Dummy advice needed...

[jennyh]

Hi

My 14 week old is seemingly more addicted to her dummy than ever. I was quite happy for her to have it to settle before a sleep from abot 4 weeks and often she refused it when she wasn't fussed. She never has it when she is awake and happy, only when she needs to sleep and I always managed to whip it out as soon as she fell asleep. I'm happy for her to have it but last night we had a horrendous night where suddenly she was waking hourly and only the dummy would settle her, then it would fall out and the whole thing would start again. previously we have had to give it to her a bit in the evening when she woke but never during the night. There is no way that I can manage if i'm going in every 15 minutes to put it back in again, also she cant get into a deep sleep and so is crabby and tired today.

Does anyone have experience of their babies becomming more reliant on the dummy and did they grow out of it? did it stop waking them up when it fell out or did it get to a point where they could put it back in themselves? If it isn't going to change then I think I will have to look at how to wean her off it but I don't want to resort to controlled crying yet, but that seems the only option as she cries without it. We have tried sushing and patting her but it doesn't seem to get us anywhere, I am not going to start picking her up to settle her as we have only just started to put her down awake.

Im shattered!!! She woke around 6 times in the night, i reckon i'm working on about 4 hours broken sleep. Boo :(

[Belle]

I think it's a stage they all go through with the dummy, then they figure out how to find it/keep it in. I kind of gave up on the removing after sleep thing and just let it be, and it was fine. We weaned off at 15/16 months because the waking for it did start again - and by that age he was well capable of finding it so I felt it was kind of an excuse to wake up in the night, and better removed. But at such a young age I wouldn't try weaning off - if it's giving comfort, it can't be a bad thing.

[jennyh]

Thanks Belle. That is my thinking, I like that she has the comfort from it but just need to know there is light at the end of the tunnel if I leave her with it. Have visions of weeks and weeks of having to go in throughout the night. Do you think she will def get to a point where she can keep it in? Sometimes she is fine and will take it and hang onto it for 90 minutes, other times she is more unsettled in the middle of the night and can spit it out 15 times in a row, other times she drops it after 5 mins and can stay asleep for hours without it. Just tired today and felt a bit miserable that this is a new phase and a bit pessimistic about how long it will last!

Can I ask - did you find it relatively straight forward to get rid of it when you did?

[Belle]

Yes was straightforward when we did it - got advice on here! It was a hellish first night of about 40 mins crying - th en just 5-10 the second night and 0 the third. He was older though so I didn't feel so mean doing it! He had got to the stage before he was 1 of just having it whenever he wanted, so we cut it down to just sleepy times at about 1, so in a way the sleep associated bit was just the second half of the battle. Would do it that way again. In fact if next baby doesn't have same waking issues at 15/16 mths wouldn't be in a rush to get rid of it.

I wonder if she's waking for any other reason? She's not hungry/feeling ill? I know my son was a bit take it/leave it up till about 8 mths or so. If it's just dummy related it won't last, they do figure it out! I know Gina and other baby experts say to remove it once they're asleep but I personally wouldn't bother.

[jennyh]

I think it is just the dummy or perhaps a bit of attention/habit. we're just going to have to get on with it and try and nap between dummy demands!

[Fuschia]

Is there not an increased risk of SIDS if you introduce a dummy then remove it prematurely?

[Belle]

Don 't know. Do know that there was some evidence dummies are a factor in preventing SIDS (perhaps because they remind the baby to breathe) which I found quite comforting. I think removing at over 1 is ok - depends what you class as premature I guess.

[jennyh]

yes i believe that there is, something to do with them using it to regulate their breathing. But then not sure how that works if it just falls out anyway. I am happy for her to have it but I just need to know whether this is a phase or will she wake on the hour forever! :)

[Fuschia]

4 month old babies start to wake more often anyway, sleep patterns change as the brain develops

[Ruth_Baldock]

We are currently going through this with our 17mo old, so sympathies! I am loathe to wean him off the dummy because 1) Want to use it on a flight soon and 2) Don't want to rock the boat so close to his sister arriving.

