Curse of gentification

[Robert Poste's Child]

I think it just started much earlier and has a longer planning cycle to it. An elderly neighbour often told me that the village used to have the full range of normal shops where she could do all her shopping. She worked as a cleaner and for the first couple of decades she lived in our road the resident profile seems to have been very different.

[DulwichFox]

The residents of Dulwich Village do not want the nuisance of the restaurants like we have on Lordship Lane.

They are happy to come to East Dulwich for a night out and then return to the serenity of the Village afterwards.

No noise.. traffic.. drunks.. beggars..

A Grand day / night out hey Grommit ?

DulwichFox

[Robert Poste's Child]

And vice versa, no doubt.

[Seabag]

Broco123 Wrote:

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> Louisa - get your sentiment but don't think anyone

> has addressed the fundamental point - if people

> aren't shopping there they won't make money! Also

> not sure why an independent shop run by young

> people (wood fired launderette) is not good but a

> run down old shop is a true independent shop. We

> don't seem to celebrate how ED still has and

> continues to have lots of independents, even if

> they are trendy coffee shops.

It's all about the people. The woodfired launderette lot are new and new is bad.

You can have bad, as long as its old bad, but new good is not good, that's bad. Whereas new bad is silly, like why would you?

Do you follow ?

[DulwichFox]

Gentrification ...

Open a new shop on Lordship Lane or North Cross Road.

To be really specialist-

only open 3 - 4 days a week.. ( Days not specified )

and only for 2 - 3 hours a per day.. (hours not specified)

Special rates on Wednesday.. but not every Wednesday.

Then justify high prices on high rent and rates..

Those paying high rent and rates need to be open as much as possible.

A closed shop does not make money. That's why new businesses fail.

Some people simply do not want to put in the hours.. but expect to get rich in 6 months

Guy at Curry Cabin has been there 45 years since he was 16. still working.

DulwichFox

[Louisa]

I agree with you Foxy.

Not saying all new businesses fail for those reasons, but certainly is a factor. Most of the older businesses where the freehold is presumably owned by the business operating. If that is the case, the overheads will surely be considerably lower than if the building was being rented.

What I love about places like Farmer's, is the way they're just so friendly and make your day a better one. No pretence, just genuinely nice people. I never go in and don't come out with what I need. Useful shops like these are becoming less and less, until we end up with a handful of trinket shops open 2 hours a week.

Louisa.

[JohnL]

Louisa Wrote:

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> until we end up with a handful of

> trinket shops open 2 hours a week.

>

> Louisa.

That's the traditional endgame of gentrification.

Maybe it won't happen everywhere though.

[georgia]

Which shops on Lordship Lane / North Cross Road only open for 2 hours a day, 3-4 days a week? I'm intrigued to know as I have never come across any which are closed apart from when they say they will be closed.

[nxjen]

Some shops are only open say between Wednesday and Sunday but I suspect they are responding to footfall and when there are likely to be the most customers. In fact it probably makes good business sense, rather than incurring expense for opening a shop when there are likely to be few sales.

[ed_pete]

DulwichFox Wrote:

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> Those paying high rent and rates need to be open

> as much as possible.

Perhaps you should impart your business advice to Mr Patel, about who's shop this thread was started and he wouldn't have had to close.

[DulwichFox]

ed_pete Wrote:

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> DulwichFox Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Those paying high rent and rates need to be

> open

> > as much as possible.

>

>

> Perhaps you should impart your business advice to

> Mr Patel, about who's shop this thread was started

> and he wouldn't have had to close.

Mr Patel was a long term business that fell victim to the effects of Gentrification and rent rises.

I'm talking about new Businesses who are aware of the rent and rates when they take on a new business

and still believe they can a go of it by charging the earth because they only want to work as little hours as possible.

Fox

[ed_pete]

I see. Can you quote some examples of actual shops that are run by people like that or is it just your opinion ?

[alex_b]

DulwichFox Wrote:

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>

> Mr Patel was a long term business that fell victim

> to the effects of Gentrification and rent rises.

>

> I'm talking about new Businesses who are aware of

> the rent and rates when they take on a new

> business

> and still believe they can a go of it by charging

> the earth because they only want to work as little

> hours as possible.

You suspect the principal cause was gentrification. I'd suggest that it might also have something to do with a declining demand for newsagents, two similar stores within 2 minutes walk and a Tesco Metros a few minutes further. I'm sure the increased affluence in the area has pushed up rates (because freehold values have risen) but I doubt that's the only cause of the closure.

