St Anthony's Primary School extension

[Jamma]

Received a letter from Southwark Council about this at the weekend. (Looking at the documents it seems local residents were only consulted at the prompt of James Barber). They want to extend the school a bit to take in more pupils which seems fair enough given the huge numbers of primary school pupils in the area. However, currently it's traffic chaos most school mornings as people don't so much park as abandon their cars in a higgledy-piggledy fashion down the street. (The lack of consideration in their 'parking' seems a poor example to set their kids but that's another issue).

So I'm not against the extension but I feel strongly that the application must address the traffic issues, for example by having clear proposals for more walking buses or much more parking for bicycles etc. I suggest others in the vicinity do the same

[ClareC]

Given the issues locally re school places, surely it would make more sense to extend a local school that takes all children regardless of faith.....

This Would (in theory) avoid parking issues too since attendance would be limited to those in walking distance, although accept there will always be some children being driven to school given moving house etc

[dollydaydream]

To Clarec

Why shouldn't St. Anthony's school be extended to take catholic children, this will free up places in non faith schools.

The School was built in the early sixties and now needs alot of work, the school is 1 1/2 form entry, with 4 portakabin classes in the two play grounds, from reception to year 6 this will provide an extra 60 places in total. St Anthony's is vastly oversubscribed (as all the schools in East Dulwich) but will free up other school places in local state schools i.e Goodrich and Heber, alot of the children have siblings at the school so would be going to school anyway. This extension is well overdue.

[ClareC]

But what is the catchment area? Ie would this free places for ED children or children out of the area thus not helping the problem in ED at all?

If the pupils do all live in a small catchment area around the school itself why is there such an issue with cars and parking?

I don't know the answers and have nothing against faith schools, just am aware there are major shortages of school places in ED, if a faith school that awards 100% of places to children of that faith is extended, surely their catchment area widens and subsequently doesn't actually benefit the area as a whole... Hence the observation another school being extended may be more likely to reduce the problem.

[dollydaydream]

St Anthony's like other local schools does not have a catchment as such, but like other schools people move closer to the school of their choice, the school as the same selection criteria as other schools apart from the commitment to the faith i.e Baptism and weekly mass attendence, amongst other things, looked after children and siblings, at the moment there are 45 places and if 100 children apply then selection is made after everything else considered is down to distance. Goodrich and Heber schools yearly intake is larger than St. Anthony's I think they are minimum 2 form entry if not 3.

As for the parking issues, I expect parents drop off their children and then drive on to work, St. Anthony's School as to contend with the bendy bus terminating on the triangle and the no40 bus terminating almost outside the school entrance, Goodwich and Heber school as priority lanes and lollipop people to safely cross their children and not a bus insight! At the moment there is no parking at the top of Friern Rd due to road works which narrows down parking places. Most of the parents park sensibly.

[Jamma]

This thread is about a planning application not the school or its admissions policy. I have no idea why the moderator has moved it from the Gen Issues page to the family room.

[Jamma]

-- moved topic --

[LadyDeliah]

Sorry, dollydaydream, but most of the parents do not park sensibly. I live very close to St Anthony's and it is very dangerous for me if I leave my house on my bike when the parents are dropping off their kids.

The buses are obviously a problem for excessive amounts of cars trying to get through or park, but they drive and park in a way that you expect and are not an issue for me as a resident. I think increasing the size of the school and in effect widening the catchment area for St Anthoy's will make things even worse for residents.

Why were the houses near to St Anthony's not consulted? I have not received anything about this.

[Fuschia]

dollydaydream Wrote:

------------------------------------------------------- . the school entrance,

> Goodwich and Heber school as priority lanes

What do you mean? Heber has a 'priority lane'

What's that ?

[edcase]

I think ClareC has a fair point. But personally I?d go further: I do have something against faith schools. If the school is taking taxpayers? money then the selection criteria should be relevant and appropriate. It should be based on educational needs, proximity to school and siblings. Having the same invisible friends shouldn?t come into it; but when that is the principal joining requirement of the school it inevitably results in a disproportionate number of non-local pupils.

The school-run traffic and anti-social parking will clearly become worse.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Totally agree with edcase. Schools should be secular if publicly funded. The only reason they persist in this day and age is because so many middle class voters are happy to play the 'go-to-mass-as-loop-hole-for-selective-schools' game.

[tomk]

Yawn.

[Jeremy]

I'm going to agree with edcase too.

First of all, specialist faith schools seem likely to have children from a wider geographical area, therefore more cars.

But more importantly, it's plain wrong for a publically funded facility to be available only to those with certain beliefs. Furthermore, I don't think the public should be funding religious indoctrination.