I believe I have also heard that about breathing/removal of dummy and SIDS before too...we never removed it (couldn't be bothered)

[prdarling]

I had one of each. My first son was obsessed and would put it in any moment he could but always slept so soundly that when it fell out he didn't notice but as soon as was able he would put it back in if he stirred in the night. We got rid of it just afetr he was one in the same way as Belle - 45 mins crying the first night, 20 mins the second and nothing the third. The reason I wanted to get rid of it was I saw the battle my sister had with her son who was about three and it just wasn't worth it :)

My second son quite liked it but at around 14 weeks started going mental whenever it fell out of his mouth so I got rid of it completely because with a 3 months old and a 21 month old I just couldn't function on no sleep. We just found a way around it by shush patting him, feeding him till he was fairly drowsy and then putting him down etc and to be honest after about one night and one nap he didn't even notice anymore

Good luck with whatever you decide, it's a stressful thing :(

[Belle]

I think it was your advice I took when weaning my then 16 mth old off his, PR Darling! and it worked, so thankyou.

[Ruth_Baldock]

Belle and PRdarling: did you literally just put baby down w/o dummy and that was that? Or is ther some kind of secret technique involved? Seb mad keen on his, just asked for it from his dad during bath "dooma dada? Plis? Dada plis?" errr, no. Will be weaning him off it when baby sister is about 3 mo I think... Would do it sooner if I could...

[Belle]

yes literally cold turkey. It was hell the first night but I'd been prewarned on here about that, I think I'd just got to caving in point when it stopped. I may have misremembered the amounts of time he cried each night but I def remember it only took 3 nights and even then it was only 'bad' the first night. Can't remember how we managed with naps tho. I really couldn't believe how quickly we did it as he was a dummy addict. The cutting it out during the day (ie non sleep times) was when he was a bit younger, and did result in a few tantrums but we just rode it out - my husband actually initiated that one and was much stronger than me. I think we brought it back when he was ill and when he had his grommets done (this was pre full cold turkey). I wouldn't worry about being in a rush to do it - I do sometimes still miss its calming qualities! It was simply that post grommets his sleep didn't improve immediately and we figured out that he was almost using the dummy as a prop to get us to come when he'd lost it. Somehow without that his sleep improved.

[jennyh]

Its really hard, on the one hand she gets great comfort from it, on the other hand i get no sleep as she is going through this stage of demanding it throughout the night. Call me selfish but I just cant exist on 4 hours of broken sleep even if it does make her happy!! Also, she is getting poor sleep as i dont think she ever really enters a deep sleep.

I do hope that it is just a phase that passes. Im fearing the nights again! She went down at 7pm and have already been in 3 times to put it back in...I find if I take it out slowly myself and shush her then she often doesnt notice so much, if it falls out then she realises. Dunno, I know you shouldnt really remove prematurely, just knackered myself and need some respite!

[Fuschia]

jennyh Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>Also, she is getting poor

> sleep as i dont think she ever really enters a

> deep sleep.

Babies have different sleep patterns and needs than adults and it's likely the short sleep cycles have something to do with the processing of so much information, as well as being protective against SIDS

You can't really expect a baby to have adult sleep patterns, I'm afraid..

My understanding is that initially a newborn will fall into deep sleep without entering light sleep, but from 3/4m this ends and changes to the way the brain functions means that they start to sleep much more lightly (hence often requiring more parental intervention)

Sorry to be the bringer of bad news

[Fuschia]

Article here on science of sleep

http://www.parentingscience.com/baby-sleep-patterns.html

[alieh]

Jenny, what did you end up doing about this? The exact same thing has started happening here at the exact same age! Unfortunately it is the latter half of the night that is the problem. Constant waking even every 15 minutes. Night 4 of virtually no sleep for me after 12 or 1 am and I'm exhausted. I thought he might be hungry but he doesn't seem that interested - few sucks then back to sleep for 20 mins or so and the the shifting grunting and little cries start to escalate! The same thing is now happening when he wakes from a nap at exactly 45 mins, when I used to be able to just pop the dummy in to get another 45 mins.