As for the new shops, I can't think of any shops on Bellenden with restricted opening hours. There was/is a fire shop off Lordship Lane with short opening hours, but that's because he does the fireplace fitting during the week. If shops really are opening with short hours and high rents then going bust, eventually people will stop trying and rents will fall again. But again I don't see any evidence of that in Bellenden, care to name any specifics?

[peterstorm1985]

Louisa Wrote:

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>

> What I love about places like Farmer's, is the way

> they're just so friendly and make your day a

> better one. No pretence, just genuinely nice

> people. I never go in and don't come out with what

> I need. Useful shops like these are becoming less

> and less, until we end up with a handful of

> trinket shops open 2 hours a week.

Farmers is a great shop because it has kept up with gentrification and stocks what the new residents want as much as the old. Dulwich DIY is the same. The only shop that I miss is the garden centre but I believe they owned the building so no one can blame gentrification for their demise. I can't think of any shops that only open a few hours, or perhaps they only open when I want them to be open, which is OK by me.

[DulwichFox]

I use both AJ Farmers and Dulwich DIY on a regular basis.

Probably the two most useful shops on Lordship Lane. Both within walking distance.

What I like about Dulwich DIY. You can always find that little Spring.. washer .. nut .. bolt that

you don't know what its called.. A Thing-ummy-bob

DulwichFox

[Seabag]

Next you'll be attributing the demise of the chip shop behind the old police station to gentrification.

"Oh yeah, even tho it didn't actually sell chips or fish, or open, it was them gentrified lot came along and put him right out'a bizness"

[maxxi]

Still waiting for an answer to the question which shops only open "2-3 hours a day 3-4 days a week"

[Louisa]

Yes Dulwich DIY has a decent selection of bits you might struggle to get elsewhere. Very handy shop and they open for long hours, you can't go wrong with them. The same goes for Farmers, everything you need is on the shelf, and it's not overpriced. These places survive because they buck the trend of gentrification. They don't have to open for an hour a month relying on the sale of one pricey object. All the great charity shops are a addition to the neighbourhood too.

Maxxi why do we have to name specific shops which only operate a few hours a week? There's plenty of them out there, have a look yourself! As JohnL says, it's the end game of gentrification. It won't be long before LL is a struggle to buy a newspaper and a lottery ticket, as all the newsagents are disappearing.

Louisa.

[maxxi]

> Maxxi why do we have to name specific shops which

> only operate a few hours a week? There's plenty of

> them out there,

>

> Louisa.

So do me a favor and name three or be branded a liar

[Penguin68]

Actually, the types of shops that have odd or eccentric opening hours are antique and second hand furniture shops - often of a very un-gentrified nature and operated by people either as hobbies or by people who are otherwise at sales or fairs or out buying. There used to be a number in LL - now all overtaken by regularly open 'gentrified' outlets. It is gentrification and rising rents/ rates which tend to drive these occasional outlets away.

[Abe_froeman]

That Spanish Tapas restaurant / cafe on north Cross Road was only ever open at very random intervals/. Sometimes it would be closed for months on end.

I don't remember the fruit shop being open all the time either.

[nxjen]

Abe_froeman Wrote:

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> That Spanish Tapas restaurant / cafe on north

> Cross Road was only ever open at very random

> intervals/. Sometimes it would be closed for

> months on end.

>

> I don't remember the fruit shop being open all the

> time either.

Towards the end, the fruit and veg shop, Pretty's, opened very intermittently but I think there were a lot of problems. Before that time, it opened regularly.

[Sue]

Abe_froeman Wrote:

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> That Spanish Tapas restaurant / cafe on north

> Cross Road was only ever open at very random

> intervals/. Sometimes it would be closed for

> months on end.

>

> I don't remember the fruit shop being open all the

> time either.

The Spanish place never properly got off the ground.

The fruit shop was open regularly until there were problems with a new landlady, if memory serves.

ETA: In neither case was there a deliberate policy to only open erratic hours.

I can however think of two examples. One was Jacks, the cafe in Pellatt Road - long gone. The other is the newish crepe place in North Cross Road, which seems to be more closed than open and I can't imagine is going to last long, though I hope I'm proved wrong.

[Mark]

There was me thinking this thread was about handlebar moustached gentlemen taking over the area, but no, it's gentrification:

"the process of renovating and improving a house or district so that it conforms to middle-class taste"

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/gentrification

renovating and improving = good

conforming to middle-class taste = not sure what middle class taste is but I wonder if there's one or two people on here willing to enlighten the rest of us ...

[rupert james]

It was about the closure of a newsagent that existed for 35 years and saying goodbye.