something a bit more scientific. I?ve heard that people can do these things by telephone now we?re in the 20th century. IMO, if the agenda hadn?t been firmly set from the beginning (lets do everything we can to shoehorn a CPZ in) then they may well have considered some form of better engagement

3. The chairman, Clr Robinson, did an excellent job in difficult circumstances

4.

Lets save the best until last, the holy trilogy:

Councillor James Barber

Councillor Rosie Shimmel

Councillor Jonathan Mitchell

The 3 Lib Dem, block-voting, amigos

Shame on all 3 of you. You are an absolute disgrace. You are a disgrace to the people who voted for you. You are a disgrace to the party that calls itself ?Liberal? and ?Democrat?. You showed neither of those traits tonight.

As predicted the 3 Lib-Dem councillors decided what is right for their constituents without LISTENING to their constututants.

James Barber: I?ve learnt to expect him to do anything he can to get a CPZ in, but to sit in front of a council meeting (consultation report in hand) and claim ?it?s 50/50?. Sorry, but that?s enough James, you made yourself look VERY silly.

But the other two? ? James? little lap dogs:

Cllr Mitchell seemed to be saying that he was being weally weally bwave (ignoring his voters) and that he knew better than those dammed plebs form East Dulwich.

Ms Shimmel seemed to stick her hand up to anything (as long as it didn?t counter their dear leader, St James)

I have said (on numerous occasions now) I respect the hard work of councillors. They volunteer, and are a key part of local democracy. I certainly wouldn?t fancy 10 emails about dog poo on a Monday morning. But these 3 people have blatantly tried to stamp on local democracy. They have gerrymandered. They have put their national party politics over their voters wishes. For that, they should be ashamed of themselves. There is no excuse for their behaviour and I will not apologise for that opinion

James Barber has lost any respect that I once had of him. I know many have come out in his defence ?hard working?, ?he engages? but IMO this man is on HIS own agenda only . People will call names for this post. I don?t care. These people do not deserve public office. Deep down, they REALLY seek to mould the world into their own vision.They are a disgrace.

I am not strongly party-political: but I have seen 3 the Lib-Dem politicians tonight block-vote and act in blatant disregard of THEIR voters wishes. I, for one, will not be voting lib-dem again.

Shame on all 3 of them.

[buddug]

Shame on them indeed. What was particularly galling was to see the constant grin on James's face even while he was being held to account from the floor for lying about the figures. I for one find their total disregard for democracy sinister. Have the LibDems morphed into Marxists, just like New Labour did under Tony Bliar?

[Mscrawthew]

I would also like to thank everyone involved (against the CPZ)for all their hard work. Much was acheived in a very short space of time and this is a victory for people power. It`s a pity that James and Co couldn`t listen to the many people who voted for them. Another 3 votes lost from this household for anything to do with the Lib Dems. They have behaved disgracefully.