Grove Tavern Public Meeting

[rendelharris]

Sue Wrote:

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> Please please please don't bring back the

> Harvester, it was horrible (in my opinion).

Jeremy Hardy: "Have I been to a Harvester before? You don't suppose anyone ever comes here twice, do you?"

[Bic Basher]

There's a rough sleeper who has made the Lordship Lane side of the Grove Tavern his home. Tarpaulin has covered up the area he's living in which is above the pavement where the old entrance to the bar is.

[lavender27]

Bic Basher Wrote:

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> There's a rough sleeper who has made the Lordship

> Lane side of the Grove Tavern his home. Tarpaulin

> has covered up the area he's living in which is

> above the pavement where the old entrance to the

> bar is.

He used to be the owner, he's guarding his property.

I'd like it to be transformed into a Theatre, acting school, comedy theatre, somewhere to laugh your bloomin' head off. Everyone likes to laugh.

[Applespider]

I wasn't able to make the meeting yesterday. But I would be interested to know what was discussed if anyone on here did go? Or if there are likely to be any follow-up meetings?

[ian adams]

I too wasn't able to go, but would be keen to know what happened. Thanks, someone!!

[rch]

I went along... it was an extremely useful meeting. The Dulwich Society have tweeted scans of the minutes of the meeting on their Twitter account, which I have re-tweeted on my Twitter account, but I'm not sure how to post a link here... my Twitter tag is in my signature, in case someone can figure it out and post a link?

[Mick Mac]

[rch]

Okay, I've managed to save the scan of the Dulwich Society Report as a jpeg, which I've attached to this post, so hopefully you guys can read it directly.

From my own perspective, the most interesting discussion was between an Arts Groups, a music group, and a theatre group that talked about joining forces to create a Dulwich Arts Centre with public meeting rooms, performance spaces, and art galleries with a restaurant/pub on the ground floor.

There was a lot of discussion about creating a community action group in general so that everyone can brainstorm.

Well done to The Dulwich Society for starting to bring everyone together!

Edited to say special thanks to Mick Mac for the above Twitter link.

[Applespider]

Thank you Robin and Mick.

Much appreciated. It?s good to hear people care. The community venue sounds appealing but potentially costly as might be hard for it to pay for itself. How short is the remaining lease mentioned?

I?ll keep an eye out for future events on it.

[Earl Aelfheah]

rch Wrote:

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> From my own perspective, the most interesting

> discussion was between an Arts Groups, a music

> group, and a theatre group that talked about

> joining forces to create a Dulwich Arts Centre

> with public meeting rooms, performance spaces, and

> art galleries with a restaurant/pub on the ground

> floor.

Sounds great.

[Sue]

A Dulwich Arts Centre would be brilliant.

What a great idea.

ETA: Thanks so much for the information.

[ian adams]

These ideas about community use sound great, and an honourable way forward to maintain its traditions (unlike a supermarket). Mixed use seems to be the way forward for financial sustainability, so what about - also - some community office space for charities or social enterprises - Dulwich Helpline are looking for space I gather.

Is anyone collating this and taking it forward??

Ian

[ian adams]

Sorry, it's called LinkAge Southwark now (email: [email protected]). Ian

[RobG]

MORE FLATS!!!

[alice]

Yes more social housing. That?s real community use. You may guess I am fan of Maslow.

[WELSH-NINJA]

RobG Wrote:

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> MORE FLATS!!!

Yes exactly yes

[nxjen]

The Dulwich Society, who organised the meeting, have produced a summary of matters discussed here:

http://dulwichsociety.com

[edhistory]

No mention there that the site is an Archaeological Priority Zone [APZ II].

I'll have to find a larger scale map.

Was the Southwark Archaeologist at the meeting or has this statutory function been left out of the loop?

What's there:

Dr Glennie's

Green Man

Dulwich Spring

Pleasure gardens

Ornamental lake

Faux ancient barrow

[lavender27]

I'd posted on another thread, regarding the resident camping in the cove of TGT , 'he is waiting to get in' turn TGT into a decent (no nonsense) sheltered accommodation home.

[intexasatthe moment]

Just re reading the Dulwich Society report of the meeting .

" The Council should deal with the homeless people who were now using the site."

"The potential for an increase in crime in the area with people camping in the garden"

Were there a number of homeless people there ?

Is the remark about camping in the garden suggesting that IF people camped there might be an increase in crime or

the people camping there might lead to an increase ?

Has there been people camping there ?

[TE44]

Itatm I wondered about this, it seems to be saying being homeless comes with being a criminal or vice versa. Is there a local community group taking action, to press Dulwich estate into action, via social media or press. I'd be interested to know what rent is being paid for this empty building. Does anyone know.

[Jennys]

TE44 Wrote:

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> Itatm I wondered about this, it seems to be saying

> being homeless comes with being a criminal or vice

> versa. Is there a local community group taking

> action, to press Dulwich estate into action, via

> social media or press. I'd be interested to know

> what rent is being paid for this empty building.

> Does anyone know.

The Dulwich Society newsletter for September says

?Grove Tavern Design Charrette: Now that the Half Moon Hotel and the Crown and Greyhound are open, only one pub on the Dulwich Estate remains closed, the Grove Tavern - on the corner of Lordship Lane and Dulwich Common. It has been shut since 2012 following a fire. The tenant, Stonegate, has around 8 years left on its lease and is still paying rent, rumoured to be in the order of ?100,000 per annum and it is now pretty clear that they have no intention of reopening it. The Dulwich Estate did have some discussions with Southwark Planners but they could not agree a way forward and, although the site is identified as a development site in the new draft Southwark Plan, the planners have also said that they want the old pub to remain - impasse! An application to designate the pub as an Asset of Community Value (ACV) was rejected and the site is vacant with the building gradually deteriorating ? a real eyesore at one of the major entrances to Dulwich.?

The Society has obtained some funding from Southwark Council to run a design charrette ? a workshop where local residents and other interested parties can discuss different options for the site ? should it remain as a pub or should it be redeveloped? Hopefully the event will be held in late September or early October, look out for more information in the eNewsletter or on the Society?s website.

[TE44]

Thanks Jenny. I can't understand how stonegate can pay this sort of money, I'm assuming there must be a law holding them to this lease. Who is responsible for the maintenance of this building?

When a building lies empty this length of time and owners are allowed to continue recieving money, any profit outside of any government charges (which I have no idea about) should be given to the community to decide how this money is best spent,

[intexasatthe moment]

Thanks but I'm still not clear on the number of hemeless people that were being cited as at the pub and/or camping .

[Jennys]

Googled the Minutes of the Dulwich Society. So far as I can see the Minutes do not say how many homeless people that those who attended the Meeting believe to be living around the Grove Tavern. The only reference seems to be this

? The Society held a public meeting at the Streatham & Marlborough Cricket Club pavilion on Saturday 4 November. 40 people attended.

Current concerns:

Loss of pub and community benefits.

The deteriorating condition of the building ? unanimous agreement that either the current tenant or the Dulwich Estate should maintain the site properly.

The Council should deal with the homeless people who were now using the site.

The potential for an increase in crime in the area with people camping in the garden.

TfL?s lack of action in moving forward with its promise to improve the junction for pedestrians.?