If I remember, this happened with my older son but not until 5 or 6 months. We ditched his dummy then.

I think the dummy might have to go as I can't survive on 2 hours sleep for much longer!

[jennyh]

HIya

I got rid of the dummy in the end. I got some advice from the FSIDS charity about removal of a dummy and they went through other factors with me and agreed that it wouldnt be wise to keep the dummy if it was causing both of us to lose out on so much sleep, she was really struggling and was exhausted during the day and I wasn't much better.

We went cold turkey last Friday and she hasn't had it since. Things have been going ok so far but she is still missing it and sucking on anything and everything she can lay her hands on, but then I think that she isat that stage. She is learning to go to sleep on her own and has been doing quite well albeit with the odd tricky time here and there. I find that night-times are much easier actually, I think her bodyclock knows its night so she finds it more natural to sleep whereas the naps are a nightmare if i'm honest. Where she sleeps for the first 45 mins (1st sleep cycle) she now refuses to go back to sleep even though she needs more, previously the dummy would send her off again!

She has however slept through the night (with a dreamfeed at 11) for the past 5 nights, a complete turn around from what we had before.

i do look at her sometimes and feel so mean taking away her comfort but I try to give her more cuddles etc and she sucks on my finger every so often. She was pretty much rejecting it herself as she spat it out so much.

To sum up - we are getting there but every day and night is still a struggle, although no more so than when she had the dummy and she is happier during the day as she sleeps well at night.

Good luck!

[alieh]

Thanks for the quick reply! I think we'll have to go down the same route. I am having some luck extending naps by popping him in the sling after 45 mins, if you wanted to try that. May create another problem but one thing at a time. Bracing myself for night 1 no dummy tonight.

[jennyh]

Yes I've tried all sorts to help the daytime nap, not the sling though. I tend to either take her out in the pram and wamder aimlessly round the park for hours or I go into the room when I anticipate she could start to wake and I put on her lullaby and slumber bear in the hope the familiar sounds will keep her in a sleepy state, occasionally buys me an extra 10 mins. I hate to say it but if she has a cry then she often drops off again for another 30 mins or so. And also picking her up and rocking her in my arms can send her off on me whilst I sit pinned to the sofa.

Good luck tonight, I'm still struggling to be honest and whilst lots of people found their babies got over it quickly..mine still remembers and make her dummy rooting face but thinks its improving! Just gearing up for the growth spurt now! Feeling good that she is able to go to sleep on her own though, despite all the tears!!!

[sillywoman]

My niece had a dummy until she was - shock-horror - five! My sister told her well in advance, I think she started preparing her at 4, that the dummy fairy was going to come the night of her 5th birthday and take them away because big girls don't have dummies (she'd started school by then & was aware that a dummy was only a 'home' thing).

The actual birthday night my niece & sister pegged the dummies in a pretty bag on the washing line with a note & lo-&-behold, the next day the fairy had been and collected them. She also left a small 'Thankyou' gift for my niece and a short letter. No tears, no fuss.

So if your little one is really finding it too painful to give up their dummy, or it just isn't the right time for you to do it yet, don't lose heart. They don't have to give it up so young. To paraphrase a well known RSPCS advert; A dummy is for babyhood, not for life. :))

[alieh]

Yes, I have no issue with dummies in theory and would be very happy for him to keep it but not up for 15 replugs through the night! The first night has gone well but I think the daytime will be harder.

[alieh]

Just an update, in case anyone encounters this same problem. We ditched the dummy at 15 weeks as it seemed to be causing more trouble than helping. It has gone surprisingly well! I remember the dummy weaning with my older son (at 6 months) involved alot of screaming and desperately comforting in other ways but this has been much easier. I just use the sling and buggy in the day and I've developed a patented shh/pat technique in the Amby hammock where I hit his bottom from underneath the mattress and shush very loudly (whatever works!).

He is also trying much harder to suck his fingers while he is awake since the dummy has gone, which would be good for self soothing eventually (I'll deal with orthodontic bills later and enjoy the sweet sweet sleep until then!).