[James Barber]

?5M is a lot of public money. The school needs this level of investment to provide accomodation that we want all children to have. The majority of reception year kids September 2009 when I last had the data came from the surrounding area. Its expansion is likely to see some kids who curreently go to Caprini attending this school and Caprini will probably have a few more local Lewisham kids. So a handful of Southwark and a handful of Lewisham kids will attend more local schools and all the kids get a decent school to learn in.

This planning application is a great chance to get the school to have a modern School Travel Plan as part of the planning conditions. I see many kids already walking but non cycling to this school. But clearly more drive to this school than others.

In the future with the bendy buses going this autumn Eynella Road as some point could be reshaped to deter anti social parental parking.

[Pugwash]

St Anthonys delivered a letter addressed to parents and neighbours re planning ideas. dated 29th March and invited everyone to an open meeting between 4 - 7 pm on 7th April to hear about new plans. It is on creamy yellow paper and was hand delivered in Barry Road and Etherow Street and I think Norcroft Gardens - the area most likely to be affected by the building works.

Daughter now aged 25 went to St. Anthonys from 5 - 11 (they did not have a nursery class then) parents were from the borders with Peckham, Nunhead, Forest Hill and Camberwell as well as Dulwich. Goodrich was not the intake as it is now and Heber at that time was a 'sink school' so many kids who had at least one RC parent were accepted. Hubby is RC and a regular church attender, and our daughter's name was put on the list when she was 2 years old. Eldest child went to Goodrich and had not Goodrich changed their catchment area (we were the wrong side of Barry Road) youngest daughter would have gone there as well.

same problems with parking then as now, but more parents abusive now. The PTA parents took turn in jotting down car regs of poor parkers, those whose numbers frequently appeared had their regs given to the police who would randomly turn up with traffic wardens and issue tickets and warnings.

[James Barber]

The perfect job for Smart car to enforce parking regs...

[Gimme]

At the age of 5 children have no faith (or should not have) as they are not old enough to make up their minds. Not entirely sure why a school will select pupils on the basis of their parents belief.

Anyway, didn't some archbishop say that CoE schools should be opened up to children of all faiths recently? Maybe if that comes to pass, extending St Anthony's will benefit all, not just those whose parents resort to pretending to be churchgoers to get their kids in (see multiple threads on this subject, with parental confessions applenty).

[Fuschia]

St Anthonys is a catholic school. You can't just pretend to be a believer to get your child in!!

[Gimme]

If only a small sector of the community are eligible then the public should object to any extension that uses public money. It also encourages the school run traffic nightmare caused by parents not sending their children to the local school and therefore should be discouraged from that point of view as well.

[Jamma]

There's some interesting points here but I don't think comments to the planners about the pros/cons of Catholic schools will have much impact. I do feel that if enough people raise the travel issue then we can force the school to put in place robust policies to encourage less car use which has got to be good thing for everyone including the school (fitter pupils learn better, less dangerous environment outside the gates etc)

[skyblue]

If the permission isn't given the effect will be that kids that would have gone to St Anthonys will get places in other local schools ie goodrich heber goose green fairlawn and kids that may have got in to those schools won't. There are many unfair selection issues re schools some may think that being able to buy your way into a school because you can afford to live near a good school is just is as bad as believing your way in. (There was a roy brookes leaflet through the door today saying that some one wants to buy a house near heber and is willing to pay 575k for a three bed.) and as for private schools where is the fair in that?

At least believing your way in is open to the less well off too. There is no easy answer and alot of people do actually believe. As for parking that will be a minority of the minority who drive and it needs to be dealt with. I would imagine that it irritates alot of parents from St Anthonys too.

I understand from previous threads that a child at St Anthonys costs the tax payer 10% less than a child at a community school. So secularising these schools will cost.

So if planning isn't given what local school will be able to accommodate these kids? Perhaps we should reconvert all those converted school buildings that the council sold off?

[James Barber]

Partially true skyblue. More likely kids will go to RC School St Francis Caprini and Lewisham kids wont have places to go.

Expanding this school will mean more kids will be able to walk and cycle to school.

[skyblue]

James alot of current St Anthonys kids come from west of Barry road which is too far from Cabrini and in is the heber, gg, St john's micro catchment area there would be a further squeeze on these schools.

[James Barber]

Sky-blue, I think you miss the point that the parents would want their kids to attend an RC school. Also when I was last taken through the admissions many of the kids going to st.Francis Carpini had put it after st anthonys.

[sillywoman]

LOL at your freudian slip James :))